I'm not a peperoni fan

[dapper]

For those who question if someone eats meat and didn't receive the news from a reliable source, orthomolecular (http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v04n10.shtml)
Prevention must then be continued throughout childhood. To illustrate how extraordinarily important vitamin supplements are, consider this: Children who eat hot dogs once a week actually double their risk of a brain tumor. Kids eating more than twelve hot dogs a month have nearly ten times the risk of leukemia as children who eat none. (4) However, hot-dog-eating children taking supplemental vitamins were shown to have a reduced risk of cancer. (5)
Although this research was done over 14 years ago, remarkably little has been said of it in the news media. Howard Straus of the Gerson Institute comments: "When children die from small toy parts, the toys are instantly recalled. When the connection between hot dogs, ham and lunch meat is manifest, and it has been documented numerous times, silence." (6)
But hot dogs? Just how important a factor are hot dogs?
Americans eat an estimated 20 billion hot dogs per year. According to the American Meat Institute's "National Hot Dog and Sausage Council," on a single July 4 day alone, Americans eat "150 million hot dogs, enough to stretch from D.C. to L.A. over five times. During Hot Dog Season, Memorial Day to Labor Day, Americans typically consume 7 billion hot dogs or 818 hot dogs consumed every second during that period." (7) That is a lot of exposure.
What are hot dog eaters exposed to? Hot dogs and other "cured" meat products typically contain chemical additives such as sodium nitrite, a color and anti-bacterial preservative that has long been suspected as promoting cancer. (8, 9) Now there is a controversial television commercial that spotlights the risks to children. You can watch the commercial at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPaxW3BrgIY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPaxW3BrgIY) or http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/hurtful-food-cancerrisk-hotdogs-of-doom.html

[Nick_Ninja]

And because of your adverse paranoia about nitrites all it does is leave more of that tasty pie at Bostons for me. :D

Tofu dapper?

[Keepitgreen]

This is the only way to eat a dog.. unless your chinese or something..

[Shea]

Dana eats raw hot dogs, so now I think he has a brain tumor. It explains so much :)

[Nick_Ninja]

Dana eats raw hot dogs, so now I think he has a brain tumor. It explains so much :)

And what exactly is your explanation for this then?

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2510/3785922666_395939169d.jpg

[Devaclis]

I love raw Hebrew National hot dogs. Man oh man. I jsut got a new pack to. Ahh! The power of suggestion compels meeeeeeee@

[Nick_Ninja]

I suggest you wrap them in bacon and cover it with cheese. :drool:

[Shea]

And what exactly is your explanation for this then?

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2510/3785922666_395939169d.jpg

Horseman is gay...

[BHeth]

Little Caesar's has $5 pepperoni pizzas ready to go. Thanks for reminding me!

[dapper]

Step 1
Spread the hot dog bun and cross-braid with thick-cut peppered bacon.
Smother some Velveeta cheese across the thick-cut peppered bacon.

Step 2
Take the hot dog and fill it with bacon flavored cheese whiz.
Dip the bacon flavored cheese whiz hot dog in Velveeta cheese.
Wrap the Velveeta cheese coated bacon flavored cheese whiz hot dog with thick-cut peppered bacon.

Step 3
Lay the double layered thick-cut peppered bacon wrapped velveeta cheese coated bacon flavored cheese whiz hot dog onto the cross-braided thick-cut peppered bacon Velveeta cheese smothered hot dog bun.

Step 4
Cap the top of this cheesy swine with bacon peperoni and enjoy!
;)


Now repeat step 3 out loud 3 times in a row. :lol:

[zetaetatheta]

YUM:
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll78/manitoumike/hotdog-1.jpg

[Stank Juic3]

YUM:
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll78/manitoumike/hotdog-1.jpg

bahahaaahahhahaa wtf lol

[Keepitgreen]

YUM:
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll78/manitoumike/hotdog-1.jpg

He ain't no footlong from Sonic, but he'll do I rekon..
As long as he don't scamper off somewhere..

[Matty]

that Kobayshi guy must have a dozen tumors by now. then again he's not a child, so..... ok, nevermind.

[#1Townie]

For those who question if someone eats meat and didn't receive the news from a reliable source, orthomolecular (http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v04n10.shtml)


so is it the whole world should stop eating meat?? im sorry man imm not a big fan of being told what to do.. smoking is bad for you but i do it.. i fucking like it.. I LOVE A GOOD BBQ WITH REAL MEAT!!!!!!!!






i dont understand that just cuz people choose to eat meat veggi peps got to jump down our throat and tell us how un healthy the shit is.. you know what veggi eaters can go a head and live till their 140 fucking years old.. have fun living in a home being reduced to an infant.. ill take my heart attack at 60 still knowing i lived a good life and injoyed the short time on this planet..

guess what no matter how well you and well u stay in shape your going to die..:shocked:

[Tipys]

so is it the whole world should stop eating meat?? im sorry man imm not a big fan of being told what to do.. smoking is bad for you but i do it.. i fucking like it.. I LOVE A GOOD BBQ WITH REAL MEAT!!!!!!!!






i dont understand that just cuz people choose to eat meat veggi peps got to jump down our throat and tell us how un healthy the shit is.. you know what veggi eaters can go a head and live till their 140 fucking years old.. have fun living in a home being reduced to an infant.. ill take my heart attack at 60 still knowing i lived a good life and injoyed the short time on this planet..

guess what no matter how well you and well u stay in shape your going to die..:shocked:


I didnt think it would happen a post by townie that I agree with.






