CDR Rumor mill

[ebazyl]

Hey I can't remeber who mentioned this, but is there a chance that the MRA will not be racing at CDR next season? I know I would not shed a tear.

[Hey y'all, watch this!]

Everything I've read indicates it'll be running, since they're making a lot of modifications right now for this year.
blacktop, walls, bleachers, pit space,....

[ebazyl]

Well if they take out the: Swamp, walls, RV sale lot (which currently substitutes for run off), 3 tons of weeds/grass, and the whoops. And add some tires, hay bails and pit space might not be to bad.

Thanks for the info :)

[Lel]

:slap: you looooove the rumors haha

[Anonymous]

It's on the schedule, and they're doing stuff to the track. So, we'll be there for one this season unless something drastic happens.

[Deuce]

If any of you cry babies wanna skip CDR it's okay with me. :lol:

Deuce

[Kim-n-Dean]

If any of you cry babies wanna skip CDR it's okay with me. :lol:

Deuce

Yup!!! Feel free to skip La Junta, too!!!!! Might as well leave out Pueblo, it's pretty far away, ya know...

See ya at ALL the tracks, Sean!!

[Lurch]

Funny this should be posted about 8 hours after I drove past CDR and had a good look at the improvements. Well if you call mowing the grass and painting the buildings improvements then I guess it's safe now.

The bleachers that were rumored to have been removed are still standing and in exactly the same place as before. The mowing did expose all the walls and guardrails that you will hit if you run a little wide in some turns. So thats a good thing I guess. You can actually see the bump/jump in T4 from the highway pretty cool. I did look at the recently posted photos of the tracks and we should be able to fit in the pits. However spectators are going to have to park about 3 miles away.

When I did the schedule for last year I talked with CDR and it was the same BS, oh we are going to improve things well they have
n't except for paint and mowing. They require more insurance,no pit space, zero spectator parking and a pretty damn unsafe racetrack.
Sean and Dean I'm guessing you have not run there recently I ran a few laps at speed or what I thought was speed and it scared the hell out of me. Can't wait to see 30-40 bikes try it. Should be fun to watch. I will ride it if I'm in a points chase but it will suck to think that I have to risk a bunch just to collect a few points. You can all jump on me now and say well you don't have to race. No I don't but how many times have you all raced hurt or whatever just to collect those precious points.

Eugene I will add you to the list of 30+ riders that I know of that don't want to race this track. That number includes 2-3 current board members who I will not name because of the political BS. Maybe if enough people start to complain we can still grab one of those open dates at SCR or even go to La Junta twice. Go to a track that actually wants our business and calls to make sure everything went well. Damn thats a novel idea.

and just think I used to love this track. It is just plain unsafe now at the speeds we are going and the size of the grids we now have.

Lurch

[Kim-n-Dean]

Funny this should be posted about 8 hours after I drove past CDR and had a good look at the improvements. Well if you call mowing the grass and painting the buildings improvements then I guess it's safe now.

and just think I used to love this track. It is just plain unsafe now at the speeds we are going and the size of the grids we now have.

Lurch

Since I've never riden there and several people bitch about ALL our tracks, I keep forgetting the bitch is about safety. You're right, Doug. If it's that bad and CDR doesn't properly respond, I say go to La Junta.

[Hoopty]

:321: CDR!!! LEt's do another weekend at SCR, I won't mind. :idea: :D

[Kim-n-Dean]

Just out of curiousity. What are the mojarity of peeps doing about a hotel for CDR? I'm not sure I want to make the hour drive every morning on a race weekend. Although, I guess I have more time to get to the track now that I don't have to do the first practice at 8:00.

[Hoopty]

Hotel K&D truck... :lol:

[Kim-n-Dean]

Hotel K&D truck... :lol:

Shit!!! Wish I had some money for that camper I want!!!

[Hoopty]

And that chip and exhaust etc etc etc... LOL

[Lel]

Dean if you have never been there, my first and only experience I posted about a while back - http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=12324 But doug is right, with 30 bikes on that track it is going to get kinda dangerous.

I just think 99% of what is heard anyways is rumors (good or bad about the tracks, think of all the SCR bull shit 'i heard from so and so that this is happening now') Rumors do nothing other than throw gasoline on a flame.

lel

[RSVR4aCowboy]

Ray-Ray and I were talking to track Bob @ SCR a couple weeks ago and he mentioned that SCR was available for that (CDR) weekend. I know we are trying to stay on terms with CDR for next season but sure seems like if they don't get all the improvements done soon, it would be wise to switch. Next year, lets do a few extra at LaJunta Seca. Long drive but I sure like that track alot. Having dealt with 3 - 8 hour drives when I raced SCCA from Reno, I think we are sometimes a little spoiled about the drive to out of area tracks. :D
I get the feeling from some conversations that CDR isn't too concerned about the MRA as much as the car clubs. That's understandable as I would think they bring more $$$ with less safety concerns than we have.

[Kim-n-Dean]

Next year, lets do a few extra at LaJunta Seca. Long drive but I sure like that track alot.

The way you took us last year only added maybe 20 minutes to the time it takes to get to Peublo.


I get the feeling from some conversations that CDR isn't too concerned about the MRA as much as the car clubs. That's understandable as I would think they bring more $$$ with less safety concerns than we have.

Maybe less safety concerns but, at SCR the motorcycles alone bring in over 50% of the total money for the year. That's against ALL the car clubs combined!!

[mikesf4i]

Just to throw this out. Why would CDR improve things for the MRA? Next year there will be one less track locally with SCR closing. CDR might just be thinking " why spend the money to improve things around here? everyone will be back when SCR closes" Im not trying to be a dick or anything, as I feel that a racetrack should be as safe as possible. But , safety improvements cost money. And from an investment standpoint CDR would need to see a return on their investment within a certain amount of time. At this point it may look to them like they will see an increase in revenue when SCR closes regardless of whether they spend the money on safety improvments or not.

[Anonymous]

Because we've stated to them that we won't spend our money there if they don't fix it. We'll just go race a weekend at another track, and won't have a local track next year.

We won't be there if it's unimproved. However nobody said the improvements to be made would be done by now either. It's still February...

[ebazyl]

Eugene I will add you to the list of 30+ riders that I know of that don't want to race this track. That number includes 2-3 current board members who I will not name because of the political BS. Maybe if enough people start to complain we can still grab one of those open dates at SCR or even go to La Junta twice. Go to a track that actually wants our business and calls to make sure everything went well. Damn thats a novel idea.

