traffic citations to meet its budget goals

[dapper]

Sheriff's office sets traffic-citation goals (http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=156449&catid=188)

None of the jibbers in the world can cover up the quota these public service positions have delivered.

Speeders could be quick fix to help balance Denver budget (http://www.9news.com/rss/article.aspx?storyid=153088)

"We weren't necessarily looking for money. We were trying to find out where is a place where if we are gonna increase a fee or a fine, we're making the city better or safer."

:lol: It's about cash...

http://www.lolhome.com/img_big/funny-picture-9979523878.jpg

[WingZero992]

Well, shit, that makes perfect sense. Especially since I got pulled over two days ago and the cop essentially told me up front that I was pulled over for being on a sport bike. Awesome.

[asp_125]

Nothing we don't already suspect / know. Never has been about safety. .. well job safety for them maybe.

If it was ever about speed, there'd be technology to limit cars and bikes to say 80mph. Why do you think that's never happened? Cars (even econoboxes) that do 100... since when has there ever been a legal 100mph speed limit?

Cash cow.. and they know it.

[tecknojoe]

:lol:

http://www.lolhome.com/img_big/funny-picture-9979523878.jpg

[Wintermute]

Frankly, we get what we deserve. (I don't mean you guys specifically, I mean ALL of us.)

We treat politics like a goddamn sport, where all that's important is which side is "winning". Our political press is now the equivalent of horse race handicappers, every single thing has to be framed as to how it helps or hurts either party "in the election", not how it helps or hurts the country.

But the worst thing is that when it comes to the subject of paying for our gov't, you simply can't have an adult conversation. Nobody likes paying taxes, but half of our political system is completely irrational and delusional about the question: "How much taxes should be levied to provide even just basic services to a country of 310,000,000 citizens?" Or "How much taxes does it take to provide street lights in Colorado Springs?" Or "How much taxes does it take to keep teachers employed and keep class size down?"

The right's answer to every question is "Less than we're spending now, tax cuts!" It's just shallow, sound-bite politics, the modern equivalent of "Four legs good, two legs bad". There's no actual thinking or analysis, just blind idealogical rage.

So, it's ironic when we complain about our starved gov'ts coming after our favorite pastime, speeding, knowing many's stance toward taxes on this board.

http://www.trianglecat.com/blog/images/Karma.png

[Bueller]

Maybe the fuckers have enough of our money, they should just stop throwing it down the shitter.
There is sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much government waste, they need to figure out how to make the world go round with what they are already stealing from us

[TFOGGuys]

Frankly, we get what we deserve. (I don't mean you guys specifically, I mean ALL of us.)

...

So, it's ironic when we complain about our starved gov'ts coming after our favorite pastime, speeding, knowing many's stance toward taxes on this board.



The government is not starving, it's just outgrown its food supply. The typical politician (D or R), when confronted with a budget shortfall, doesn't think "What programs are we funding that just don't make sense?", he or she thinks "What can we do to increase revenue to allow the budget to grow at its normal rate?". It is past the time when we need to make a change in the attitude of our elected officials. They always sensationalize and go to cut what most would consider core services (police, fire, schools, street maintenance, etc), to garner taxpayer support for increased taxes and fees™ (Trademark, Bill Ritter). Why don't they go after the interpretive dance programs for at risk teens? Simple: Everyone gets a vote, regardless of their tax status. 41% of Americans pay NO income tax (I once was a part of that group), but still receive a plethora of services and entitlement programs that SHOULD NOT be administered by the .gov. Other than the military, there is virtually NOTHING that the government can administer in a more efficient, cost effective manner than the private sector.

While I'm ranting, I urge everyone to Clear the Bench (http://www.clearthebenchcolorado.org/) next month. Activism has NO PLACE in the Colorado Supreme Court. Fire 'em ALL! :scream2:

The Mullarkey Majority allowed an end run around TABOR that should not be tolerated, and has cost me personally hundreds of dollars, and my newest vehicle is 9 years old. :scream1:

[Wintermute]

Beuller, that's sound-bite politics in a nutshell. Blame it all on "waste and fraud". Problem is, any waste and fraud pointed out is someone else's valued program. Or job.

And frankly, most politicians and people really really suck at pointing out "waste" because they don't know what the fuck they're talking about. Like all the idiots that get the vapors about honey bee research.

What anti-bee-research morons don't understand is that we've got a serious problem on our hands with honey bees dying off (http://news.discovery.com/animals/honey-bees-disappearing-still-a-problem.html) at an alarming rate. This is important for the fact, not fucking opinion, that honey bees are an essential part of our multi-multi-multi-billion dollar fruit and vegetable industry. (Honey bee "ranchers" go around to farms with semis loaded with hives during pollination season, unloading them for a week at a time at each farm.) Hell, this is a food security, hence national security issue.