Also you know people that eat no meat are not healthier. They lose alot of good things that can't be made up by anything else.


Also I would never trust this information being given out.

1. your looking at kids. Hard to know want they are really eating.
2. how many hotdogs did you eat growing up?
3. Being everybody eats hotdogs and have eaten hot dogs why are there so many people that aren't sick?


It just seems like alot hippies trying to turn people into vegetarians.

[zetaetatheta]

When they make tofu look and taste like
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll78/manitoumike/grilled_steak.jpg
I'll go veggie!

[Captain Obvious]

Amen!

[dapper]

so is it the whole world should stop eating meat?? im sorry man imm not a big fan of being told what to do.. smoking is bad for you but i do it.. i fucking like it.. I LOVE A GOOD BBQ WITH REAL MEAT!!!!!!!!

i dont understand that just cuz people choose to eat meat veggi peps got to jump down our throat and tell us how un healthy the shit is.. you know what veggi eaters can go a head and live till their 140 fucking years old.. have fun living in a home being reduced to an infant.. ill take my heart attack at 60 still knowing i lived a good life and injoyed the short time on this planet..

guess what no matter how well you and well u stay in shape your going to die..
Let's see if this responds can occur without the character assassination. ha

What is a decision? How do we make a decision? What process occurs for the decision?
Our thinking -> beliefs -> expectations -> attitude -> behavior -> performance -> life.
Wayne Dyer wrote, Change our Thoughts Change our Life. (Boy was Wayne hitting the nail on the head) The (->) is an arrow.

Our teeth are intended to tear flesh, (meat). I believe you, (Townie) got the exact message that you, (Townie) were looking for. :rolleyes:
Real meat without pesticides, antibiotics, herbicides, gmo resistant specticides, and steroid residues are rare to find. BIG biz has changed live as we know it. Organic beef exists, however it is out numbered.

Processed foods lack nutritional value. (JOHNNYPAIGEROCKSAYSPERIOD)

Eat what you want to eat. Sleep the way you want to sleep. I simply said, and I quote "I'm not a pepperoni fan". (Spelling corrected)

A beef dog is different than a hot dog. Learn the difference, grasshopper!

We are all worm food eventually.

I didnt think it would happen a post by townie that I agree with.

Also you know people that eat no meat are not healthier. They lose alot of good things that can't be made up by anything else.

Also I would never trust this information being given out.

1. your looking at kids. Hard to know want they are really eating.
2. how many hotdogs did you eat growing up?
3. Being everybody eats hotdogs and have eaten hot dogs why are there so many people that aren't sick?


It just seems like alot hippies trying to turn people into vegetarians.
If the parents do not bring the items into the household, children are less likely to touch it, drink it, eat it, sniff it, and play with it.

I've never been a fan of hot dogs (http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts/foods-from-back-yard-burgers/8325/2), never bought any.

What are some of the leading causes of death? These diseases include stroke, type 2 diabetes, some types of cancer, and perhaps heart disease.
Do we remember health class? Fruits and Veggies (http://www.fruitsandveggiesmatter.gov/benefits/index.html) are pounded in our heads during grammar school. Are we eating 5-9 servings of fruits and veggies per day?
Do we really believe Ramen Noodles is nutrition?

One of the books I completed last year is called Acid & Alkaline by Herman Aihara. This isn't a standard collage course book either. Only 120ish pages.

Let's use Vitamin D, (VD) as the example. (Current hot topic (http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/showpost.php?p=486731&postcount=38))
VD is supplied sufficiently though sunlight, UVB. The news reports that our main source of VD is through milk, (which I have learned to dislike). The cow's milk has 0.003 total International Units, (IU) in 100 gr. of food. Milk at the grocery store has synthetic VD added to raise the level. Synthetic vitamins are not as bio-available to us, (ability to absorb, metabolize and utilize). Now shiitake mushroom (http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts/vegetables-and-vegetable-products/2487/2) has 2639 IU in 100 gr. of food. If we desire more VD. We can eat shiitake mushrooms or take VD3 after we know the proper amount to take for maintaining the optimum level from a VD blood serum test.