Lurch


Lurch you are now my best friend! I totaly agree that massive improvements are need, at the very lest put in a table top after the whoops. :roll: Berthod is only a couple miles away and definetly looks to be more suiting for road racing, and they have parking.



:321: CDR!!! LEt's do another weekend at SCR, I won't mind. :idea: :D


I second the motion. :up:

[*MV* #33]

Include me on the Anti-CDR movement.
I want to chase points but its hard to get excited when I think of CDR.

Im all for La Junta.


MV #33

[voncon]

Alright, I'll bite. Everyone is on here bashing the CDR track -- what I fondly remember as "Mountain View". I remember the MRA pretty much hanging out there, and making that home for a long time. The track has a cool layout, with elevation changes and the spectators get a great glimpse of what speed is by standing right outside the front straight wall. Sure we complain about safety, as half of us are riding wheelies on public streets (me included). Have you seen the Macau GP recently, or The Isle of Mann? People are acting like SCR is Laguna Seca or something.... it's a paved Jeep trail the same as all our tracks - save PPIR.

If we go there and the track just plain sucks -- they'll ancel in light of safety. It's been done before... remember the weekend they repaved SCR and the pavement was like ice? They cancelled the weekend and noone lost out on points for being sissified.

Relax, practice and have fun... that's why we started this crap in the first place. ;)

[*MV* #33]

.

Relax, practice and have fun... that's why we started this crap in the first place. ;)


When Someone hits that wall and dies.. are you going tell their families to "Relax" ? :no:

Regardless of the tracks layout and the spectators view... the track has to be safe. Sure we dont have the safest tracks here in Colorado but I know none are a scarry as that one. And to compare the MRA tracks to Isle man or Macua Gp is rediculous.. this is a Hobby for id say 99% of us out there not a job. Sure there is risk..(always is).... but Ive gotta try to make it to work monday so I can pay the bills. Now if i wreck and Its my fault thats a risk I take. But to wreck and hit a wall its a different story.

[Lurch]

Voncon,

I too have fond memorys of CDR. I raced there for about 10+ years then the MRA made the wise choice of no longer racing there. So what has changed in the last 4-5 years that makes us want to go back? The fact that we are losing SCR should not be an excuse to run there.

I'm guessing you haven't been on the track in recent years. It has taken a turn for the worse and I mean worse. When I raced there grids of 20 bikes were huge. Now grids of 20 bikes are the norm and 30-40 in Novice and Amateur are also the norm now. Plus the bikes have gotten a tad faster and the tires a tad better.

Why should we wait and have everyone get there and go oh this is unsafe when we could schedule another race at a different track now that is at least rideable. From what I have heard they are actually going to make the Dragon Slide more unsafe then it already is.

Also to compare the Isle of Man to our tracks is a joke. But if you do, how many people have died at the Isle?

Lurch

[voncon]

My comparison to the Macau and the Isle of Mann were just that -- a joke. Those tracks and what they do on them are far more dangerous than what we do. I am all about safety myself, and would like to think that I don't take too many unecessary risks... but there aren't a bunch of affordable PPIR's to run on (Short of this year's Racing 2 Save Lives - nudge nudge).

I actually came up in racing on the east coast. Summit Point WV was my home track and what a haven it was. Nelson Ledges was a death trap to us, but it still had gobs of run off when you did fall and slide to a stop. Pocono and Rockingham were our scariest because of the walls... in fact it wasn't long after I was racing here that Loudon fonally got scrapped by the AMA -- of course the CCS and the Loudon club still race there.

If CDR is on the schedule will I race it? Yes. Will I concentrate on being more careful than sporting? Maybe.

[Deuce]

If any of you cry babies wanna skip CDR it's okay with me. :lol:

Deuce

Yup!!! Feel free to skip La Junta, too!!!!! Might as well leave out Pueblo, it's pretty far away, ya know...

See ya at ALL the tracks, Sean!!


Those of us with tight budgets gotta make tough choices. Trust me if it was up to me and money was abundent I woulda been at every race and done a hell of alot better in points last year. Such is life.

As far as CDR. I rode there once last year. While it was alright to lap on with a few bikes on it I think that a big grid of bikes is nuts. I wasn't planning on really racing at CDR in the first place. Just going out and doing laps and picking up points. I thought us going there in the first place was rediculous in the first place but bitching and moaning does little good so I was reserved to go and keep my mouth shut. I'd rather do a weekend at SCR anyday over CDR. Makes little sense that this being the last year of SCR were not taking every avaliable opportunity to race there. Since next year is gonna bite. Just my opinion.


Deuce

[The GECCO]

Eugene I will add you to the list of 30+ riders that I know of that don't want to race this track
Funny, not a single person has had any direct communication with me with the specific intent of saying that they are opposed to racing there. My phone and email both work pretty well, they're right there on the MRA site, but the only place people voice their opposition is here...


Ray-Ray and I were talking to track Bob @ SCR a couple weeks ago and he mentioned that SCR was available for that (CDR) weekend
Not exactly true, that Sunday is reserved by one of the smaller car clubs, but because the 2-day events take precedent Bob has told me he would be willing to give them the boot for us. How would you feel if you were a member of THAT club?


When Someone hits that wall and dies.. are you going tell their families to "Relax" ?
ummm......Can anyone name a track in Colorado that DOESN'T have a wall at the exit of a turn?? That's right, there isn't one...


Makes little sense that this being the last year of SCR were not taking every avaliable opportunity to race there
No, what makes no sense is to NOT go to CDR this year so they have even LESS incentive (and money) to make improvements for '06 when we WILL need the facility. If we can do one event there this year and use that as a learning experience we can give them educated and sustantiated feedback about what else needs to be done. It shows we have the intention to return IF they will do the work. So many people assume they will throw half a million dollars into the facility with absolutely no show of good faith that we will even race there! Does that sound reasonable to anyone? Would YOU do it if it were your money?

Look at what we are facing in '06 - It's doubtful the new track will be ready....in '04 SCR was booked for 33 weekends, so was Pueblo, so was PPIR. La Junta was as busy as they want to be considering they are an all volunteer staff, basically they were booked except for most of July and August (for obvious reasons). So, when you take away all 33 weekends at SCR, where are all the clubs gonna race? The other tracks are already full now, they sure as hell can't accommodate another 33 events! If we don't give CDR some incentive in '05 to make the track better for '06 we are looking at a 6 or 7 event season tops, unless we go out of state.

The specific reason that SCR isn't booked solid this year is because the tracks operate on what is known as "traditional dates". If you have a certain weekend in '05, you have first rights to it in '06. So, all the clubs, MRA included, put a priority on scheduling '05 events at the tracks that will be open in '06 because they know that if they don't they won't have shit for race dates in '06. You can't be short sighted or you're f#@ked.

