Proposed law would ban most CSC threads

[TFOGGuys]

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/05/lawmaker-defends-imprisoning-hostile-bloggers/

[#1Townie]

fucking people.. omg turn off your computer and its over..

[dchd1130]

Wow...interesting times we live in.

[y_merkle]

I say funk over sensitive, cry baby, punk ass, beotches!

Messed up! Very messed up!

[Tipys]

Jim I think that would end up banning all CSC threads. Damn why can't people grow up and learn how to handle there own. Also who the fuck cares what someone thinks of them on the interweb

[303Lurch]

No worries... it's unconstitutional.

The following from this link: http://www.openmarket.org/2009/04/30/censoring-critical-blogs-as-harassment-would-violate-the-first-amendment/ (http://www.openmarket.org/2009/04/30/censoring-critical-blogs-as-harassment-would-violate-the-first-amendment/)

U.C.L.A. Law Professor Eugene Volokh, the author of a First Amendment treatise, has concluded that the bill is unconstitutional. I agree, as I explain here. As a federal appeals court noted in DeJohn v. Temple University (2008), “there is no harassment exception to the First Amendment’s free speech clause.” Speech that causes emotional distress can be protected,as the Supreme Court made clear in barring a lawsuit by Jerry Falwell over an offensive parody.

[Think]

Screw all of you, you suck. Bitches.

[mtnairlover]

First...this is not me trying to make anyone feel guilty for anything. This is just my opinion, and it is a look at the other side, as I often tend to do in certain discussions. It's a way to spark a conversation, I guess.

Ok, so now that I've warned ya...here's the thought...

You all know what it was like growing up, especially when you all were teens. You all know the kind of bullshit behavior you had to deal with from your peers. Maybe some of you were even in on some pretty mean-spirited hurtful behavior toward one or two kids at school, or in your neighborhood. How many of you grew up in a "perfect" household, with loving parents? How many of you grew up feeling like no one gave a rat's ass about you, including your parents...if you had both parents around?

Yes, I want you to dredge up old memories and feelings. Now, remember, we're talking teens here...yes, even adults act like idiots toward one another in cyber-space, but the legislation grew out of the growing problem of cyber-bullying. Note: I read that article and I agree, the legislation isn't written well.

I also wanted to know why such tough legislation has come about. So, I looked up the term "cyber-bullying statistics" and there's an alarming amount of information out there regarding this phenomenon. Do I think people need to grow a pair? Yeah, maybe. Do I think people need to stop taking out their agressions on others? Yes, most definitely.

There are two sides to this and while we might think people need to grow up and get tough, people also need to grow up and stop treating others with such disregard.

I'm sorry if Mommy and Daddy don't love you. I'm sorry if you don't have any self-esteem, whatsoever. But, that is no reason to make others feel as shitty as you do. And yes, I do know that even those who have a good home and a good life have also taken part in bullying.

Yes, a lot of us who have grown up having faced some pretty harsh reality as teens do our best to try and forget the past. But, that doesn't mean that others aren't facing the same shit we faced as kids...or maybe even worse shit now. Do they deserve to be ignored? Is their plight any less real than our own when we were kids?

So, if not that legislation...then what?

As adults...it's up to us to lead by example.

Stories and stats:

The girl who killed herself when she was told the world would be a better place without her in it...http://njlcblog.net/2009/03/12/cyber-bullying-how-cell-phone-and-computer-forensics-help-part-1/

Cyber-bullying in middle schools...http://www.silive.com/news/advance/index.ssf?/base/news/1236686403166000.xml&coll=1

Cyber-bullying stats...http://www.cyberbullying.us/research.php...more graphs at the bottom of the page.

One more...the faces of the victims of cyber-bullying...http://www.makeadifferenceforkids.org/cyberbullying.html

[Gregger]

I saw this on the Off Topic part of NASIOC that I frequent.. That whole subforum would be destroyed!

[#1Townie]

First...this is not me trying to make anyone feel guilty for anything. This is just my opinion, and it is a look at the other side, as I often tend to do in certain discussions. It's a way to spark a conversation, I guess.

Ok, so now that I've warned ya...here's the thought...

You all know what it was like growing up, especially when you all were teens. You all know the kind of bullshit behavior you had to deal with from your peers. Maybe some of you were even in on some pretty mean-spirited hurtful behavior toward one or two kids at school, or in your neighborhood. How many of you grew up in a "perfect" household, with loving parents? How many of you grew up feeling like no one gave a rat's ass about you, including your parents...if you had both parents around?

Yes, I want you to dredge up old memories and feelings. Now, remember, we're talking teens here...yes, even adults act like idiots toward one another in cyber-space, but the legislation grew out of the growing problem of cyber-bullying. Note: I read that article and I agree, the legislation isn't written well.

