Interesting discoveries

[counterfit zx10r]

Started rebuilding the motor on my 04 zx10r and the deeper I got, the more secrets started showing up. Brought it to the dealer I work for and showed the mechanic and he started pointing out places where you could see that someone has been through the motor before doing some work to it. Pretty strange considering I bough it as a demo bike in early 2005 with only 26 miles on it yet it was classified as a used bike with no warrenty but new because it didn't have any pervious owners. Some of the major finds were an already ported head, degreed cam shafts set in the adjustable slot a not the stock holes and engraving marks on the connecting rods. Best we can figure is that this was a test bike from Kawasaki for the magazines that they did a little extra work on to get the dyno numbers up and get better reviews. Either way I got an even better deal on the bike then I ever could have imagined, not only was it a few grand below msrp but was tweaked a bit by the factory kawasaki tech. Can't wait to get back on it now with high comp. pistons and racing cams ontop of everything else. As soon as it's all back together and dyno tuned, I'll post the dyno sheet. Can't wait to get this fire breathing monster back together.

[konichd]

What are you doin' to that motor?

Nice find by the way, you saved 2G's in motor work for sure!

[counterfit zx10r]

Mainly doing all new crank and rod bearings (since it's all apart anyway) wiseco 13.5:1 pistons and the kawi race cams.

[konichd]

Thin headgasket?

[Tipys]

if will all could only be this lucky

[counterfit zx10r]

The wiseco kit said to use the OEM headgasket so I'm guessing with the domed pistons a thin head gasket would put them too close.

[konichd]

Stock crank? :) Block off plates?

This thing is going to turn the earth isn't it?

[counterfit zx10r]

yep, stock crank and I did get some block off plates. Trying to think of what else I should do to this bad boy while it's all apart.

[Shortcake]

TRE timing adjustor?

[Bashed]

Some of the major finds were an already ported head, degreed cam shafts set in the adjustable slot a not the stock holes and engraving marks on the connecting rods. Best we can figure is that this was a test bike from Kawasaki for the magazines that they did a little extra work on to get the dyno numbers up and get better reviews. Either way I got an even better deal on the bike then I ever could have imagined, not only was it a few grand below msrp but was tweaked a bit by the factory kawasaki tech.


This kind of deception onlys hurts all the other consumers of thier products.Unfortunently this is the way the world works now, with lies and slight of hand.Gone are the days when a mans word and handshake means something.Do what I say, not what I do, Yada, Yada.
Shame on these companies and individuals.
I see it everyday, but when someone calls them on it they are the bad guy.
Its all bullshit....

[counterfit zx10r]

She's all back together, tomorrow, no matter how cold (unless it's snowing) she's comming out of the apartment and getting some fresh air. Next upgrades will be an akro full exhaust, probably evo 1 but still thinking about the evo 2, and the power commander timing module. Added a couple pics from the build, all the disassembaly was done in my garage and all the reassembely was done in my nice warm apartment.

[Mac020]

This kind of deception onlys hurts all the other consumers of thier products.Unfortunently this is the way the world works now, with lies and slight of hand.Gone are the days when a mans word and handshake means something.Do what I say, not what I do, Yada, Yada.
Shame on these companies and individuals.
I see it everyday, but when someone calls them on it they are the bad guy.
Its all bullshit....


I agree! Corporate B.S. these days is everywhere! ENRON ain't just a river in Egypt! I guess if everyone cheats it must be ok!

[Slo]

Did you dyno it before you got the work done? Congrats on the nice find btw.

[counterfit zx10r]

The last time it was dynoed I think it ran right around 155-160, they still have all the dyno graphs saved from the last runs so i'll take the best run it had before and put the top run when the mechanic gets it all dialed in again.

[konichd]

Nice work Counter! Are those Gilles rearsets on that bad boy? Let me know how the Dynojet Ignition Timer goes, I need to do that mod to my 10 soon. :)

[counterfit zx10r]

Got it out of my apartment and started but not for long, sounds like it's pinging at idle. Nice thing is she fired up after only turning over about 3 or 4 times. Guessing that even at this altitude, the 13.5:1 wiseco pistons and 91 octane gas won't quite get it now.

[BigE]

Just an FYI, Kawi hand ports all the ZX-10 and ZX-6R's. They have for awhile now.

[Sortarican]

[
.... sounds like it's pinging at idle.... Guessing that even at this altitude, the 13.5:1 wiseco pistons and 91 octane gas won't quite get it now.

Yeah...not exactly a pump gas ride anymore.

BTW,
Was the fat cat doing tech inspect?

[counterfit zx10r]

Yep, the cat was just making sure everything was up to par. Thought I heard about that before but there was more done then just the head, the cams were already degreed and various other little things here and there were different, and all other zx10's came with this weird rubber engine cover that went from the radiator to the back of the cases and mine never had that either.