So, we are taking a chance to try and build a relationship with CDR in the hopes that it will pay off. Will it? I don't know, but it seems silly to not even try.

For those that think the track sucks so bad, well...I agree...it's not my first choice either. So, don't race there. Or, go there with the mindset that the track isn't perfect and your main goal for the weekend is to stay upright. What gets me is that all these people will bitch about the track and then they will crash while riding at 110% trying to dive-bomb someone for the lead...and then blame the track, as if the track suddenly changed from the last lap when it was perfect. If you know ahead of time that it isn't that great you have even less of an excuse for crashing. Winning races and championships isn't just about riding fast, it's also about riding smart, sometimes riding smart means not riding fast. That's what that whole weekend will be about, IMHO...kinda like this:


If CDR is on the schedule will I race it? Yes. Will I concentrate on being more careful than sporting? Maybe
Well, at least ONE person gets it...

[Lurch]

Well Glenn to tell you the turth most people will not voice there opinion about anything in this club because they are affraid of the political BS thats goes with it. When someone does they are flamed by people on the board and past members that think they know what is going on and haven't been involved in the club for years. So to answer your question about why people don't voice there opinion well at least 4 have on this post alone so maybe we are out here.

So my question is are we going to race there if the improvements aren't made? Are we going to run schools there if the improvements aren't made? Why after 5 years are we going back to a track that the previous boards deemed unsafe?

If the only reason to run there is the thought that we are not going to have a track in 06 then maybe we should look elsewhere to race. Other clubs run plently of out-of-state races. I know of 3 tracks with in 10 hours of Denver.

The walls that are being talked about aren't on the exit of turns but in the impact zones of turns. Turn 3,7, and 9 to be specific. Either last year or the year before we had students hit both walls/guard rails in T7 and 9 and that was a school. What is going to happen at race pace?

You and I may know to slow down on a shitty track but tell that to the other 100 riders that may attend the CDR race to slow down because the track is unsafe. That makes sense.....

and the reason stuff is posted here and not on the MRA groups page is that the groups page is a POS and is hardly followed anymore.

Lurch

[Kim-n-Dean]

So, we are taking a chance to try and build a relationship with CDR in the hopes that it will pay off. Will it? I don't know, but it seems silly to not even try.

I totally agree. We make the first move to show good faith. If CDR doesn't come through, then F 'em. We tried.



So my question is are we going to race there if the improvements aren't made? Are we going to run schools there if the improvements aren't made? Why after 5 years are we going back to a track that the previous boards deemed unsafe?
Lurch


These are good points, too. Glad I'm not the one who has to figure all this shit out!!!

Before I went to La Junat everyone told me how bad it was. Terrible surface and such. I was nervous and a little scared. When I got there, I thought it was awesome. I even won that race. Since I've never been to CDR, all this talk has me nervous again. I guess I'll find out soon enough...

[RSVR4aCowboy]

No, what makes no sense is to NOT go to CDR this year so they have even LESS incentive (and money) to make improvements for '06 when we WILL need the facility. If we can do one event there this year and use that as a learning experience we can give them educated and sustantiated feedback about what else needs to be done. It shows we have the intention to return IF they will do the work. So many people assume they will throw half a million dollars into the facility with absolutely no show of good faith that we will even race there! Does that sound reasonable to anyone? Would YOU do it if it were your money?


I don't really agree. It seems feedback has been given to CDR. If we stopped racing there because of issues and they haven't made the changes needed, why would we expect them to do it now. If I am a business that wants a customer's business, I don't tell them to put money in my pocket before I will do the things to earn their business. That is similar to an employee asking for a raise and saying when they get it, they'll start doing more work. If they are interested in having clubs race there, show some "good faith" and show you want my business. It sounds like our good faith was shown prior to issues that resulted in our decision to stop racing there. Maybe I don't totally understand our relationships with the tracks. Are the tracks the business and the car clubs the customer, or vice-vesa? Just my two cents ;)
I still think we are fortunate with or without CDR compared to most clubs in the US in that we have three tracks within a 2.5 hour drive.
All right, let the flaming begin. :lol:

[ebazyl]

Eugene I will add you to the list of 30+ riders that I know of that don't want to race this track
Funny, not a single person has had any direct communication with me with the specific intent of saying that they are opposed to racing there. My phone and email both work pretty well, they're right there on the MRA site, but the only place people voice their opposition is here...


Fair enough, I should have mentioned something to you about it before going on the boards and expessing my discontenet with the CURRENT condition of CDR. That I my bad, and I am sorry about that. :oops:

Lurch - I do appreciate you standing up the interests of the wimmpty riders.

Now my rant:
1. The MRA is in a very difficult possition, and I understand where Glen is comming from and what he is trying to do. Glen rode the train in December so he know the conditions, and can make an informed decision.
2. MRA officials know a lot more about dealing with such situations, as well as investing in the future of the club, so they are in a better possition to decide then I am.
3. As bad as this sounds - If you have not riden CDR in the last year I do not think you can have an opinion. I am serious, go ride it. Not drive by it, not track walk it, no take the pit scooter or your car on it, not talk to your buddies, not remember how it was 5 years ago. GO RIDE IT, since the MRA is racing there anyways it will be good practice. :D I think track availability is some of the best in Colorado and it is not going to cost you $7000/day to rent like Pikes Peak. If the track is fine there is no reason for you not to take your shinny freshly painted machine there.

Let me tell you a little story about CDR:
One of my good friends and me got into an argument about that place in the summer of 2004. I said skeptical, but he was sure it was just my sinecism. He even went as far as stoping by there on the way to Berthod to show that the track was not that bad. I did not buy it. :321: Well the only way to settle it was to go ride it. That opportunity came (I think it was Ft. Collins Motorcycle organized a free track day there). My friends was confident even at the beginning of the day. Well sure enough (look through the message board for threads about that day). I will give my friends this, the 6 different colors of pavement make it preaty easy to pick out visual track markets.

Moral of the story: Go ride it. Maybe it will turn out that I am a p***y and need to quit my bitching. Maybe the track is better then Second Creek or even Laguna Seca, can't realy tell until you go.

[Hoopty]

Gene, you are a puss, but what does that have to do with anything? :? :lol:

[ebazyl]

:321: ...but true

[The GECCO]

I don't really agree. It seems feedback has been given to CDR. If we stopped racing there because of issues and they haven't made the changes needed, why would we expect them to do it now.