Millions of people have diabetes and do not know it.
Millions of people have cancer and do not know it.
Millions of people have genetic disease and do not know it.
Millions of people are overweight and do not know it.
Millions of people eat quantity over quality, become overweight and know it.
Just because someone does not fit the profile, does not mean there in excellent health.
Most people who are diagnosed with cancer, had it for 3-8 years before the number of cancer cells was high enough to measure. At times, the doctor has the nerve to call it an early stage.

I will include the conclusion from the previously mentioned book, Acid & Alkaline, (p 117).

Nature manifests the two antagonistic yet complementary powers in plants, animals, and things everywhere. The ancient Chinese wise men called these manifestations yin and yang. Modern science calls them positive and negative, plus and minus, electron and proton, expansion and contraction, induction and deduction, man and woman, male and female, and acid and alkaline.

Where do acid and alkaline come from? What is their origin? If you understand this, you can see an entirely different view of this world.

There is a Zen koan: "What is the sound of one hand?" Two hands create sound. Clapping cannot be created by only one hand. Zen students must answer this. In the same way, you cannot see the origin of acid and alkaline. What you see or taste is everything manifesting either as acid or alkaline. The origin of acid and alkaline is where there is no acid and alkaline - that is to say, where there is no sound, no light, no movement, no color, no hot, no cold, no acid, no alkaline, no left, no right, no old, no young, no pain, no joy... Buddhists call it ku, Taoists call it mu, Shintoists call it kami. This is the origin of acid and alkaline. Foods are carriers of these two forces, and eating food we produce antagonistic and complementary cells, muscles, nerves, hormones, enzymes, genes, organs, and thoughts.

Since our life is the manifestation of two forces, our actions, living and thoughts always have antagonism and contradiction. However, if there is antagonism, there should exist complementarity. Therefore, the most important lesson to learn from acid and alkaline is to accept an antagonism whenever you come across it, and turn it to complementarity in your life.

This is the real balancing of acid and alkaline. If the opposite of a deficient body is a nutrient-sufficient body. Would the opposite of disease be optimum health?

[Squisha]

I can clap with one hand.


I can snap my toes like fingers, too.

[dirkterrell]

Real meat without pesticides, antibiotics, herbicides, gmo resistant specticides, and steroid residues are rare to find. BIG biz has changed live as we know it.

When did this really start ramping up?

Dirk

[Nick_Ninja]

When did this really start ramping up?

Dirk

Organic movement began in the late '70's and early eighties. i worked for Horizon Organic Dairy toward the end of the original owners tenure and prior to the organization going totally corporate. Here in Colorado Coleman Beef have been at the forefront of pesticide / hormone free product for quite some time.

[dirkterrell]

Organic movement began in the late '70's and early eighties. i worked for Horizon Organic Dairy toward the end of the original owners tenure and prior to the organization going totally corporate. Here in Colorado Coleman Beef have been at the forefront of pesticide / hormone free product for quite some time.

I was wondering about the rise of the big biz part of it, e.g. widespread use of pesticides, hormones, etc.

Dirk

[#1Townie]

Let's see if this responds can occur without the character assassination. ha

What is a decision? How do we make a decision? What process occurs for the decision?
Our thinking -> beliefs -> expectations -> attitude -> behavior -> performance -> life.
Wayne Dyer wrote, Change our Thoughts Change our Life. (Boy was Wayne hitting the nail on the head) The (->) is an arrow.

Our teeth are intended to tear flesh, (meat). I believe you, (Townie) got the exact message that you, (Townie) were looking for. :rolleyes:
Real meat without pesticides, antibiotics, herbicides, gmo resistant specticides, and steroid residues are rare to find. BIG biz has changed live as we know it. Organic beef exists, however it is out numbered.

Processed foods lack nutritional value. (JOHNNYPAIGEROCKSAYSPERIOD)

Eat what you want to eat. Sleep the way you want to sleep. I simply said, and I quote "I'm not a pepperoni fan". (Spelling corrected)

A beef dog is different than a hot dog. Learn the difference, grasshopper!

We are all worm food eventually.

If the parents do not bring the items into the household, children are less likely to touch it, drink it, eat it, sniff it, and play with it.

I've never been a fan of hot dogs (http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts/foods-from-back-yard-burgers/8325/2), never bought any.

What are some of the leading causes of death? These diseases include stroke, type 2 diabetes, some types of cancer, and perhaps heart disease.
Do we remember health class? Fruits and Veggies (http://www.fruitsandveggiesmatter.gov/benefits/index.html) are pounded in our heads during grammar school. Are we eating 5-9 servings of fruits and veggies per day?
Do we really believe Ramen Noodles is nutrition?

One of the books I completed last year is called Acid & Alkaline by Herman Aihara. This isn't a standard collage course book either. Only 120ish pages.