But that simple fact doesn't matter. Some dipshit with a southern drawl will get up in the Senate, scratch his head melodramatically for the cameras and go "Study honey bees? Ahh kin go out in mah yahd and do that. Heh heh." Soundbite bullshit that uninformed morons in our press and public lap up with a spoon.

Jim, the "core services" are what cost the most. Period. Adding up and cutting all the "interpretive dance programs for at risk teens" programs won't pay for shit. (I'll ignore the usual "41% of people pay no income tax" BS, since you purposefully ignore payroll taxes, which all those undeserving working poor pay, since they're, you know, too poor to pay income taxes. The zombie lie that won't die. It. is. the. same. thing.)

The saddest thing about all of this is that there's never any actual discussion in the media, in Congress, anywhere, about the utter budgetary insanity of us pouring billion-after-billion, trillion-after-trillion into Iraq and Afghanistan. Hell, they even get single-payer universal healthcare in Iraq, the GOP and gutless Dems decided that we don't rate that luxury in this country.

They've actually "lost" 17 billion in cash with no accounting in Iraq, literal pallets of cash, and do we get any Congressional hearings? Bupkus. Nada. Collective yawn in the press and halls of power. But try to extend unemployment or help Ground Zero first responders, huge deal, gotta be as mean and petty and vindictive as possible.

All the money in the world for war, gotta be stingy and mean as shit when it comes to our fellow citizens and the gov't the Founders created for us. Don't know what that says about our national character, but it's not good.

[TFOGGuys]

Jim, the "core services" are what cost the most. Period. Adding up and cutting all the "interpretive dance programs for at risk teens" programs won't pay for shit. (I'll ignore the usual "41% of people pay no income tax" BS, since you purposefully ignore payroll taxes, which all those undeserving working poor pay, since they're, you know, too poor to pay income taxes. The zombie lie that won't die. It. is. the. same. thing.)



Ok....I'm no Nobel winning mathematician, but If I had $1500 withheld for Federal Income Tax in a given tax year, and received a $1500 tax refund check, how was I paying taxes? Not counting FICA, unemployment insurance, and all the other back end taxes that my employer had to pay, as none of these are INCOME TAX. There are over 131 million Americans that fall into this same category.

[Wintermute]

Jim, whatever, I'm not going to argue about people barely above the poverty line getting their pittance in taxes back. I try to look at them with compassion, not resentment.

I save my ire for the idiots that "lost" 18 billion dollars in cash in Iraq.

Here's something (http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/17390/210904) that Matt Taibbi has in the current issue of Rolling Stone that talks about this hypocritical resentment Americans have for each other when it comes to gov't spending:

Seemingly every third person in the place [Teabagger rally in Kentucky] is sucking oxygen from a tank or propping their giant atrophied glutes on motorized wheelchair-scooters. As Palin launches into her Ronald Reagan impression — "Government's not the solution! Government's the problem!" — the person sitting next to me leans over and explains.

"The scooters are because of Medicare," he whispers helpfully. "They have these commercials down here: 'You won't even have to pay for your scooter! Medicare will pay!' Practically everyone in Kentucky has one."

A hall full of elderly white people in Medicare-paid scooters, railing against government spending and imagining themselves revolutionaries as they cheer on the vice-presidential puppet hand-picked by the GOP establishment. If there exists a better snapshot of everything the Tea Party represents, I can't imagine it.

After Palin wraps up, I race to the parking lot in search of departing Medicare-motor-scooter conservatives. I come upon an elderly couple, Janice and David Wheelock, who are fairly itching to share their views.

"I'm anti-spending and anti-government," crows David, as scooter-bound Janice looks on. "The welfare state is out of control."

"OK," I say. "And what do you do for a living?"

"Me?" he says proudly. "Oh, I'm a property appraiser. Have been my whole life."

I frown. "Are either of you on Medicare?"

Silence: Then Janice, a nice enough woman, it seems, slowly raises her hand, offering a faint smile, as if to say, You got me!

"Let me get this straight," I say to David. "You've been picking up a check from the government for decades, as a tax assessor, and your wife is on Medicare. How can you complain about the welfare state?"

"Well," he says, "there's a lot of people on welfare who don't deserve it. Too many people are living off the government."

"But," I protest, "you live off the government. And have been your whole life!"

"Yeah," he says, "but I don't make very much." Vast forests have already been sacrificed to the public debate about the Tea Party: what it is, what it means, where it's going. But after lengthy study of the phenomenon, I've concluded that the whole miserable narrative boils down to one stark fact: They're full of shit. All of them. At the voter level, the Tea Party is a movement that purports to be furious about government spending — only the reality is that the vast majority of its members are former Bush supporters who yawned through two terms of record deficits and spent the past two electoral cycles frothing not about spending but about John Kerry's medals and Barack Obama's Sixties associations.

