tase the lord

[whitebrad]

WEBSTER, Texas - Police used a Taser on a pastor and pepper spray to disperse his congregants Wednesday after the pastor allegedly interfered with a traffic stop in the church parking lot.

Congregants say they were in the Iglesia Profetica Peniel church for an early morning prayer when pastor Jose Elias Moran went to assist the stopped driver, a church member, by asking the police what had happened.

An incident report on the Webster police department's Web site said Officer Raymond Berryman tried to calm Moran and arrest him. But police say he pushed the officer, went inside the church and returned with 40 other congregants.


The congregants say Moran fled into the church when the officer grew angry and began to yell, and Moran's family disputes that the pastor touched the officer.

Moran's son Miguel said 30 witnesses saw the officer turn aggressive and repeatedly kick the church door. Several members were hit with pepper spray and children were present, Miguel Moran said.

"They treated him as if he were a drug dealer or murderer, but he is a pastor that tries to help the community," Moran said. "The police always want to be right but they are not."

Heart condition
Moran's wife, Maria, said she tried to help her husband after he was hit with the Taser but police threatened to arrest her.

"My husband has a heart condition and with electrocution who knows what could've happened," Maria Moran said, referring to the Taser's electrical shock.

"A pastor has to tend to his flock," she said. "That is all he was doing."

Speaking from a hospital bed Wednesday night, Moran told The Associated Press he planned to hire an attorney to file charges against the officer. He was being held at the hospital overnight for additional tests.

Police did not immediately return calls seeking comment and more details of the incident. Police Sgt. James Lovel did not specify Moran's status, except to say he was in custody and negotiations for bail were taking place Wednesday night.

Webster is a suburb southeast of Houston.

[Captain Obvious]

Interested to hear the full story, but the initial report sounds like the Pastor interfered with a traffic stop, assaulted an officer, fled the scene and then was tazed when the pastor organized a mob. His wife then interfered after he was tazed. Him being a pastor has no impact on the law.


You wanna be shocked, check this story out. These stupid fukkers seem to be getting what they deserve.
http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/gwinnett/stories/2009/07/02/taser_waffle_house.html?cxntlid=homepage_tab_newst ab

[whitebrad]

now, i am not a fan of the policia, mainly because it usually seems like they believe that they are an authority figure. That is contrary to all that i believe about these united states, but that is what it has evolved into... so sad...

but my comment is one of mere speculation... most pastors in spanish churches wear vestments (even the non-catholics wear the robes), now i am not 100% sure how it went down, but i would guess that the pastor was out front of the church, possibly greeting the congregants, which is a common practice, during the stop.

i am just guessing that the situation was one that could have easily been diffused had the officer addressed the pastor, who i would think did not even pose a threat...

i don't know. i was not there, but i am a supervisor at an answering service, and deal with all escalated calls overnight... there are ways to handle escalated situations, this solution does not seem to be the most prudent way...

in another bout of pure speculation, i would wonder if the pastor was trying to help, considering it is most likely a predominately spanish speaking congregation, and may have hoped to help with any language barrier and etc that can arise in a situation like that. in my ethnic studies class we studied the immigrant culture from Mexico and in that culture, the preist is one of the central authority figures. This could have influenced both the actions of the priest and the person in the vehicle...

i think that officers should be required to understand the cultures that they are working in. in the case of INFALLIBLE, i would guess he would need to understand many cultures, Blood gang, Monguls, Mexican and South American immigrants and etc...

i would guess that the psyche of an officer after a while on the force would be geared toward one of authority, although that seems to unravel into a robotic anger... there seems to be the same response in veteran prison guards, and without proper training, i would guess that the authority is very addicting, much like that famous prison guard study where part of the class were prisoners and part of the class were guards. We studied this in my Psych classes and the comments from the students on both sides were astounding...

I am more angered at a system that takes form over substance. I would venture to guess that a lot of officers are as well. I think that a bureaucracy will fail us as there seems to be no way to actually implement a true bureaucracy, as the gears inside of the machine are made of humans.

I think this situation mainly shows a general disconnect with the police and the communities. What ever happened to the beat cop model? What ever happened to sensible law enforcement? There are so many damn laws now that everything seems to be both legal AND illegal as soon as you get in the courtroom, and all of the precedences get tossed around!

[Dietrich_R1]

GOD IS ABOVE THE LAW!!!

Think the setting just makes a "goooood" story for some ID10T reporter to make into "news".


[QUOTE=Captain Obvious;474625]Interested to hear the full story, but the initial report sounds like the Pastor interfered with a traffic stop, assaulted an officer, fled the scene and then was tazed when the pastor organized a mob. His wife then interfered after he was tazed. Him being a pastor has no impact on the law.

[Tipys]

now, i am not a fan of the policia, mainly because it usually seems like they believe that they are an authority figure. That is contrary to all that i believe about these united states, but that is what it has evolved into... so sad...

but my comment is one of mere speculation... most pastors in spanish churches wear vestments (even the non-catholics wear the robes), now i am not 100% sure how it went down, but i would guess that the pastor was out front of the church, possibly greeting the congregants, which is a common practice, during the stop.

i am just guessing that the situation was one that could have easily been diffused had the officer addressed the pastor, who i would think did not even pose a threat...

i don't know. i was not there, but i am a supervisor at an answering service, and deal with all escalated calls overnight... there are ways to handle escalated situations, this solution does not seem to be the most prudent way...

in another bout of pure speculation, i would wonder if the pastor was trying to help, considering it is most likely a predominately spanish speaking congregation, and may have hoped to help with any language barrier and etc that can arise in a situation like that. in my ethnic studies class we studied the immigrant culture from Mexico and in that culture, the preist is one of the central authority figures. This could have influenced both the actions of the priest and the person in the vehicle...

i think that officers should be required to understand the cultures that they are working in. in the case of INFALLIBLE, i would guess he would need to understand many cultures, Blood gang, Monguls, Mexican and South American immigrants and etc...

i would guess that the psyche of an officer after a while on the force would be geared toward one of authority, although that seems to unravel into a robotic anger... there seems to be the same response in veteran prison guards, and without proper training, i would guess that the authority is very addicting, much like that famous prison guard study where part of the class were prisoners and part of the class were guards. We studied this in my Psych classes and the comments from the students on both sides were astounding...