Let's use Vitamin D, (VD) as the example. (Current hot topic (http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/showpost.php?p=486731&postcount=38))
VD is supplied sufficiently though sunlight, UVB. The news reports that our main source of VD is through milk, (which I have learned to dislike). The cow's milk has 0.003 total International Units, (IU) in 100 gr. of food. Milk at the grocery store has synthetic VD added to raise the level. Synthetic vitamins are not as bio-available to us, (ability to absorb, metabolize and utilize). Now shiitake mushroom (http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts/vegetables-and-vegetable-products/2487/2) has 2639 IU in 100 gr. of food. If we desire more VD. We can eat shiitake mushrooms or take VD3 after we know the proper amount to take for maintaining the optimum level from a VD blood serum test.

Millions of people have diabetes and do not know it.
Millions of people have cancer and do not know it.
Millions of people have genetic disease and do not know it.
Millions of people are overweight and do not know it.
Millions of people eat quantity over quality, become overweight and know it.
Just because someone does not fit the profile, does not mean there in excellent health.
Most people who are diagnosed with cancer, had it for 3-8 years before the number of cancer cells was high enough to measure. At times, the doctor has the nerve to call it an early stage.

I will include the conclusion from the previously mentioned book, Acid & Alkaline, (p 117). If the opposite of a deficient body is a nutrient-sufficient body. Would the opposite of disease be optimum health?


and after this post about un-healthy none organic blah blah blah.. im going to go to jack in the box and go get me 2 count them 2 beacin ultimate cheese burgers and 2 orders of beacon and cheader wedges.. hmmmmm it tastes so good to eat crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mental]

Correlation does not imply cause.

The first line of that article states that the majority of Americans do not eat right, in order for all of those allegations to be correct, the majority of Americans would have cancer and diabities. Even with those who don;t realize it, I do not see the number of hotdog eating Americans, much less pepperoni and the like, match the numbers of diabtetes and cancer here or in the world.

Certanly our eating habits are affecting our health, as well as the "fillers" used by a lot of convinence food. But the rise in cancer and other illnesses can easily be attributed to enviromental factors, lifestyle choices, inactivity, increased professional stressors and a host of other items we haven't completely wrapped our head around.

Few would argue that against organic being the way to go, but to attribute the declining health of our nation to hotdogs is just absurd.

Whats more is you claim that link is a reliable source, but the relaity is they are no different than any agenda pushing website. They often recommend megavitamin doses much larger than those considered medically necessary. Additionally, the vitamin megadoses advocated by orthomolecular medicine are unsupported by scientific consensus, and morseo, some vitamins are toxic in high doses.

Effectively they are the medical equivelient to a politcal pundit pushing an agenda under some name like Free Americans for Fairness kinda crap. You arrived at a conclusion, then found data to support it, which is why so many threads here get locked up when they fall into the politcal or religous arena. That doesn;t make you evil, it just makes you like most of the other politcal types here, left or right. Except you're pushing a diet agenda.

They have an agenda, hence any information proported or exposed is going to be slanted, right or wrong, to support their agenda.

I ain't saying your right or wrong, but a single-side of the issue aurgument from one biased source, that matmetically does not bear scrutiny, does not a scientific claim make.

So, on that note, its lunchtime, guess what my healthy 38 year old body is gonna eat?

[Nick_Ninja]

I was wondering about the rise of the big biz part of it, e.g. widespread use of pesticides, hormones, etc.

Dirk

The need to eradicate insects began here in Colorado in 1865 actually. The Colorado Potato beetle was a nightmare occurrence of the highest order.

http://www.chelseagreen.com/content/the-history-of-big-chemicals-war-on-food-1865%E2%80%942007/

Corporate agricultural use began rearing its ugly head when farmers and ranchers found that if you pump the cow full of growth hormone then you get more beef and more milk for the same input price of feed and water. And we feed this shit to our own kids and we wonder why our twelve year old daughters look like 27 year olds.

[Nick_Ninja]

And another good timeline:

http://www.google.com/search?q=history+of+pesticide+and+hormone+usage+in +food&hl=en&rlz=1T4ADBF_enUS297US298&sa=X&tbs=tl:1&tbo=u&ei=HmV8Su-uK4SCsgPQ_ITvCg&oi=timeline_result&ct=title&resnum=11

[Wyck]

LOL this thread is still alive???? You all are killing me. This resident vegetarian couldn't even get past the first three sentences of the post or even be bothered to click on the link to the article because it looked like a bunch of bs garbage being shoved down my throat. And you guys are hating on the veggies!!!!! hahahahahahaha

[Nick_Ninja]

LOL this thread is still alive???? You all are killing me. This resident vegetarian couldn't even get past the first three sentences of the post or even be bothered to click on the link to the article because it looked like a bunch of bs garbage being shoved down my throat. And you guys are hating on the veggies!!!!! hahahahahahaha

No hate here toward any veghead.