Because the track is not either owned nor managed by the same people it was the last time we raced there. The feedback/non-action by the old owners and management is irrelevant.

[Lel]

I have been trying to take a non bias perspective while reading all of this.

When I was there in october I felt that CDR was not up to par for the size of the grids that the MRA has (safety or condition wise) HOWEVER... I also thought it was a great idea in order to spur CDR's improvements, another track is another track.

Out of everything I have read though, its not the conditions, its not the pitting or even the specific things people bring up that are unsafe that keeps getting to me (there still is a lot of time before we will race there for imporvements to be done, so I am HOPING that happens)

It is the fact that the MRA left there (when it was smaller) becuase it was unsafe then! From what it sounds like nothing has been changed since that point, and the MRA has grown. If changes are made, awesome we are going to have a great time racing there, its why we do it. However if nothing is, or has been done I kind of have the feeling mike said; like an employee asking for a raise before they do the work.

I am still excited, but scared at the same time to race there. I believe the season is going ot be fun no matter what. I guess Ill pose the question, if there are things in 'mind' that has to be done before we race there... or things that the CMC said they want to have fixed what were they? What are the plans this year other than 'its going to be better' ? Are they resealing the track? Fixing the dragon slide? fixing turn 9? I think if we had some insight (I have been to all the MRA meetings in the past year... except for last months) and I dont know whats going on to be fixed.

[The GECCO]

If the only reason to run there is the thought that we are not going to have a track in 06 then maybe we should look elsewhere to race. Other clubs run plently of out-of-state races. I know of 3 tracks with in 10 hours of Denver.

You must have a pretty short memory....do you not remember the uproar when we even suggested the possibility of an out-of-state race? I remember more than 30 people being opposed.

Besides that, both Sandia and MAM cost more to rent than what we are paying for PPIR this year, MAM is nearly twice as much. Who will cornerwork? You know our people won't take 2 extra days off and drive 10 hours for $70/day. Even if we doubled the pay I bet they wouldn't come, but let's say we do that. Without a long term arrangement with a local ambulance company, that service will also cost more. All the support staff that gets hotel rooms covered is also staying twice as many nights.

So, because the costs have virtually doubled and half the club would skip it....your entry fees just went up 300-400% for that event. Still wanna go?

[ebazyl]

Jason brings up a good point: If I knew exactly what they are improving and when I would have less heartburn.

I still disagree with him on buying Mayo in 5 Gallon Sam's Club drums.

[Lel]

I still disagree with him on buying Mayo in 5 Gallon Sam's Club drums.

mayo is gross... its ketchup! ketchup that isnt kept in the refrigerator!

haha

[ebazyl]

mayo IS gross :up:

[Lurch]

If the only reason to run there is the thought that we are not going to have a track in 06 then maybe we should look elsewhere to race. Other clubs run plently of out-of-state races. I know of 3 tracks with in 10 hours of Denver.

You must have a pretty short memory....do you not remember the uproar when we even suggested the possibility of an out-of-state race? I remember more than 30 people being opposed.

Besides that, both Sandia and MAM cost more to rent than what we are paying for PPIR this year, MAM is nearly twice as much. Who will cornerwork? You know our people won't take 2 extra days off and drive 10 hours for $70/day. Even if we doubled the pay I bet
\ they wouldn't come, but let's say we do that. Without a long term arrangement
with a local ambulance company, that service will also cost more. All the support staff that gets hotel rooms covered is also staying twice as many nights.

So, because the costs have virtually doubled and half the club would skip it....your entry fees just went up 300-400% for that event. Still wanna go?

Glenn,

I have one word Steamboat. This club would travel up there every year (granted it's only 3 hours away) except for the last 3 fronting 1/2 of the bill for the construction of the track.bridges, very expensive rooms for the corner workers, etc. If that race ever had a problem with weather or poor attendence this club would not exist. Racers would take 4 days off work and go stay in $400 a night condos just to race on Sunday.

My problem with this post is we are asking questions and all you do is slam our solutions. Maybe if you answered the questions we have we would feel
at little more at ease.

Glenn to answer your question about MAM for the price of the weekend, yes it's expensive, but it also includes ambulence,corner workers etc. So if you factor those expenses in the cost is not much more then what we pay now to rent a track and pay all the extra expenses.

Besides if we promote MAM a little more people would want to go. I never did until I found out they have casinos and boobie bars 30 minutes away. I'm now looking at our schedule,CMRA and CRA and seeing if I can make a race or two.

Lurch

[Anonymous]

ummm......Can anyone name a track in Colorado that DOESN'T have a wall at the exit of a turn?? That's right, there isn't one...
La Junta? :dunno:

[ebazyl]

There is actualy a wall coming on to the stait. :|

[Anonymous]

I know there's a wall along the straight, I just couldn't remember how close to the corner it started. Besides, isn't there some run-off between the track & the wall there?

[ebazyl]

I think there is about a 5-20 foot paved run off, not sure if you can blow of on that turn.

[The GECCO]

My problem with this post is we are asking questions and all you do is slam our solutions. Maybe if you answered the questions we have we would feel at little more at ease.

Doug, I answered most of the questions about what is planned for the track and the spectators to the best of my abilities (given the information available to me) at the last two general meetings that you haven't bothered to attend. At this point there is nothing I could say that would placate you.

As far as slamming your solutions - the only "solutions" I see here are to change the schedule....it's a little late for that. I announced LONG ago that 05 would almost certainly have a CDR date and, as I said before, not gotten a single email or phone call from someone who specifically said "I don't think we should go there".

You know, it wasn't long ago you were on the board and were very vocal about insulting people who stirred the pot in exactly the fashion you are doing here. Funny how a few months can change things....if you are so concerned why not gather up the names of your 30+ riders and present a statement on their behalf at either a board or general meeting? I guess it's just easier to bitch in a public forum that has very little to do with the club itself.

I'm done here, I tried to resist getting involved in this discussion here because I knew it would be exactly this pointless, but it didn't work...my mistake. Flame on.

[Lurch]

My problem with this post is we are asking questions and all you do is slam our solutions. Maybe if you answered the questions we have we would feel at little more at ease.

Doug, I answered most of the questions about what is planned for the track and the spectators to the best of my abilities (given the information available to me) at the last two general meetings that you haven't bothered to attend. At this point there is nothing I could say that would placate you.

As far as slamming your solutions - the only "solutions" I see here are to change the schedule....it's a little late for that. I announced LONG ago that 05 would almost certainly have a CDR date and, as I said before, not gotten a single email or phone call from someone who specifically said "I don't think we should go there".