I also wanted to know why such tough legislation has come about. So, I looked up the term "cyber-bullying statistics" and there's an alarming amount of information out there regarding this phenomenon. Do I think people need to grow a pair? Yeah, maybe. Do I think people need to stop taking out their agressions on others? Yes, most definitely.

There are two sides to this and while we might think people need to grow up and get tough, people also need to grow up and stop treating others with such disregard.

I'm sorry if Mommy and Daddy don't love you. I'm sorry if you don't have any self-esteem, whatsoever. But, that is no reason to make others feel as shitty as you do. And yes, I do know that even those who have a good home and a good life have also taken part in bullying.

Yes, a lot of us who have grown up having faced some pretty harsh reality as teens do our best to try and forget the past. But, that doesn't mean that others aren't facing the same shit we faced as kids...or maybe even worse shit now. Do they deserve to be ignored? Is their plight any less real than our own when we were kids?

So, if not that legislation...then what?

As adults...it's up to us to lead by example.

Stories and stats:

The girl who killed herself when she was told the world would be a better place without her in it...http://njlcblog.net/2009/03/12/cyber-bullying-how-cell-phone-and-computer-forensics-help-part-1/

Cyber-bullying in middle schools...http://www.silive.com/news/advance/index.ssf?/base/news/1236686403166000.xml&coll=1

Cyber-bullying stats...http://www.cyberbullying.us/research.php...more graphs at the bottom of the page.

One more...the faces of the victims of cyber-bullying...http://www.makeadifferenceforkids.org/cyberbullying.html

look realy if there lives are so bad and the parents are so bad how in the hell do the have the web??

the girl that killed herself.. ive had 4 friends kill themselfs by the age 18.. back when the only real web was aol and no one from my area had it.. life sucks thats just the facts.. you cant handle the heat get your ass out the kitchen... fuck being told what i can and cant say to a person on the web..

[kawasakirob]

Screw all of you, you suck. Bitches.

Cyberbully leave me alone. Homo

[Mental]

First...this is not me trying to make anyone feel guilty for anything. This is just my opinion, and it is a look at the other side, as I often tend to do in certain discussions. It's a way to spark a conversation, I guess.

Ok, so now that I've warned ya...here's the thought...

You all know what it was like growing up, especially when you all were teens. You all know the kind of bullshit behavior you had to deal with from your peers. Maybe some of you were even in on some pretty mean-spirited hurtful behavior toward one or two kids at school, or in your neighborhood. How many of you grew up in a "perfect" household, with loving parents? How many of you grew up feeling like no one gave a rat's ass about you, including your parents...if you had both parents around?

Yes, I want you to dredge up old memories and feelings. Now, remember, we're talking teens here...yes, even adults act like idiots toward one another in cyber-space, but the legislation grew out of the growing problem of cyber-bullying. Note: I read that article and I agree, the legislation isn't written well.

I also wanted to know why such tough legislation has come about. So, I looked up the term "cyber-bullying statistics" and there's an alarming amount of information out there regarding this phenomenon. Do I think people need to grow a pair? Yeah, maybe. Do I think people need to stop taking out their agressions on others? Yes, most definitely.

There are two sides to this and while we might think people need to grow up and get tough, people also need to grow up and stop treating others with such disregard.

I'm sorry if Mommy and Daddy don't love you. I'm sorry if you don't have any self-esteem, whatsoever. But, that is no reason to make others feel as shitty as you do. And yes, I do know that even those who have a good home and a good life have also taken part in bullying.

Yes, a lot of us who have grown up having faced some pretty harsh reality as teens do our best to try and forget the past. But, that doesn't mean that others aren't facing the same shit we faced as kids...or maybe even worse shit now. Do they deserve to be ignored? Is their plight any less real than our own when we were kids?

So, if not that legislation...then what?

As adults...it's up to us to lead by example.

Stories and stats:

The girl who killed herself when she was told the world would be a better place without her in it...http://njlcblog.net/2009/03/12/cyber-bullying-how-cell-phone-and-computer-forensics-help-part-1/

Cyber-bullying in middle schools...http://www.silive.com/news/advance/index.ssf?/base/news/1236686403166000.xml&coll=1

Cyber-bullying stats...http://www.cyberbullying.us/research.php...more graphs at the bottom of the page.

One more...the faces of the victims of cyber-bullying...http://www.makeadifferenceforkids.org/cyberbullying.html

Normally I am with ya, but this time I gotta disagree.

Lets say everything you posted is right, and they do pass this bill. Now, if I, as a bully, cyber or otherwise, decide to not use electronic means to "severe, hostile, and repeated" attempts to tell you are worthless and should kill yourself. Suppose I write this down by hand. Suppose I get three dozen of my buddies to do it and it works, you decide you are worthless and take your own life. Then what?

Nothing.