[dirkterrell]

The need to eradicate insects began here in Colorado in 1865 actually. The Colorado Potato beetle was a nightmare occurrence of the highest order.

http://www.chelseagreen.com/content/the-history-of-big-chemicals-war-on-food-1865%E2%80%942007/


Ok, so from that list it looks like the big production use started about the middle of the 20th century, driven a lot by dealing with the aftermath of WWII.

What I'm trying to wrap my head around is if all of this stuff is so godawful bad, why has our lifespan been monotonically increasing over the last century or so?

http://www.boulder.swri.edu/%7Eterrell/images/life_expectancy.gif

I pulled the data from the CDC web site here (http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/lifexpec.htm). It's obviously not killing us off very effectively.

Dirk

[Mental]

No hate here toward any veghead.

Me neither, more meat for us carnivores.

[Sleev]

YUM:
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll78/manitoumike/hotdog-1.jpg
aww puppa aww

[Sortarican]

That's why I shoot Bambi.
Free range, steroid fee, no antibiotics or animal based feed.
Bambi....it's whats for dinner.

Toula Portokalos (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0889522/): Ian's a vegitarian.
Aunt Voula (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0551908/): What do you mean he don't eat no meat?
[the entire room stops, in shock]
Aunt Voula (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0551908/): Oh, that's okay. I make lamb

[Nick_Ninja]

Ok, so from that list it looks like the big production use started about the middle of the 20th century, driven a lot by dealing with the aftermath of WWII.

What I'm trying to wrap my head around is if all of this stuff is so godawful bad, why has our lifespan been monotonically increasing over the last century or so?

http://www.boulder.swri.edu/%7Eterrell/images/life_expectancy.gif

I pulled the data from the CDC web site here (http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/lifexpec.htm). It's obviously not killing us off very effectively.

Dirk

It's not killin the population -- it just causes mutations to occur, subtle that they may be, in response to the introduction.

Here are a couple of articles:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0KFU/is_6_73/ai_n16912233/

and cows milk

http://www.naturalroute.com/content/rGST%20hormone%20in%20milk.html

[Devaclis]

you don't like pepperoni.

so you are fan of the sausage?

[Nick_Ninja]

you don't like pepperoni.

so you are fan of the sausage?

no......

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2510/3785922666_395939169d.jpg

[RajunCajun]

Correlation does not imply cause.

The first line of that article states that the majority of Americans do not eat right, in order for all of those allegations to be correct, the majority of Americans would have cancer and diabities. Even with those who don;t realize it, I do not see the number of hotdog eating Americans, much less pepperoni and the like, match the numbers of diabtetes and cancer here or in the world.

Certanly our eating habits are affecting our health, as well as the "fillers" used by a lot of convinence food. But the rise in cancer and other illnesses can easily be attributed to enviromental factors, lifestyle choices, inactivity, increased professional stressors and a host of other items we haven't completely wrapped our head around.

Few would argue that against organic being the way to go, but to attribute the declining health of our nation to hotdogs is just absurd.

Whats more is you claim that link is a reliable source, but the relaity is they are no different than any agenda pushing website. They often recommend megavitamin doses much larger than those considered medically necessary. Additionally, the vitamin megadoses advocated by orthomolecular medicine are unsupported by scientific consensus, and morseo, some vitamins are toxic in high doses.

Effectively they are the medical equivelient to a politcal pundit pushing an agenda under some name like Free Americans for Fairness kinda crap. You arrived at a conclusion, then found data to support it, which is why so many threads here get locked up when they fall into the politcal or religous arena. That doesn;t make you evil, it just makes you like most of the other politcal types here, left or right. Except you're pushing a diet agenda.

They have an agenda, hence any information proported or exposed is going to be slanted, right or wrong, to support their agenda.

I ain't saying your right or wrong, but a single-side of the issue aurgument from one biased source, that matmetically does not bear scrutiny, does not a scientific claim make.

So, on that note, its lunchtime, guess what my healthy 38 year old body is gonna eat?

Funny how everyone that tries to prove a point is biased agenda based, ha? Oh and agenda based, isn't merely trying to prove a point an agenda? I mean, if I want you to believe something I'm saying, isn't changing your mind about something my agenda? And does that make my information false or one sided because I'm only giving you one side. What's the other side, "I'm wrong even though I believe I'm right?" yeah, well that's kinda stupid....


It's not killin the population -- it just causes mutations to occur, subtle that they may be, in response to the introduction.

Here are a couple of articles:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0KFU/is_6_73/ai_n16912233/

and cows milk

http://www.naturalroute.com/content/rGST%20hormone%20in%20milk.html

Yeah, and advances in medical science have saved, and extended lives of patients, that were not possible even 10 years ago.

[Mental]

Funny how everyone that tries to prove a point is biased agenda based, ha? Oh and agenda based, isn't merely trying to prove a point an agenda? I mean, if I want you to believe something I'm saying, isn't changing your mind about something my agenda? And does that make my information false or one sided because I'm only giving you one side. What's the other side, "I'm wrong even though I believe I'm right?" yeah, well that's kinda stupid...