You know, it wasn't long ago you were on the board and were very vocal about insulting people who stirred the pot in exactly the fashion you are doing here. Funny how a few months can change things....if you are so concerned why not gather up the names of your 30+ riders and present a statement on their behalf at either a board or general meeting? I guess it's just easier to bitch in a public forum that has very little to do with the club itself.

I'm done here, I tried to resist getting involved in this discussion here because I knew it would be exactly this pointless, but it didn't work...my mistake. Flame on.

Ummmm No you didn't:


Officer?s reports:
Ø President?Glenn Conser
· Banquet tickets?will try to get the remainder in the mail to people this Friday or Saturday. There may be a few extra tickets available at the door for purchase there. Still looking for novices to work their 2005 hours off by working the door. Glenn needs a fairly accurate head and meal count almost immediately. If you buy at the door, you may not get your first meal choice, so be prepared.
· New track?a new piece of property has been chosen and is under negotiation. A letter of intent has been drafted.
· The 2005 schedule has been set. Glenn is working on contracts for the various tracks. PPIR has been signed; the rest are in the works.



You would think after being on the board for 4 years and missing 3 meetings in those 4 years I could finally miss one and not get reamed. Guess Not...

Yes Glenn you are right about me being vocal about people stirring the pot. Who I don't like stirring the pot is people who haven't been involved in the MRA in years and still voice their opinion. Once again you would think that after 15 years of racing,2 years of Start Finish, and 5 years on the board I could stir the pot and get my questions answered.

You are also correct that I like yourself don't like to voice my opinion on a site that "that has very little to do with the club itself" but like I said the MRA site sucks.( Why isn't the hotwasabi site being used?) So I decided to use a site that has a lot of racers on it,new racers on it, and you thought so highly of this site you gave them free admission to the last race. I know it was my idea but everyone voted.

Oh and it's never too late to be safe.

Shall I move on to my next bitch or just be quiet like everyone else. Including the board....

Lurch

[NineTwoFour]

Here's my only concern. I'm not trying to criticize ANYONE.

As a newer racer, whom doesn't have the experience to really judge the safety of one venue vs. another... I have to rely upon the discretion and experience of the board members to ensure that I am not exposing myself to unneccessary risk.

Sure, I can go out there and ride a bit more conservatively... but what if the guy or gal behind me is riding balls to the wall and takes both of us out in one of these questionable spots?

So I'm torn here. I have spoken to many people whom I respect and trust in the MRA... and they fall on both sides of the issue. So who do I trust?

I don't want this issue to be decided by political BS within the club, or pressure over our relationship with CDR. I want this issue to be about the safety of all the racers in the MRA. Like it was mentioned before, a vast majority of us have to go to work on Monday morning so we can pay our mortgages.

All I want from this is to be assured that the board is looking out for my safety as well as the long term interests of the MRA.

[Cyalaytr]

just as my 2 cents in that we (CFRSR) just hosted a free club track day there and had 170+ people sign the release form. I cant tell you how many total people we had on the track for the given day but I can tell you that we ran from morning til we got rained out and had 25-35 people on the track at any given time divided into groups of those who had never been on the track / some track riding and those with experiance /raced. Durning the day we only had 2 people go down. 1 was a new rider who hit some oil from a blown motor and 1 was a younger guy we highsided or low sided out of turn 4. We were running speed and then sum with the experianced bikes and as stated before if you knew what to look for ( a few patchy pavements spots no worse then anything I have seen in the rats nest at SCR the track really isnt that bad. As for the wall ... yes it is a wall and a solid one at that. But in the years I was with the MRA and the many years I have watched the MRA the wall was the least of the worries on that track. The bridge has taken more people I think or even the dragon slide. Do I run as fast as Glenn, Ricky, or the any of the other experts... ummmmmmmmm NO! But if they are the experts they claim to be they race like Glenn said the track not each other. How fast one can safely go to win given the risks involved. If it started raining or your tires start to go you make changes and compensate for what you know will make you go down. The track and been worked on, ie patches, paint, items moved, etc. Is it the best track? No. Is it the worst track? No. We probably ran CDR for test and tunes at least 10 times last year and the only time we had someone go down was do to the fact they went off the track after trying to miss a rider who sat up in the dragon slide and grabbed a handful of brakes thinking he had over shot it. We play there, granted that isnt racing but we do have current MRA racers in our club who practice they as well and though they may or may not like it I have never heard a word about NOT WANTING TO or WOULD NOT RACE on that track if they had to.

IMO my 2 cents. :|

[The GECCO]

I don't know why I bother, but I can't let this one go...


I announced LONG ago that 05 would almost certainly have a CDR date <snip>

Ummmm No you didn't: **quote from Jan '05 minutes**

From the General Meeting minutes on the MRA site:

August '04

Are now revisiting the idea of racing at Continental Divide Raceway. The new manager there is making an effort to improve the facilities, but the surface hasn’t been repaved. Glenn will be going to a track day there in a week to see what the current conditions are. The CMC plans (in the event that SCR is not extended) to bargain as a group to offer CDR a specified number of guaranteed track days in exchange for certain improvements.
September '04

CDR—still considering going back there on a regular basis. Are waiting until we are 100% certain that SCR is not going to be extended for next year. Will then go to CDR collectively to bargain (30-40 dates/year in exchange for improvements). Some discussion of the out of state track options and the problems involved with those
October '04

2005 season schedule—CDR has not yet prepared a contract for next year. Will be uncertainty until November 7th as to whether SCR will or will not continue to exist. PPIR has not yet set rates for 2005, which will determine if we can run an additional race there. The only thing that is certain is that we will be at PPIR the weekend before the AMA is. He’s hoping to have 3 Pueblo races, 3 CDR races, 2 La Junta races, and 2 PPIR races. Glenn is also still considering scheduling a race on a 3-day weekend, where the Sunday schedule is run on both Sunday and Monday for double points.
November '04

· Schedule—is dependant upon whether or not SCR will be there next year. Glenn is trying to spread things out a little bit. If no SCR, will be 4 Pueblos, 2 PPIRs, 2 CDRs, and 2 La Juntas. If SCR continues for next season, will try to have 3 Pueblos, 2 SCR, 2 PPIR, 2 La Junta, and 1 CDR. Right now, we do not conflict with MotoGP, the Pike’s Peak hill climb, or Copperfest. Copperfest should be on its usual date (8/20 & 8/21), unless they change like last year. Pueblo will be a double header over Labor Day in September, but no other races are planned for holiday weekends. The double header will consist of a normal Saturday, and then we will run the Sunday schedule twice—once on Sunday and once on Monday. The second PPIR date will be 10/1 and 10/2 for certain.
CDR—they have put out for bids to repave the problem areas of the track. The grandstands will be torn down and paved in for more parking. The upper and lower paved areas will be used for pit area. Still looking for answers on spectator parking.