Now, lets take a step back from this, you use electronic means to convince eberyone I'm gay and have syphillis, and it works. But under this new legislation, you now get in trouble and off you go to jail. Does everyone stop believing I am gay and have syphillis? Nope

Take the exact above scenario, and remove the electronic means. The popular kid tells everyone a story that Becky is a slut. They tell 10 peaple who tell 10, etc. Welcome to my high school. Yeah, we had a few folks crack, change schools, or accepted their new role.

By isolating the means of communication, you are not removing the evil tendacies of the inexperinced with power. I.E the popular kids who suddenly find themselves able to manipulate others simply by telling a story.

If I went to my parents with the complaint that all the kids are telling stories about me, they would have told me to rise above it. Easy, no. Right, yeah pretty much.

The means of transmission changes nothing, and the very notion of the goverment getting involved will not eliminate cyber bullying the same way the priciple could not eliminate regular bullying.

Finally, who gets to decide? Recently Wanda Sykes stated (correctly) that she hopes Rush Limbaughs kidneys fail (me too). If she wrote that in a blog she could go to jail, but is allowed to say it in public.

But that quote gets transmitted electronically, and then what? Then you can't say anything, becuase it becomes translated electronically and the very last grasp of what is left of our basic American rights and freedoms so many have fought for are gone.

But its will be OK, becuase we did it for the children.

Harden up. It was the right advice when my parents told me, and its the right advice when it comes across a 2 dimesional screen. You are right in so much as people do need to grow up and stop treating others with such disregard. I don't need a law to tell me that, no one does.

But let me say this, and it might be hate speech. The rights of an American citzen are more important than the loss of one 18 year old girl. As tragic as it might be, you cannot place the life of a misguided vunerable teen above the most basic tenant of our free society, freedom of speech.

[Snowman]

Ok so who here wasn’t bullied at least once during grade school by someone trying to take your lunch money?

How is this any different?

[mtnairlover]

Harden up. .... As tragic as it might be, you cannot place the life of a misguided vulnerable teen above the most basic tenant of our free society, freedom of speech.


I'm just quoting a couple of things, because my main message was missed in all of what you said.

You misread what I had said...that's all. I don't believe in the bill. I don't believe legislation will help in this matter, not this kind of legislation. I'm troubled though, by the stats, especially the stats on suicide because of cyber-bullying being greater than suicide for other reasons.

I would like to know what, if anything, could be done.

I am not that much of a softy, or a bleeding-heart. I do agree...kids need to toughen up (it's part of life)...I also firmly believe in the idea of "it takes a village". I've stepped in when it was necessary before, as an adult, to help kids out and no one ever told me I was wrong for doing so...actually got thanked...and I'd do it over and over again, when necessary.

Kids only repeat what they see and hear. That's how they grow...good or bad...it is what it is. We are the ones who teach them (all of us)...don't ever doubt that.

[Mental]

I'm just quoting a couple of things, because my main message was missed in all of what you said.

You misread what I had said...that's all. I don't believe in the bill. I don't believe legislation will help in this matter, not this kind of legislation. I'm troubled though, by the stats, especially the stats on suicide because of cyber-bullying being greater than suicide for other reasons.

I would like to know what, if anything, could be done.

I am not that much of a softy, or a bleeding-heart. I do agree...kids need to toughen up (it's part of life)...I also firmly believe in the idea of "it takes a village". I've stepped in when it was necessary before, as an adult, to help kids out and no one ever told me I was wrong for doing so...actually got thanked...and I'd do it over and over again, when necessary.

Kids only repeat what they see and hear. That's how they grow...good or bad...it is what it is. We are the ones who teach them (all of us)...don't ever doubt that.

Fair enough, I did misread what you said.

Yes, adults have a resposibility to step in when it gets out of line.

The stats don't frighten me, becuase the electronic means simply give an ability to measure. 17.6 out of 20 students have experinced cyber bullying. Now, as you mentioned in your thread, how many of us experinced regular bullying. I am gonna guess that number is the same, if not higher.

The article about the toll it takes actually re-enforces what the both of us are saying, adults may have to step in. That one doesn't deliniate between cyber and regular. Whats more, is it seems to take a tone that even mocking another kid is bullying.

I simply don't think its any more than when we were school aged, its just something else to get parents worked into a tizzy about. The only news article about school when we were kids were about the HS Football team, and how litte Jummy sold the most crappy Christmas trinkets to pay for a trip to Epocot center.

Its just a new concern, like this silly pandemic swin flu business. This lawmaker is just trying to get some decent soundbites for her re-elction campiagn.

[Nerves]

Another thing that we have to look at with that statistic is how the internet has greatly increased the amount of "friends" out youth now interact with. 20 years ago, someone was limited to a small group of acquaintances consisting of school kids and maybe church kids and a few others. In that group you would have only a handful of bullies to interact with.