My piont is that the website was present as "reliable" which implies nuetrality and honesty. My reply is that by pushing a line of products, they have an agenda. Its not awareness, it capitlisim, which I have no issue with, but don't sell it to me as nuetral

Whats more is the OP stated this as reality with no other correlating sources. Call me stupid if you want, but after 3 degrees and a stack of position papers I have learned the art of research. It involves multiple sources.

By definition, an agenda is not trying to change someone's mind.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/agenda






Main Entry: agen·da
Pronunciation: \ə-ˈjen-də\
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin, neuter plural of agendum, gerundive of agere
Date: 1871
1 : a list or outline of things to be considered or done <agendas of faculty meetings>
2 : an underlying often ideological plan or program <a political agenda>
— agen·da·less \-də-ləs\ adjective



The key term being underlying, I.E not what is being presented. If you are trying to change my mind, its gonna be obvious. If you are trying to change my mind in order to sell a product, thats an agenda.

Feel free to use that Merriam Webster's link, it's free.

Finally, I never stated it was wrong, I pionted out some shortcomings in the math and the fact that no one can take a single piont of information and present it as trend, or even scentific. Maybe you should re-read the last line of what you quoted. Go ahead, I'll wait.

If you want to prove a piont, you do research from multiple sources, you examine the aurguments against you position, and make counterpionts, back up your position with figures, trends, and data.

[RajunCajun]

My piont is that the website was present as "reliable" which implies nuetrality and honesty. My reply is that by pushing a line of products, they have an agenda. Its not awareness, it capitlisim, which I have no issue with, but don't sell it to me as nuetral

Whats more is the OP stated this as reality with no other correlating sources. Call me stupid if you want, but after 3 degrees and a stack of position papers I have learned the art of research. It involves multiple sources.

By definition, an agenda is not trying to change someone's mind.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/agenda





The key term being underlying, I.E not what is being presented. If you are trying to change my mind, its gonna be obvious. If you are trying to change my mind in order to sell a product, thats an agenda.

Feel free to use that Merriam Webster's link, it's free.

Finally, I never stated it was wrong, I pionted out some shortcomings in the math and the fact that no one can take a single piont of information and present it as trend, or even scentific. Maybe you should re-read the last line of what you quoted. Go ahead, I'll wait.

If you want to prove a piont, you do research from multiple sources, you examine the aurguments against you position, and make counterpionts, back up your position with figures, trends, and data.

1. You want to throw a Webster's link around, like the Scholar that you sooo want to be(3 degrees and all), then use it to learn to spell, then to type, then to look up your own words. You have a couple mistakes, kind of surprising, coming from such an educated individual. I can't spell worth a crap either, but I'm not throwing the dictionary around.

2. I didn't call you stupid. If I did, it would have sounded like this, "You are stupid", but I doubt that you are. I thought your point was stupid but take that however you want.

3. I did not say that the definition of the word agenda was to change someone's mind, i merely said that changing someone's mind could be an agenda, in itself. See, not the same thing at all. Still waiting I hope......

4. Reliability has nothing, necessarily, to do with neutrality. It's more closely related to accuracy. That really has nothing to do with an agenda, does it.



Main Entry: 1re·li·able
Pronunciation: \ri-ˈlī-ə-bəl\
Function: adjective
Date: 1569

1 : suitable or fit to be relied on : dependable (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dependable)
2 : giving the same result on successive trials

^^I figured out how to use it. It's actually kind of fun;)

None of this really has anything to do with Dapper's opinions on Peperoni, so we can start another thread on definitions and trends and data, if you like.

[Mental]

1. You want to throw a Webster's link around, like the Scholar that you sooo want to be(3 degrees and all), then use it to learn to spell, then to type, then to look up your own words. You have a couple mistakes, kind of surprising, coming from such an educated individual. I can't spell worth a crap either, but I'm not throwing the dictionary around.

Really? Cuz I thought I saw a definition at the bottom of your post.

Yes, I sooo want to be a scholar, that’s why I have a picture of a cartoon squid drinking PBR in my avatar. I was qualifying myself before I presented my argument. Do a quick search of my posts and in addition to the consistent spelling and grammatical errors you seemed so keen on, you will find a rather impressive collection of irreverent, goofy and utterly useless posts.


2. I didn't call you stupid. If I did, it would have sounded like this, "You are stupid", but I doubt that you are. I thought your point was stupid but take that however you want.

I never accused you of that, I said call me stupid if you want. It was a transition from one point to another.


3. I did not say that the definition of the word agenda was to change someone's mind, i merely said that changing someone's mind could be an agenda, in itself. See, not the same thing at all. Still waiting I hope......