Shall I move on to my next bitch or just be quiet like everyone else. Including the board....
If this is the way you are planning to present the rest of your arguments you may as well stay quiet, I don't have time for this crap

[Devil954]

Arghh! sounds like its set in stone ,If we are going to be there anyway might as well leave this alone its getting ugly. Cant we all just get along :lol:

[Lurch]

Glenn,

I'm not arguing the fact that we are racing there. I get that and know that. Besides your quotes/statements at the meetings do not answer my questions.

I asked 3 questions and you simple with not answer them.

1. Will we race there if the improvements are not made?

2. Will we have 2 schools there if the improvements are not made?

3. Why after previous boards deemed the track unsafe are we racing there if the improvements are not made?

That is all I want to know. I get that we are racing there. One more thing if you don't have time for the members that elected you then what do you have time for?

Lurch

[The GECCO]

1. Will we race there if the improvements are not made?

2. Will we have 2 schools there if the improvements are not made?

3. Why after previous boards deemed the track unsafe are we racing there if the improvements are not made?
1. I don't know yet, but it isn't a decision that HAS to be made in February, is it? Just like what happened with SCR a few years ago we may not make that decision until the day of the race, regardless of whether or not the improvements have been made.

2. Given the weather between now and then and the backlog faced by paving crews from last years wet summer it's very doubtful the paving will be done by April, so yes.

3. I will point out that this question assumes the answer to #1 is an unqualified "yes"; quite an assumption on your part. The question would be more appropriate without the last 6 words. Either way, the answer is: Because things change - we aren't in the same situation we were then and the track is not being run by the same people it was then. The current owners show the desire to bring the track back to where it needs to be if the clubs show some good faith that we will race there. Will it actually happen? I dunno, my crystal ball is broken, but I do know that to simply turn our backs without even giving them a chance would be foolish... especially if, by some unfortunate set of events, the "new track" never becomes a reality.



That is all I want to know. I get that we are racing there. One more thing if you don't have time for the members that elected you then what do you have time for?
I have plenty of time for members who bring up concerns or questions in a proper, polite and constructive manner. For you to publicly bash my decisions, make false statements about what I have and have not said, and just be sarcastic ass in general is what I don't have time for.

[Lel]

just as my 2 cents in that we (CFRSR) just hosted a free club track day there and had 170+ people sign the release form. I cant tell you how many total people we had on the track for the given day but I can tell you that we ran from morning til we got rained out and had 25-35 people on the track at any given time divided into groups of those who had never been on the track / some track riding and those with experiance /raced. Durning the day we only had 2 people go down. 1 was a new rider who hit some oil from a blown motor and 1 was a younger guy we highsided or low sided out of turn 4. We were running speed and then sum with the experianced bikes and as stated before if you knew what to look for ( a few patchy pavements spots no worse then anything I have seen in the rats nest at SCR the track really isnt that bad. As for the wall ... yes it is a wall and a solid one at that. But in the years I was with the MRA and the many years I have watched the MRA the wall was the least of the worries on that track. The bridge has taken more people I think or even the dragon slide. Do I run as fast as Glenn, Ricky, or the any of the other experts... ummmmmmmmm NO! But if they are the experts they claim to be they race like Glenn said the track not each other. How fast one can safely go to win given the risks involved. If it started raining or your tires start to go you make changes and compensate for what you know will make you go down. The track and been worked on, ie patches, paint, items moved, etc. Is it the best track? No. Is it the worst track? No. We probably ran CDR for test and tunes at least 10 times last year and the only time we had someone go down was do to the fact they went off the track after trying to miss a rider who sat up in the dragon slide and grabbed a handful of brakes thinking he had over shot it. We play there, granted that isnt racing but we do have current MRA racers in our club who practice they as well and though they may or may not like it I have never heard a word about NOT WANTING TO or WOULD NOT RACE on that track if they had to.

IMO my 2 cents. :|

I have to disagree with you, this is the day that I was there. People were running at about 70% speed (if that) in the fast/expert session. We were not pushing hard. At most their were 15 people on the track, MAYBE 20. And we were all split up, we were not in a grid, and were not going 3 wide etc into a turn. That day does not compare to a race day. The most I saw on the track were maybe 25ish people, and they were in the first timer session so not moving fast to be a danger to eachother.

[Lurch]

Glenn,

Thank you for answering my questions that is all I have wanted in the first place.

As far as making false statements about what you said I don't see anywhere in here where I did that. But I could be wrong I have been before.

As far as publicly bashing your decisions well the last time someone didn't question our president we came up a tad short on the books. I just feel that decisions are being made by this board with out the knowledge that it takes to make those decisions.

I will now crawl back under my sarcastic rock and be quiet like the rest of the Borg.

Lurch

[nileator01]

I won't be racing at CDR this season, but I don't care that it's on the schedule. The track sucks, it's unsafe, and I had my worst crash ever there and am lucky not to have been killed. But a lot of other people like it, and I'm not going to say they can't race there because I don't like it.

If you don't like the track, it's conditions, or whatever, just don't sign up for that weekend. Take a weekend off. Volunteer that weekend to corner work, or anything else that the club needs.

Those that will be racing just shouldn't crash. Simple, right? (that was sarcasm by the way) Seriously, don't run off the track at the turn before the dragon slide. You will losse a lot more than points!


Lurch, it has been less than five years since MRA last raced there. We raced there in 2001. Just a clarification, I believe you stated previously that we haven't been there for five years.

[Deuce]

Here's my only concern. I'm not trying to criticize ANYONE.

As a newer racer, whom doesn't have the experience to really judge the safety of one venue vs. another... I have to rely upon the discretion and experience of the board members to ensure that I am not exposing myself to unneccessary risk.

Sure, I can go out there and ride a bit more conservatively... but what if the guy or gal behind me is riding balls to the wall and takes both of us out in one of these questionable spots?



Hey Rock I cant answer all those questions but I can tell you this. If somebody's riding like an ass gasket on ANY track we go to and plows into you because their riding over their head all your gonna get from Glenn is "thats racing" even if it's in practice. Trust me, been there and done that. Remember my exaust that got bent in almost a 90 degree angle at Pueblo last time we were there? Yeah nuff said.

I'll save you from somebody else telling you that if your nervous about safety conditions then don't race or don't show up. Since thats the attitude that will be presented.