Now our 13 and 14 year old kids are on facebook and myspace with upwards of thousands of "friends" with which they interact, greatly increasing the possability they will get bullied.

And if you couple that with the fact that those insults and mean spirited people can come directly into our homes 24 hours a day, it will increase the chanceses bullying will happen. It no longet takes a brick through the window with a note tied to it.

And in my expeariance, most of the ass holes that run around online dont have the balls to say in person anything near what they will online. The impersonalasation of the internet makes people think they can say and do whatever the hell they want.

[UglykidJoe]

Ok so who here wasn’t bullied at least once during grade school by someone trying to take your lunch money?

How is this any different?

Umm that would be me I guess, I was never bullied. But I went to school before cell phones, interweb, CD's, indoor plumbing etc....and besides, like now, back then I didn't have money for lunch.....lol

I agree parents need to toughen their kids up, I hopefully have instilled this in my kids, they don't go getting into fights and shit, but they aren't getting picked on and beat up every day either.

[mtnairlover]

Thing about cyber-bullying is that it is a new phenomenon and unlike the Swine Flu, there is no prescribed medication for it, yet. We will see a lot of bills introduced and we will see more schools try to come up with programs that work to help kids who've been victimized. We're going to see this stuff get worse before it gets better and I really don't like the sound of that, especially when such young lives are affected...

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l12/mtnairlover/Cyberbullying_Suicide.jpg

Oh and not to be outdone by the younger generations though, cyber-bullying happens at all levels and ages. Some of those articles mention cyber-bullying in the workplace, which ends up affecting job performance and not just the psyche of the victims.

[Slo]

Without the web, stupid sh*t will still happen, it doesn't make freaks of nature more common because of the internet.

People will still have good or bad lives, get bullied, whatever, internet has nothing to do with it.

[dirkterrell]

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l12/mtnairlover/Cyberbullying_Suicide.jpg


What does that scale mean and what are the error bars on the numbers?

Dirk

[puckstr]

The Pussification will continue.

Welcome to Generation ME

[Shea]

The Pussification will continue.

Welcome to Generation ME

Why do you make me cry every time you post Steve?! I need big government to protect me from people like you because I don't have the skills to deal with it! If I only was able to play dodgeball in school...

[TFOGGuys]

Ok... I was the scrawny kid in elementary school, the one everyone picked on. When my classmates in 5th grade were 100 lbs, I was 65. I was picked on for everything from my size, to my lack of athletic ability, even my name.

Why didn't I either become a whiny, suicidal wreck, or go postal and mow down my class mates with a full auto crossbow?

We were allowed to settle our differences. Nobody got suspended of expelled for simply being in a fight, unless they started it. And if it happened off school grounds, then the school felt no reason to be involved. So, I got my ass beat a few times, then learned how to fight back, and people stopped picking on me. I got teased a few times, and I learned how to defend myself verbally as well. Make a bully look stupid, and he'll soon learn to pick on someone else. Give parents both the authority and motivation to actually discipline their kids, and chronic bullies will soon learn to toe the line, if not because it's the right thing to do, then because they fear the consequences.

/rant

[#1Townie]

look bottom line to this all is if the kid cant handle the internet then they shouldnt be on it.. same thing with tv.. if you dont want your kids to be picked on on the internet then dont let them get on the internet.. we dont need new laws for what parents should be doing themselfs..

we are wasting money on our congress to work on somthing for the parents cuz they are to lazy to do their own jobs..

[mtnairlover]

If it doesn't affect me, then it isn't happening...why should I give a rat's ass, right? Might as well lump yourselves into that same ME generation.

Would it kill anyone to care, even the slightest?

Damn, you guys are freakin brutal, as well as short-sighted.

Yeah, I went through the same stupid crap growing up, too. I never had parents to run home to and whine about my problems either. So, I had to figure it out all on my own. But, that doesn't mean I don't know how to show compassion when it's necessary. So, what putrid organism crawled into your bowls of oatmeal and pissed in it, anyway?

Like I said before, I'm not suggesting we take away freedom of speech. I am suggesting that more attention be given to this problem, because it is different than getting bullied at school, face to face. Because it is so anonymous, more kids are doing it than they would without the Internet and cell phones. And because more kids are doing it, more kids are dying who normally would not without this wondrous thing we call the Internet (irony).

Oh and Dirk...


What does that scale mean and what are the error bars on the numbers?


So as not to add to the pussification of this conversation...figure it out yourself.

[Pandora-11]

I don't remember EVER being bullied. But then again, I had five brothers and perhaps I was off limits.
Government needs to get out of our lives and stop legislating everything to death. We need to get back to the era of personal responsibility.
I can really see the difference in generational behavior since the beginning of the Jerry Springer/Maury Povich/ Bad Girls, etc type shows. I think teenagers/young adults really think that this is the NORMAL way to behave. I see a difference in the way the younger generation talks to each other and to adults. (OMG I sound like a member of the establishment...."remember when?")