..and I disagreed. I still maintain an agenda is not attempting to change someone's mind. An agenda is another underlying purpose. A debate is an attempt to change someone's mind.

What’s more, you did actually say that changing someone’s mind is an agenda;

...Funny how everyone that tries to prove a point is biased agenda based, ha? Oh and agenda based, isn't merely trying to prove a point an agenda? I mean, if I want you to believe something I'm saying, isn't changing your mind about something my agenda? And does that make my information false or one sided because I'm only giving you one side. What's the other side, "I'm wrong even though I believe I'm right?" yeah, well that's kinda stupid....

Those are your exact words, emphasis added by me.


4. Reliability has nothing, necessarily, to do with neutrality. It's more closely related to accuracy. That really has nothing to do with an agenda, does it.

I never proposed that it did, my point is that the site is presented as reliable, yet it isn't. It is a single source with data but no correlation of the numbers of meat eaters vs. the cases of diabetes and cancer in the current US population. I stand by that point.




Main Entry: 1re·li·able
· Pronunciation: \ri-ˈlī-ə-bəl\
· Function: adjective
· Date: 1569
1 : suitable or fit to be relied on : dependable (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dependable)
2 : giving the same result on successive trials

^^I figured out how to use it. It's actually kind of fun


Hey, there’s the definition you said you weren't throwing around.

I stand again by my assertion that the link provided in the original post is neither "suitable or fit to be relied on, dependable, or gives the same result on successive trails." The numbers do not hold up under scrutiny, I don’t believe it can be relied on because they have an underlying purpose of pushing a vitamin based approach to preventative medicine, which some research reveals no scientific data to back the claims of that form of medicine.



None of this really has anything to do with Dapper's opinions on Peperoni, so we can start another thread on definitions and trends and data, if you like.

My post does. The link is a single point of slanted information pushing orthomolecular medicine, which I find to be questionable pseudo science. The OP and the sight make claims that hotdogs are processed meats are the largest cause of cancer and diabetes in this country. The agenda comes from the links that take you to the practice of orthomolecular medicine and unsubstantiated claims of it being the solution.

I disagreed, I still disagree and I stand by my points, definitions, and conclusions as being valid.

[Keepitgreen]

It's all propaganda!
Probably started by the damn PETA freaks..

Can we eat prairie dogs? What up with that little critter. Does it taste like chicken?

[zetaetatheta]

It's all propaganda!
Probably started by the damn PETA freaks..

Can we eat prairie dogs? What up with that little critter. Does it taste like chicken?

I like my prairie dog on "PETA" bread.

[dirkterrell]

As time allows, I've been looking at research on "healthy" diets. I came across an interesting paper in the JAMA:

http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/295/6/655

It was an 8 year study of nearly 50,000 women ages 50-79 to see if there was a measurable effect of a "healthy" diet on coronary heart disease (CHD), stroke and cardiovascular disease (CVD). From the paper:


Whether a single "healthy" diet could result in decreased risks of cancer and CVD has not been previously evaluated. The primary aim of the Women's Health Initiative (WHI) Dietary Modification Trial was to test whether behavioral intervention intended to produce a dietary pattern low in total fat, along with increased intakes of vegetables, fruits, and grains, would decrease the incidence of breast and colorectal cancer in postmenopausal women. A secondary aim was to test whether such a dietary intervention, which did not focus on the intake of specific fats, would also reduce the risk of CVD. This report compares incidence of CHD and CVD among postmenopausal women randomly assigned to either the dietary modification intervention or usual-diet comparison group during a mean of 8.1 years of follow-up.
The conclusion? Diet had no measurable effect.


Over a mean of 8.1 years, a dietary intervention that reduced total fat intake and increased intakes of vegetables, fruits, and grains did not significantly reduce the risk of CHD, stroke, or CVD in postmenopausal women and achieved only modest effects on CVD risk factors...In a paper (http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/295/6/629) looking at the effect on breast cancer, they found


...a low-fat dietary pattern did not result in a statistically significant reduction in invasive breast cancer risk over an 8.1-year average follow-up period.Colorectal cancer (http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/295/6/643)? No measurable effect:


In this study, a low-fat dietary pattern intervention did not reduce the risk of colorectal cancer in postmenopausal women during 8.1 years of follow-up.
These results were published in 2006. For such a large and extended experiment, I don't recall hearing anything about it. It should have been trumpeted wide and far by the press. I watch the news every day and read the news web sites and I never saw it.

It makes me wonder if there isn't a widespread but mistaken "obviousness" about the effect of diet on various diseases, similar to the sad history of mistaken assumptions about the cause of stomach ulcers. (If you're interested, I can detail it. It's a fascinating story.) The scientific process is a powerful way of figuring things out but it is done by humans who can often make erroneous assumptions. As a scientist myself, I always try to understand all of the assumptions that go into a particular topic I am researching.