Deuce

[Cyalaytr]

just as my 2 cents in that we (CFRSR) just hosted a free club track day there and had 170+ people sign the release form. I cant tell you how many total people we had on the track for the given day but I can tell you that we ran from morning til we got rained out and had 25-35 people on the track at any given time divided into groups of those who had never been on the track / some track riding and those with experiance /raced. Durning the day we only had 2 people go down. 1 was a new rider who hit some oil from a blown motor and 1 was a younger guy we highsided or low sided out of turn 4. We were running speed and then sum with the experianced bikes and as stated before if you knew what to look for ( a few patchy pavements spots no worse then anything I have seen in the rats nest at SCR the track really isnt that bad. As for the wall ... yes it is a wall and a solid one at that. But in the years I was with the MRA and the many years I have watched the MRA the wall was the least of the worries on that track. The bridge has taken more people I think or even the dragon slide. Do I run as fast as Glenn, Ricky, or the any of the other experts... ummmmmmmmm NO! But if they are the experts they claim to be they race like Glenn said the track not each other. How fast one can safely go to win given the risks involved. If it started raining or your tires start to go you make changes and compensate for what you know will make you go down. The track and been worked on, ie patches, paint, items moved, etc. Is it the best track? No. Is it the worst track? No. We probably ran CDR for test and tunes at least 10 times last year and the only time we had someone go down was do to the fact they went off the track after trying to miss a rider who sat up in the dragon slide and grabbed a handful of brakes thinking he had over shot it. We play there, granted that isnt racing but we do have current MRA racers in our club who practice they as well and though they may or may not like it I have never heard a word about NOT WANTING TO or WOULD NOT RACE on that track if they had to.

IMO my 2 cents. :|

I have to disagree with you, this is the day that I was there. People were running at about 70% speed (if that) in the fast/expert session. We were not pushing hard. At most their were 15 people on the track, MAYBE 20. And we were all split up, we were not in a grid, and were not going 3 wide etc into a turn. That day does not compare to a race day. The most I saw on the track were maybe 25ish people, and they were in the first timer session so not moving fast to be a danger to eachother.


Like I said.. just my opinion and everyone views things differently. I saw many people running at speed and I saw many people on the track at once. Did they start from a grid? No but they were sent out on the track at the same time and in which many were faster then other riders and made it more dangerous or a bigger risk because people were being lapped. But as I stated I personally have no issues of the track that would keep me from going there and nor would I have any reservations about recommending it to anyone to run on or race on knowing that the racer though they do travel faster have a better knowledge of what to look for. But like I said.. just my opinion. :roll:

[hcr25]

Actually we raced there in 2002,well i didnt i had nasty concussion that i got at 2nd creek 3 weeks before.
mike

[Anonymous]

Hey Rock I cant answer all those questions but I can tell you this. If somebody's riding like an ass gasket on ANY track we go to and plows into you because their riding over their head all your gonna get from Glenn is "thats racing" even if it's in practice. Trust me, been there and done that. Remember my exaust that got bent in almost a 90 degree angle at Pueblo last time we were there? Yeah nuff said.

I'll save you from somebody else telling you that if your nervous about safety conditions then don't race or don't show up. Since thats the attitude that will be presented.

Let's keep it on topic here Deuce. You're talking about RACERS causing an unsafe condition. This thread is about a TRACK causing unsafe conditions. These are at complete opposite ends of the spectrum. And yes, if someone decides they're better than physics and fucks up, they may take someone out. I see this several times a season. Unfortunately, unless they're chronically riding stupid, there isn't anything we can do about it - a moments lapse of judgement is all it takes sometimes, and by then the damage is done. So yes - it IS racing. It is an inherent risk in what we do here, that someone will act retarded and cornhole you. I seem to remember a primered R6 a couple seasons ago that just didn't brake into the 88's and took a guy out, but stayed in himself.

I believe the Board is addressing the TRACK safety concerns presented. We've given CDR a list of things that need to be taken care of. We're not out of options if this doesn't happen, however the new management there seems commited to our business and we need to give them some time to work on this. You all are bitching about the track, but let's not forget this is still FEBRUARY. There is quite a bit of time left for them to work on it. We've shown the interest and agreed to go there, they've agreed to make something happen with our issues. It's their play, now we wait and see.

As for RACERS causing safety problems, it isn't Glenn's call to make. It's mine. If you think someone is repeatedly being a dipshit out there and for some reason I don't already know about it, you are always welcome to come find me and bring it to my attention. I will watch said person and take action if I feel it's necessary. However, I don't know what you're expecting from anyone if a single event causes a wreck. It isn't like I can black flag them once they're on the ground. It's harsh, it's callous, but it is racing. I'm sorry if you were looking for a more sympathetic response but I believe this is the fairest and most objective approach to take. I can't charge them for your parts, and if the situation were reversed you'd be crying foul if I came after you for a single event that got out of control. IMO, if anything is to be done (such as an apology or whatever) that is between the people affected, and not any board member or race official's place unless a clear rule violation took place.

[Devil954]

:lol: Funny Ralph I remember that R6 too because I was the guy He hit . that was an episode of Ernest goes racing." Know what I mean (VERN) " :P

[Lel]

I believe the Board is addressing the TRACK safety concerns presented. We've given CDR a list of things that need to be taken care of. We're not out of options if this doesn't happen, however the new management there seems commited to our business and we need to give them some time to work on this. You all are bitching about the track, but let's not forget this is still FEBRUARY. There is quite a bit of time left for them to work on it. We've shown the interest and agreed to go there, they've agreed to make something happen with our issues. It's their play, now we wait and see.


Ralph thats right on topic... thats all I want to know and and as you said, and I said early, it is still only FEBRUARY.

I would like to know what was asked to be changed, thats all im wondering.

lel

[Buddau]

CDR, it's a challenge, I'm racin it!
That is what I signed up to do!
I agree, CDR is more of a challenge safety wise. I am just not going to push as hard at CDR.

[Jim Brewer]

This certainly is stimulating discourse on CDR. I just can't help but weigh in on a discussion being held with such high propriety.

My interest was caught by the reference to Steamboat as support for attendence estimation at MAM.

First, I've been to MAM and I've been to Steamboat. MAM is no Steamboat. Suggesting that people would travel to race at MAM because they would travel to race at Steamboat is laughable.

Second, I found it interesting that one would bring up Steamboat during a discussion about CDR safety. I raced at the 'boat every year from '91 through the last '98 race. It was obviously unsafe -- certainly much less safe than CDR. Even so, to the best of my knowledge NOBODY ever suggested that we cancel the event there and go to Second Creek, even when it was snowing.