[Slo]

If it doesn't affect me, then it isn't happening...why should I give a rat's ass, right? Might as well lump yourselves into that same ME generation.

Would it kill anyone to care, even the slightest?

Damn, you guys are freakin brutal, as well as short-sighted.

Yeah, I went through the same stupid crap growing up, too. I never had parents to run home to and whine about my problems either. So, I had to figure it out all on my own. But, that doesn't mean I don't know how to show compassion when it's necessary. So, what putrid organism crawled into your bowls of oatmeal and pissed in it, anyway?

Like I said before, I'm not suggesting we take away freedom of speech. I am suggesting that more attention be given to this problem, because it is different than getting bullied at school, face to face. Because it is so anonymous, more kids are doing it than they would without the Internet and cell phones. And because more kids are doing it, more kids are dying who normally would not without this wondrous thing we call the Internet (irony).

Oh and Dirk...



So as not to add to the pussification of this conversation...figure it out yourself.

Seems like the internet is affecting you a little wee bit right now? Didn't seem like anyone was attacking you or downtalking you due to your opinions?

I think the situations that have happened, were not caused by the internet..... and for those they blaim the internet, if there were no internet, something else would have caused the child or adult to do some unconventional things no matter what.

[mtnairlover]

Nope, don't think I was feeling talked down to...but you can see how the written word affects people based on what they are thinking/feeling, etc.

And yeah...I do think some people need to open up their minds a bit, too. It doesn't take too much to do that.

Now, as far as the difference between Internet and people...well, it's people whose words can tend to cause others to react a certain way...already proven in our misunderstandings here in this thread and other threads for that matter. Again, not that I'm advocating barring Freedom of Speech...that's not it, but like I said before, if it isn't happening to me, then it isn't happening, right? And yes, that's short-sighted thinking.

No other time before have so many people been able to be in touch with such a multitude of personalities via the net. You can't get this kind of connection in any other way, Jay. And that graph shows what kind of affect it can have on younger minds.

[dirkterrell]

Oh and Dirk...

So as not to add to the pussification of this conversation...figure it out yourself.

I looked at the site on the graphic but couldn't find the original reference to look at the source of the numbers (all they have is a link to the abstract but the paper itself is not freely available). Figured you might know since you posted it as a presumably supportive item for your position.

Dirk

[puckstr]

Boo fuckin HOO

just exercising MY freedom of speech. BTW

I AM GEN-X ...all the way

[Slo]

Nope, don't think I was feeling talked down to...but you can see how the written word affects people based on what they are thinking/feeling, etc.

And yeah...I do think some people need to open up their minds a bit, too. It doesn't take too much to do that.

Now, as far as the difference between Internet and people...well, it's people whose words can tend to cause others to react a certain way...already proven in our misunderstandings here in this thread and other threads for that matter. Again, not that I'm advocating barring Freedom of Speech...that's not it, but like I said before, if it isn't happening to me, then it isn't happening, right? And yes, that's short-sighted thinking.

No other time before have so many people been able to be in touch with such a multitude of personalities via the net. You can't get this kind of connection in any other way, Jay. And that graph shows what kind of affect it can have on younger minds.

It doesn't affect all of us in the same ways obviously...., if someone can't handle certain things, they shouldn't get involved, meaning for the kids, that's where the parents step in and limit usage and sites they have access to, I'm sure there are other things parents can do when needed.

I'm definitely with puckstr on this one haha.

[Mental]

...Like I said before, I'm not suggesting we take away freedom of speech. I am suggesting that more attention be given to this problem, because it is different than getting bullied at school, face to face. Because it is so anonymous, more kids are doing it than they would without the Internet and cell phones. And because more kids are doing it, more kids are dying who normally would not without this wondrous thing we call the Internet (irony)...

More attention from who? Me? I don't have kids, getting me involved is a stupid thing to do, I have no perspective. Teachers? Well yeah, aside from the other 6 millions things they have to look out for, lets make them libel for this as well (Now I know you aren't advocating that, but given your education experince, you know thats what it will become). The Goverment. Perfect, they can pass some unfunded intiatives, make some unenforceble laws, and some pack of teens will get national publicity when their school principle tags them for cyber bullying. The goverment has done such a great job with the train system after all.

That leave parents. And that what everyone here is saying. Its not a question of its not happening to me, or a question of I can't see it, or a question of whather or not we beleive it. Its the parents job. Period. If they can't go to a parent, or friends or a religuous leader, or a counseler at school, or Dr Laura, then who the heck is left?