I am more angered at a system that takes form over substance. I would venture to guess that a lot of officers are as well. I think that a bureaucracy will fail us as there seems to be no way to actually implement a true bureaucracy, as the gears inside of the machine are made of humans.

I think this situation mainly shows a general disconnect with the police and the communities. What ever happened to the beat cop model? What ever happened to sensible law enforcement? There are so many damn laws now that everything seems to be both legal AND illegal as soon as you get in the courtroom, and all of the precedences get tossed around!


All I heard is this is what I think and am guessing.

Also if this would have just been some guy it wouldn't have made the news. But being the guy was a pastor he is some how held higher? He is still just a man like the officer are or even you or I.

[Keepitgreen]

Hell, he lucky he didn't get shot.
Some places here in TX they shoot first and ask questions later.. lol

Don't tase me Bro!!

[Wintermute]

This is a problem because of the goddamn taser. Because they're "non-lethal", lazy cops use them in situations that should be handled with their bravery, wits, and mouths. I mean, did that idiot think that a bunch of church-goers was going to lynch his ass? Give me a break.

The thing is, Tasers are really not that safe. "+taser +death (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&rlz=1C1GGLS_enUS321US321&q=%2Btaser+%2Bdeath&aq=f&oq=&aqi=g10)" gets 400,000 hits on Google. They've become a tool for lazy cops that are ending up killing people all over the place.

[RCStylin']

He interfered with the police. He got tazed. He shouldn't be so stupid. Duh.

[Captain Obvious]

Well, you can do a search for tomato + bridge (http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&q=tomato+bridge&btnG=Google+Search) and get a ton of results using google. This doesn't mean there are actully any suspension bridges made out of tomatoes. In fact, if engineers weren't so lazy, perhaps they would stop using modern tools like cement and steel, they would use mud and sticks since we all know progress is evil.

More suspects and officers are hurt daily when they go hands on with a suspect than the occasional death that occurs (due to extraneous complications) due to being tased. It just doesn't get reported as it isn't sensational. Shame there isn't a check list the officer can ask the suspect before the officer had to do their job.

Are you on drugs?
Do you have any heart issues?
Are you sensitive and will your feeling be hurt if I escort you to the ground with an arm-bar take down?
Was your father there to raise you and prevent you from having authority figure issues?

[Captain Obvious]

I mean, did that idiot think that a bunch of church-goers was going to lynch his ass? Give me a break.


Well,
http://ctlibrary.com/ct/2002/augustweb-only/8-5-13.0.html

perhaps you forgot about the spanish inquisition, crusades, etc. Historically, I think more people have died due to religion than any other cause, except perhaps old age.

A mob is a mob. Doesn't matter what you do on sunday morning.

[Wintermute]

Well, you can do a search for tomato + bridge (http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&q=tomato+bridge&btnG=Google+Search) and get a ton of results using google. This doesn't mean there are actully any suspension bridges made out of tomatoes. In fact, if engineers weren't so lazy, perhaps they would stop using modern tools like cement and steel, they would use mud and sticks since we all know progress is evil.

More suspects and officers are hurt daily when they go hands on with a suspect than the occasional death that occurs (due to extraneous complications) due to being tased. It just doesn't get reported as it isn't sensational. Shame there isn't a check list the officer can ask the suspect before the officer had to do their job.

Are you on drugs?
Do you have any heart issues?
Are you sensitive and will your feeling be hurt if I escort you to the ground with an arm-bar take down?
Was your father there to raise you and prevent you from having authority figure issues?

"occasional deaths"? Tell that to the survivors. Those deaths are completely avoidable by cops dealing with situations the way they've dealt with them for centuries--with their brains first, then brawn if needed.

If a cop is too scared to deal with with their job without a "shoot first, ask questions later" electrical crutch, they should go get a job patrolling a mall. The public will be safer for it.

[BeoBe]

this could have been easlily avoided if the pastor would just kept his nose on his own face. If the cop isn't coming into direct contact with you or pulling you over, dont get your stupid ass involved. Im sorry but too many church goers, priests etc.. such as this guy acted as though he was of a higher power and walked away from the officer when he was trying to arrest him. This is called resisting arrest and technically is also fleeing from an officer as well.

Kicking the door? If you run from the cops they will do anything in their power to arrest you, kicking in your door, breaking your window etc. Easily avoided by not getting yourself involved.

No sypmathy for this stupid ass priest and im sure these 30 witnesses are bending the story to make the pastor look better. Im pretty sure that the officer is not in fault on this one.

If the pastor is so innocent etc. why did he even get himself involved? Now what pastors are getting bored so they are gonna drive around to all traffic stops wanting to know why he was being pulled over? Thats between the officer and the person getting pulled over, not yours buddy.. keep your nose on your face and let the officer do his job, he doesn't need you bullshit..