Sometimes you miss something but that's where repeatability and peer review comes in. Sometimes though, a large majority of a field convinces themselves that something must be true based on some theoretical argument (and some of you might now better understand my questioning of anthropogenic global warming). A few will question the argument and do the experiment. Results will frequently be resisted, but eventually the truth emerges.

One example from my own field was the existence of binary stars in globular clusters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globular_cluster). Years ago people argued pretty convincingly that you wouldn't find them because the dynamical interactions in such tight clusters would rip them all apart. Being a naive grad student, I asked "Have you looked for them in actual clusters?" The answer was "Of course not! It would be a waste of valuable telescope time!" We looked anyway and found lots of them. Now the dynamicists argue that you have to have binaries in these clusters or they wouldn't exist! Experiment is the very essence of science and I always try to look for the answer there rather than "obvious" theoretical arguments. It works pretty well for a whole host of things from binaries in clusters, the effect of diet on health, to why your motorcycle isn't running.

Dirk

[Keepitgreen]

I must have missed it in the article..
I didn't see anything about working out and exercise..

So to me, these studies mean squat.
I would imagine that they will all change their stance in the future and say they were wrong.. Eat all the fried chicken you want, they all use healthy oil now..

[dapper]

Mental, please rephrase any outstanding question(s)...maybe by PM.

I did request for more details from our beloved gov't. It took a bit for even a response, however the ball is rolling.
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i252/dapperr/usdagmofeedq1edit.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i252/dapperr/usdagmofeedq2edit.jpg
I could post many many links to support the data I used, however that might not resolve the request.

Thanks for the links Jeff.

[chanke4252]

i started eating those morning star veggie dogs. I just don't trust those multi-meat things, like bologna and the typical hot dog....blegh. I love me some skinless beef franks though. Typically though my preference is something like Give me steak/ground beef or give me death/veggie dogs.

[chanke4252]

so is it the whole world should stop eating meat?? im sorry man imm not a big fan of being told what to do.. smoking is bad for you but i do it.. i fucking like it.. I LOVE A GOOD BBQ WITH REAL MEAT!!!!!!!!






i dont understand that just cuz people choose to eat meat veggi peps got to jump down our throat and tell us how un healthy the shit is.. you know what veggi eaters can go a head and live till their 140 fucking years old.. have fun living in a home being reduced to an infant.. ill take my heart attack at 60 still knowing i lived a good life and injoyed the short time on this planet..

guess what no matter how well you and well u stay in shape your going to die..:shocked:

Well, unless I missed something the problem isn't really because of the meat, it's because of the way it's produced (as cheaply as humanly possible, regardless of effects). This is why I don't eat chicken...EVER. Not because I hate chicken, because it's obviously delicious, it's just that it's raised in a foul, foul, foul way (as in make me want to throw up disgusting, not "this is immoral" disgusting). I don't even want to think about what actually goes into producing a hot dog, or those <$1 packs of sandwich meat.

I'd rather pay a couple bucks more for a pack of hot dogs or bit o chicken than eat poisonous garbage raised in satan's butthole.

[#1Townie]

Well, unless I missed something the problem isn't really because of the meat, it's because of the way it's produced (as cheaply as humanly possible, regardless of effects). This is why I don't eat chicken...EVER. Not because I hate chicken, because it's obviously delicious, it's just that it's raised in a foul, foul, foul way (as in make me want to throw up disgusting, not "this is immoral" disgusting). I don't even want to think about what actually goes into producing a hot dog, or those <$1 packs of sandwich meat.

I'd rather pay a couple bucks more for a pack of hot dogs or bit o chicken than eat poisonous garbage raised in satan's butthole.

and i dont realy care how it was raised.. i realy fucking dont.. i know chickens and most animals that we eat.. i learned how to cut open a turkys throat at a very young age.. no matter how clean you try to keep it the chickens will always eat their own shit!!!

we are a creature that went from eating what ever we could get our hands on and now cuz we have to have everything so clean people are dieing from eating veggies.. so real ill stick to using my own natural immune things and eat what ever the hell looks good.. i might pay for it later but im sure i wont die.. you might if u happen to find the tolet i just used.. but ill be ok.. DARWIN FOR THE WIN!!!

[Horsman]

Horseman is gay...
Not Gay!!! that was a total Man-Hug big boy!!!! :cry:

Now if I had my hands on Bob's Ass - then you could throw the Fag Flag for encroaching!!!

[#1Townie]

no cuz then even if you had done that its just cuz it was a good game.... right??

[Horsman]

no cuz then even if you had done that its just cuz it was a good game.... right??
I don't usually eat Hot dogs and I usually don't Hug Guys!!! :drink:
and Tampons are not just for Women anymore!!!!

[MetaLord 9]

I don't usually eat Hot dogs and I usually don't Hug Guys!!! :drink:
"usually" meaning more than 3 a day, right?