Like it or not, the electronic medium will not go away, and these kids better learn to will the pitfalls and problems that come with it. Internet predators, Nigerian scams, and yes, bullys. They are all part of the new cyber landscape. If they do not develop defense mechanisims right now, besides "woe is me," then they are set up to be very disapionted adults. More importantly, unemployed disapionted adults that won't move out of my house.

Simply wailing "think of the children" is not a plan od action, it doesn't remove the parents resposibility and it does not make me heartless when I piont out it is their problem. If and when I have kids, they will have supervisied introduction to all of the above mediums and whatever is next on the horizon. They will learn to deal with the reactions and taughts of other in person and on a flat screen. Thats my job as a parent, not the goverment, and certainly not the populace.

So until that time as I do have children, this is not as issue for me. I have a terrible economy, failing home values, a worthless retirement fund, immagration, deterioating public services, a nuclear power on the brink of a fundalminetlist revolution and a dozen other issues to honestly care about a group of kids whose parents have failed to equip them with the coping measures that are needed in a modern world.

According to every stat you posted, swine flu is a bigger threat to the health of our youth. DUIs, prescription drugs, bad music, hormones in milk, over sexualization, steriods, college accaptance, texting while driving, swimming in ungaurded waters, flash floods, hurricances, tornados, the regular flu, hazing, salvia, the bubanic plauge and "jump ins" to join the cheerleading squad have all claimed more lives than cyber bullying.

So again, its not ignoring a problem to tell these kids to harden up. That is a course of action, that is a response and even under the constant barrage of electrons they are exposed to (all of which have an "off" switch) it is good advice.

This sounds harsh, and the harshness is not directed at you, but at the overall pervailing attitude hat children need to be comforted at every turn and every possible threat to their psyche minimized, and what everyone our age has forgotten is that everyone needs to tatse and understand failure, pain, and disapiontment in order to appreciatte it when they have it good.

[Nick_Ninja]

Mental for sheriff :up:

[Slo]

The "over sexualization", damn, where was I when that was happening???

[mtnairlover]

And we're back to my first thought..."It takes a village".

Not every child has parents they can count on. I didn't, even though I made it through adolescence relatively unscathed...not any more psychologically damaged than anyone else here.

So, instead of burying heads in the sand, own up to the idea that there is a problem and support those who actually come up with a livable/workable solution, instead of telling them they're a bunch of panzies for caring about kids.

Oh and Dirk, I did not find the information on what the graph means either, but there is an email addy available. Looks like these guys are getting reviewed and published a lot lately.

http://www.cyberbullying.us/cyberbullying_victimization.pdf

http://www.cyberbullying.us/cyberbullying_offending.pdf

Yes Mental...I agree...we need to continue to toughen up our kids. In the same token, we also need to hold those accountable for being assholes, as well. It is not acceptable at any level. And yeah, when I say we, I mean it in the collective/villager sense.

[Shea]

And we're back to my first thought..."It takes a village".

God I dislike that bs. It takes involved parents, not a village. In the absence of a involved family, a far less acceptable means of raising a child is a "village". However, given our "it's all about me" society (thank you boomers) parents are more concerned about their golf handicap or what car their neighbor is driving rather then teaching their children to have some inner confidence.



Yes Mental...I agree...we need to continue to toughen up our kids. In the same token, we also need to hold those accountable for being assholes, as well. It is not acceptable at any level. And yeah, when I say we, I mean it in the collective/villager sense.

Being an asshole is not a crime. Telling someone off is not a crime. Saying that someone is a stupid whore is not a crime. When does all of this become 1984 and we have Big Brother and the Ministry of Love dictating what we can say/think/type lest we offend or hurt someone's feelings? Life is not a fricking padded cell. In adversity we find ourselves and the power to overcome, what inevitably will challenge us in our daily lives. Patronizing children, telling them that they are incapable of dealing with a situation, and that only through big government can they be safe only leads to the slavery of the mind.

We have banned everything that makes a child capable at the behest of parents who don't want to deal with skinned knees and bruised egos. It's no big wonder to find that these children have grown up and now hold office...

[puckstr]

Hazing, bullying, and name-calling...
HOLY CRAP I had no idea it was just isolated to the new generation of offspring....

Guess the "Village" better get right on that. :cry:


If being an Asshole was a crime then Bill O'Riley, The Pope, and G.W. would have been locked up.

[TFOGGuys]

IMO, sending out a text saying "billy is a fag" isn't any different than putting the same thing up on a chalk board in front of the same number of people. We already have laws against harassment, either in person or electronically. Shea is correct that we have, as a society, have no right to NOT be offended by anything we read or hear. Kids are not allowed to experience the pain of failure, or embarrassment, and there are negligible consequences to bad behavior, so they develop no boundaries or conscience. It's amazing to me the change in attitude that can come about in a bully where his or her nose is bloodied, either figuratively or literally.