[Clarkie]

Got it out of my apartment and started but not for long, sounds like it's pinging at idle. Nice thing is she fired up after only turning over about 3 or 4 times. Guessing that even at this altitude, the 13.5:1 wiseco pistons and 91 octane gas won't quite get it now.

errr...... my GSXR doesnt ping on the dyno with 87 octane and it's is around 14:1

[konichd]

^^^This is a Kawi Clarkie, a pure bred race machine that is destined for glory

When are you going to race a Kawi Clarkie? :(

[Clarkie]

well hopefully the 08 ZX10 is as good as they say it is, if it is I might race one in 09 when my contract with Suzuki is up :alien:

[counterfit zx10r]

errr...... my GSXR doesnt ping on the dyno with 87 octane and it's is around 14:1

What kind of mods do you have to get to 14:1? Also, is it tuned to be rich and how is your timing set to not ping wiht only 87?

[Clarkie]

static and cranking compression are two totally different things, it is easier to measure static so that is what more people use, the true way to do it is cranking compression, but it is harder to measure with adjustable cams. if you are worried about your compression, get a gaugue and test it, it may not be as high as you think. for all the compression i run, with the cam timing I use, my cranking compression isnt that high.

Sometimes having too much compression can actually hurt you, sure you gain low end and mid range but you dont get any top end at all. one Team complained that my SS bike was a cheater because their bored and stroked race bike wasnt any faster 3/4 of the way down the straight at Pueblo. i guess gaining 15 bike lengths out of the corner wasnt enough for them :lol:

remember we are at 5000ft, not a lot of bikes will ping up here if built properly, my GSXR is decked (a lot!) and runs a thinner head gasket. going from a stock to kit gasket will raise it by about 0.5 comp ratio, mine is over 14:1 so you can imagine how much is taken off. i also run very little p-h clearance, cant say how little but the pistons dont get any carbon on them

timing is advanced through the Kit ECU map I have, it's a factory map straight from one of the Yosh bikes....

the 07 GSXR doesnt really care where the a/f is, could be 12.6-13.6:1 and it doesnt make a lot of difference, on my 05 SBK if you were off half a point it was huge!

remember that 10% ethanol fuel (which is basically everywhere) is different to pump gas. if your bike makes the most power on pump gas (pre ethanol) at 13.2:1 it will make the most power on 10% blend at around 13.5:1, on race gas (6% oxygenated fuel like U4/4.2) you usually see the most power around 12.8-13.0:1, MR11 is around 13.2:1

the more efficient the head the LESS fuel you need to make power, and the newer bikes (especially the ZX10) have very efficient heads

[Bueller]

How dare you drag this techno-babble into our drama :no:

[Clarkie]

it's ok, these Kawi guys dont understand that kind of talk anyway :lol:

[counterfit zx10r]

Easy now... don't under estimate us kawi guys, I understood everything you said. I did just get back from a test ride (yes, at just after 10pm) and on a cold but dry back tire, it'll start spinning it with no clutch at about 30mph at just opening the throttle steadly to just over half open. Can't wait to get it dyno tuned and for a warm day.

[konichd]

well hopefully the 08 ZX10 is as good as they say it is, if it is I might race one in 09 when my contract with Suzuki is up :alien:

I have a spot in my garage for your poster when you grace Kawi with your presence!:)

[Bueller]

Dude I think you got something stuck in your mouth, you're mumbling

[mayhem]

[quote=konichd;253326]^^^This is a Kawi Clarkie,


so when is he gonna get a real bike??

[UglyDogRacing]

Easy now... don't under estimate us kawi guys, I understood everything you said. I did just get back from a test ride (yes, at just after 10pm) and on a cold but dry back tire, it'll start spinning it with no clutch at about 30mph at just opening the throttle steadly to just over half open. Can't wait to get it dyno tuned and for a warm day.

I'm sure Clarkie would love to Dyno that beast for you...

[Clarkie]

nah, people get upset when their bikes dont make as much in person as they should on the interweb :)

[lovinCO]

the more efficient the head the LESS fuel you need to make power, and the newer bikes (especially the ZX10) have very efficient heads

That's interesting. I remember years back Josh Graham ran dyno run after dyno trying different blends of pump gas and race fuel in his open superbike (could've been a 750/1000 build at the time). The end result was the lower octace was making more power. I didn't understand why, when I was running Nutec at $15/gal. :scream1:

[Clarkie]

lower octane fuel will always make more power as long as there isnt any detonation, the lower the octane the faster the burn speed, with teh short stroke motors nowdays and with insane piston speeds you need the fastest burn you can get to complete combustion properly.

that's one thing i dont like abotu the U4.2, it is high octane compared to Mr9, 10, 11 and U4. Some people say it makes the same power as U4 did, I have seen a difference, maybe not enough to worry about for some people but still a difference

[lovinCO]

:( God, it's been so long I'm not up on the fuels anymore. But now that you bring it up, I remember Josh talking about dropping the octane until it started to detonate. Nutec was the hot thing at the time--but we did have to watch for a bad barrel of fuel. I don't know if people even run that anymore.

[wankel7]

LOL, your're not getting your deposit back...that carpet is screwweedd:)

Neat project man !

[Clarkie]

:( God, it's been so long I'm not up on the fuels anymore. But now that you bring it up, I remember Josh talking about dropping the octane until it started to detonate. Nutec was the hot thing at the time--but we did have to watch for a bad barrel of fuel. I don't know if people even run that anymore.

Nutec had a bad run for a couple of years and basically got run out of town, problems with fuel batches, and their fuel was the first to gum up (but not the last)