Hmmm... why?

Could safety really be the issue? Or is there another agenda afoot with those being most vocal about cancelling CDR? Could those opposed to CDR be doing so because of an old axe that needs grinding? Or could there be a political motiviation (of the nature that "the board" it often accused)?

So I would ask those against racing @ CDR for safety reasons, if we were to get Steamboat back, would you race there?

[Deuce]

Hey Rock I cant answer all those questions but I can tell you this. If somebody's riding like an ass gasket on ANY track we go to and plows into you because their riding over their head all your gonna get from Glenn is "thats racing" even if it's in practice. Trust me, been there and done that. Remember my exaust that got bent in almost a 90 degree angle at Pueblo last time we were there? Yeah nuff said.

I'll save you from somebody else telling you that if your nervous about safety conditions then don't race or don't show up. Since thats the attitude that will be presented.

Let's keep it on topic here Deuce. You're talking about RACERS causing an unsafe condition. This thread is about a TRACK causing unsafe conditions. These are at complete opposite ends of the spectrum. And yes, if someone decides they're better than physics and fucks up, they may take someone out. I see this several times a season. Unfortunately, unless they're chronically riding stupid, there isn't anything we can do about it - a moments lapse of judgement is all it takes sometimes, and by then the damage is done. So yes - it IS racing. It is an inherent risk in what we do here, that someone will act retarded and cornhole you. I seem to remember a primered R6 a couple seasons ago that just didn't brake into the 88's and took a guy out, but stayed in himself.

I believe the Board is addressing the TRACK safety concerns presented. We've given CDR a list of things that need to be taken care of. We're not out of options if this doesn't happen, however the new management there seems commited to our business and we need to give them some time to work on this. You all are bitching about the track, but let's not forget this is still FEBRUARY. There is quite a bit of time left for them to work on it. We've shown the interest and agreed to go there, they've agreed to make something happen with our issues. It's their play, now we wait and see.

As for RACERS causing safety problems, it isn't Glenn's call to make. It's mine. If you think someone is repeatedly being a dipshit out there and for some reason I don't already know about it, you are always welcome to come find me and bring it to my attention. I will watch said person and take action if I feel it's necessary. However, I don't know what you're expecting from anyone if a single event causes a wreck. It isn't like I can black flag them once they're on the ground. It's harsh, it's callous, but it is racing. I'm sorry if you were looking for a more sympathetic response but I believe this is the fairest and most objective approach to take. I can't charge them for your parts, and if the situation were reversed you'd be crying foul if I came after you for a single event that got out of control. IMO, if anything is to be done (such as an apology or whatever) that is between the people affected, and not any board member or race official's place unless a clear rule violation took place.


Hey I was just answering that one question. I never said Glenn was a dick for his response to me or that there was something else that could be done about the situation. You get plowed into and your shit outta luck. "Thats racin". As far as the dude that ran into me he apologized more than once and offered whatever help he could. That was good enough for me. Don't get me wrong I was still pissed about the situation more because it happened in practice and not a race but what was I gonna do? Shit happens. I made the comment to Glenn only because the guy was a buddy of his and relatively new to racing. So I thought he might want to share a little advice that no trophy's are handed out in practice and save the guy from binning it when it didn't count. Not to try and get the dude in trouble.


Deuce

[Lurch]

Jim it's OK you can say Lurch/Doug instead of "one" you won't hurt my feelings.

Lurch/Doug/"one"

[Devil954]

This is what I am getting here "one" sarcastic ass(that would be Lurch which isnt to far off base :P ) said she said what he said was true but it wasnt or was it but then Deuce (who had a wreck coming anyway :lol: ) crashed and he said that she said it wasnt because of that thing that guy did :lol: C'mon everybody lighten up were gonna be racing in a few months :headbang:

[*MV* #33]

So I would ask those against racing @ CDR for safety reasons, if we were to get Steamboat back, would you race there?


I'm against it for safety reasons... Would I race steamboat? Dunno never been there but if its unsafe prolly not.

[Deuce]

Steamboat would be pretty fun though. Even if we all had to turn it back a few notches. :D I don't know the track layout or the safety issues but I think it'd be badass if we went back there.


p.s. Eat my ass Ed. I wrecked later that day ya tool. :lol:



Deuce

[Devil954]

Just thought I would try to spin a little humor into this thread , Maybe if all you guys didnt have to work on them broke ass suzuki's all the time you wouldnt be so grumpy :lol:

[hcr25]

As far as CDR's safety goes, our other tracks are not all that much safer! There are walls all around PPIR and if you think they cant be hit ask Elton Curry. 2nd creek has some run off right up to the point that you hit some type off a wall.Pueblo has good run off in places but it is so bumby and has very large rocks and other debri all over.More then 1 racer has got hurt just hitting something on the ground in the run off area.La junta is almost our safest track,other then the barbwire fence in turn 1,2 and the barrel wall exiting the last turn.
Steamboat was a very fun place to race aswell as the most dangerous.No runoff anywhere.Curbs,fire hydrants,street signs where just some of the small dangers.
I can respect all of your opinons about CDR.I just thought you should think about the other tracks also.
mike

[Anonymous]

Mike makes good points. I almost put Zach into the wall at PPIR. I've seen guys run into the concrete at SCR and somersault over it almost into other parts of the track, or tag the tirewall in the house turn (several times) - and tires are not soft! Pueblo had a nice boulder field in it last season, if you miss the runoff on turn 1 there you can kiss your bike goodbye.

Each track has issues, problems, and bottom line - short of lining the entire thing with airbags and repaving it at the start of every season, there will not be a perfectly safe track out here. I think most of us however have learned where the problem areas on the other tracks are, and know to avoid them.

Not to minimize anything with CDR, but it isn't like we race on world class facilities out here from a safety perspective.

[Lel]

I agree with what mike and ralph has said, our tracks are not that much safer than CDR. Howerver I have to say each person has a line not to cross, and that point it sounds like is turn 9 at CDR. A concrete wall that is IN the line, I have been told at race speeds you might be rubbing against it w/ your knee on the exit (this isnt NASCAR). That and the surface isnt that hot (nor is scr or pueblo, but again that point at which your just saying come on)

Like I said, racing is racing and I am all for being there, I am still just posing the question: WHAT WAS REQUESTED TO BE FIXED BY THE CMC/MRA? Glenn can you let us know?

lel

[Anonymous]

Each track has issues, problems, and bottom line - short of lining the entire thing with airbags and repaving it at the start of every season, there will not be a perfectly safe track out here.My favorite line from this thread.