I am pondering on the whole Miss California controversy, in which she gave an honest answer to an interview question, rather than side step it with some PC bullshit, and now faces significant consequences for her career as a result. Why is she not permitted to hold an opinion? Because it is not sensitive to a certain segment of the population? Would she have been more correct to state that she held no opinion, and that people's bedroom habits shouldn't be subject to public discussion?

/rant...again

[dirkterrell]

Oh and Dirk, I did not find the information on what the graph means either, but there is an email addy available. Looks like these guys are getting reviewed and published a lot lately.


I was mainly wondering what the vertical scale meant and whether the differences in the two populations were statistically significant. If the errors are 0.01, it's significant and needs to be looked at in detail. If it's 0.1, it might not be significant.

I agree with you that we need to listen to what these kids are saying and provide support to them (which might partly be the "toughen up" advice others are stating). Columbine is a good example of what can happen when kids are being bullied and they feel helpless to deal with it. Life is hard and we all need someone we can go to and have them listen to us. I do think that we have set a lot of kids up for difficulties by shielding them from failure when they are young, and then having them discover the real world when they are older. But I agree with you that we need to offer more than just "toughen up."

Dirk

[puckstr]

Wow when I was a kid my mother... and Tipper Gore thought
Ozzy Ozbourne was going to make me commit suicide.

[Mental]

And we're back to my first thought..."It takes a village".

Not every child has parents they can count on. I didn't, even though I made it through adolescence relatively unscathed...not any more psychologically damaged than anyone else here.

So, instead of burying heads in the sand, own up to the idea that there is a problem and support those who actually come up with a livable/workable solution, instead of telling them they're a bunch of panzies for caring about kids.

Oh and Dirk, I did not find the information on what the graph means either, but there is an email addy available. Looks like these guys are getting reviewed and published a lot lately.

http://www.cyberbullying.us/cyberbullying_victimization.pdf

http://www.cyberbullying.us/cyberbullying_offending.pdf

Yes Mental...I agree...we need to continue to toughen up our kids. In the same token, we also need to hold those accountable for being assholes, as well. It is not acceptable at any level. And yeah, when I say we, I mean it in the collective/villager sense.

I'm not burying my head in the sand. I am staring right at it, and I don't see a problem, not on a scale that requires national involvement or even a call to action.

Whats more, it is not my job, or yours to hold peaple accountable for being assholes. Some peaple just suck. The minute you draw a line and say aything past this requires punishment on any kid outside of your own, you DO threaten free speech. Free speech is the stuff you don;t like as well. To include a crucifix in a jar or urine. "Clapton is God" and "Billy is a fag"

I am not tellin adult they are panzies for caring about kids, I am telling the adults their kids are panzies for letting a 2 dimesional medium bother them.


...Not every child has parents they can count on...

I find that a bigger problem than cybullying. Focus on that, not on rules to hold peaple accountable for typing naughty things about Becky into their cellphone.


...I didn't, even though I made it through adolescence relatively unscathed...not any more psychologically damaged than anyone else here.

Which underscores my main piont. We were the generation that defined "latch key kids." We were the generation that spent Fridays nights at McDonalds for the custody exchange once a month. We were the generation with pop rocks, sugar coated chocolate frosted bombs, parents who smoked in the car with us, Battlestar Galatica toys that choked small kids, short unprotected outlets near every curtian, yard darts, no helmets and rickaty ramps made of discarded lumber.

Whats more, we predominatly grew up single parent homes in second rate 2 bedroom "divoree" apartments complexes. Our parents left us home on weekends so they could hit happy hour. I am absolutely certian that until I hit high school, my Dad had no idea where my school was. We sat 2 inches from a TV on the floor, often fed ourselves breakfast and dinner. In grade school I learned to get myself up, eat and get cleaned up in time to catch the bus, or I was walking. Either my parents had already gone to work, or were sleeping one off. We smoked behind the school. A bruise or blackeye from a parent would hardly raise an eyebrow at the school. We were bullied, neglected, malnurished and most of us learned to fetch our parents a beer as soon as we could walk. We all learned about sex from our buddies older siblings and stolen Penthouses. We learned about human realtionships through trail and error, and we learned not to be assholes becuase you end up with no good freinds.

So again, in the light of what I grew up with, I simply do not see "an epidemic" in regards to cyber bullying. I do not see a need to get involved and make rules that dictate a childs behavior or speech simply because they are sitting at an anonymus means of communication.

To the end I do not see a problem I am going to chalk this "crisis" in with "chronic fatigue syndrome," the "twinkee" defense, auto-erotic asyphixation, Nintendo carpal tunnel and a dozen other "threats" to our most precious resouce I have seen over the last 20 years. In 5 years, there will be a new crisis, and no one will even remember this. So while I do respect youth, another "Will someone please think of the children" battle cry just seems a bit hollow.

[Snowman]

Wow when I was a kid my mother... and Tipper Gore thought
Ozzy Ozbourne was going to make me commit suicide.
Well?...
Did he?

[Shea]

Well?...
Did he?

lol

[#1Townie]

And we're back to my first thought..."It takes a village".

Not every child has parents they can count on. I didn't, even though I made it through adolescence relatively unscathed...not any more psychologically damaged than anyone else here.

So, instead of burying heads in the sand, own up to the idea that there is a problem and support those who actually come up with a livable/workable solution, instead of telling them they're a bunch of panzies for caring about kids.

Oh and Dirk, I did not find the information on what the graph means either, but there is an email addy available. Looks like these guys are getting reviewed and published a lot lately.

http://www.cyberbullying.us/cyberbullying_victimization.pdf

http://www.cyberbullying.us/cyberbullying_offending.pdf

Yes Mental...I agree...we need to continue to toughen up our kids. In the same token, we also need to hold those accountable for being assholes, as well. It is not acceptable at any level. And yeah, when I say we, I mean it in the collective/villager sense.

look we loose just that much more every time the country wants somthing fixed that the parents should fix themselfs.. the girl that this thing is all about was so dumb she killed herself over what people typed to her.. am i the only one thinking that if shes dumb enough to do that then odds are she was going to kill her self with or with out being told to or the web.. i mean realy.. internet baby sitting should be done by the parents and the parents alone..


If it doesn't affect me, then it isn't happening...why should I give a rat's ass, right? Might as well lump yourselves into that same ME generation.

Would it kill anyone to care, even the slightest?

Damn, you guys are freakin brutal, as well as short-sighted.

Yeah, I went through the same stupid crap growing up, too. I never had parents to run home to and whine about my problems either. So, I had to figure it out all on my own. But, that doesn't mean I don't know how to show compassion when it's necessary. So, what putrid organism crawled into your bowls of oatmeal and pissed in it, anyway?

Like I said before, I'm not suggesting we take away freedom of speech. I am suggesting that more attention be given to this problem, because it is different than getting bullied at school, face to face. Because it is so anonymous, more kids are doing it than they would without the Internet and cell phones. And because more kids are doing it, more kids are dying who normally would not without this wondrous thing we call the Internet (irony).

Oh and Dirk...



So as not to add to the pussification of this conversation...figure it out yourself.

on to your next point about some kids dont have good parents and blah blah blah.. well guess what if that kid grows up and is left out of the love circle then so be it.. darwin wins again.. we are just animals and just like other animals on this planets some of us just dont deserve to live.. hate to bring the cold hard facts but we are just another creature on this planet...

look like i said before we dont need laws for everything that may happen.. if we keep down this road in the next 20 years we are all going to be kept in a padded room so that we dont hurt our selfs.. look mc donalds lost a law suit over a kid getting fat.. people are wining wars every day to insure their right to be fucking morons..

its not that some of us are looking at the small pic mtlover its that most of us are afraid of the big picture.. a life were our government runs our lives.. tells us what we can and cant eat. what we can and cant do.. like children.. i dont want that life for my family.. i dont want a world were we are so dumb we cant even do our own laundry cuz the governmet thinks we cant make it with a cup of bleach... thats is the big pic of what some of these people are walking into....

[Devaclis]

My face does not look the way it does because I am good at keeping my mouth shut.

You want to censor me, try to do it in person.

[TFOGGuys]

My face does not look the way it does because I am good at keeping my mouth shut.

You want to censor me, try to do it in person.

:applause:

Put another way: If you're gonna be stupid, you'd better be tough-John Wayne

[puckstr]

Well?...
Did he?

Tried it with Sex, Smokes and Booze..... It is a work in progress

I gave up the Smokes and up-ed the dosage of Sex and Booze

[TFOGGuys]

Tried it with Sex, Smokes and Bacon..... It is a work in progress

I gave up the Smokes and up-ed the dosage of Sex and Bacon

Fixed

[Nick_Ninja]

Originally Posted by puckstr http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/showthread.php?p=449919#post449919)
Tried it with Sex, Smokes and Bacon..... It is a work in progress

I gave up the Smokes and up-ed the dosage of Sex and Bacon



Fixed


It's ALL PORK anyway you look at it.

[BeoBe]

says nations youth.. i guess all forums are going to have to be 18 and up if that crap goes down.. how dumb...

If it bothers you, dont get on it

[puckstr]

Fixed


It's ALL PORK anyway you look at it.


But ya can smoke bacon ... and ASS

[puckstr]

....

[puckstr]

...

[Nerves]

Speak of the devil.

http://yellowscene.com/2009/05/11/can-i-sext-you-some-time/