The average Tea Partier is sincerely against government spending — with the exception of the money spent on them. In fact, their lack of embarrassment when it comes to collecting government largesse is key to understanding what this movement is all about — and nowhere do we see that dynamic as clearly as here in Kentucky, where Rand Paul is barreling toward the Senate with the aid of conservative icons like Palin.

Early in his campaign, Dr. Paul, the son of the uncompromising libertarian hero Ron Paul, denounced Medicare as "socialized medicine." But this spring, when confronted with the idea of reducing Medicare payments to doctors like himself — half of his patients are on Medicare — he balked. This candidate, a man ostensibly so against government power in all its forms that he wants to gut the Americans With Disabilities Act and abolish the departments of Education and Energy, was unwilling to reduce his own government compensation, for a very logical reason. "Physicians," he said, "should be allowed to make a comfortable living."

Basically, we're all goddamn hypocrites. To cut the budget, how many of you living on paved roads/streets would be fine with your county/city letting your street or road crumble back to unpaved? Hurting your home value?

[FZRguy]

LARIMER COUNTY, Colo. -- Larimer County officials told 7NEWS they set a goal this year of $1.1 million from traffic fines.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/25270762/detail.html

[SOCAL4LIFE!!]

The only difference between Larimer County and the other PD's is Larimer County is being open about it. Cash strapped counties always put for more fees/fines to help with the short fall. Is it right? Probably not. But at least its the people who are speeding or breaking some other law paying for it and not every tax payer. Yes there will be some that get tickets that did not deserve them. That is just like civilian casualties in a war. No one likes it but it happens for the greater good.

[Sarge]

Ok....I'm no Nobel winning mathematician, but If I had $1500 withheld for Federal Income Tax in a given tax year, and received a $1500 tax refund check, how was I paying taxes? Not counting FICA, unemployment insurance, and all the other back end taxes that my employer had to pay, as none of these are INCOME TAX. There are over 131 million Americans that fall into this same category.

Like he said, payroll taxes. That same $1500 that you have taken out of your check, your employer has to fork up in taxes. They basically have to match it, and they don't get that back. So, you might not be personally paying those taxes out of pocket, but your employer has to consider that as the cost of hiring you. Think, if the government takes 7% from you, they're also taking that 7% from your employer. If you get all of yours back, you don't get back that half, and neither does your employer. But, obviously, your employer has to count that tax into what he pays you, so for every $100 you take home before taxes, your employer has to pay $7 to give that to you.

[DeKay]

T That is just like civilian casualties in a war. No one likes it but it happens for the greater good.Is that the koolaid they feed you? So in a war we have no business in that would be murder.


Like he said, payroll taxes. That same $1500 that you have taken out of your check, your employer has to fork up in taxes. They basically have to match it, and they don't get that back. So, you might not be personally paying those taxes out of pocket, but your employer has to consider that as the cost of hiring you. Think, if the government takes 7% from you, they're also taking that 7% from your employer. If you get all of yours back, you don't get back that half, and neither does your employer. But, obviously, your employer has to count that tax into what he pays you, so for every $100 you take home before taxes, your employer has to pay $7 to give that to you.
It is quite apparent you have no clue what the employers are required to match.

[MetaLord 9]

aw shit, it just got toll-y in here...

[dirkterrell]

Like he said, payroll taxes. That same $1500 that you have taken out of your check, your employer has to fork up in taxes. They basically have to match it, and they don't get that back. So, you might not be personally paying those taxes out of pocket, but your employer has to consider that as the cost of hiring you. Think, if the government takes 7% from you, they're also taking that 7% from your employer. If you get all of yours back, you don't get back that half, and neither does your employer. But, obviously, your employer has to count that tax into what he pays you, so for every $100 you take home before taxes, your employer has to pay $7 to give that to you.

You should read what Jim wrote. And, in case you don't know, Jim is self-employed and is, I'm sure, painfully aware of what his employer has to pay.

And in case re-reading Jim's message doesn't make it clear, employers don't pay any matching share of income tax on your behalf, which is what he was talking about. You're thinking about FICA.

Dirk

[TinkerinWstuff]

http://media.bigoo.ws/content/gif/winnie_the_pooh/winnie_the_pooh_20.gif

[Sarge]

...

It is quite apparent you have no clue what the employers are required to match.

Call it what you will, taxes is taxes. So I was incorrect as to what it's actually called, I havn't paid in state taxes in a while, being a resident of Nevada. The FICA tax is just under 7%, so those numbers are still valid. Technically, you pay HALF, and your employer pays the other half, so how I am wrong? Also, I haven't had Federal deductions in years, for one reason or another, so it might not be true in every case, but right now the Government is literally matching me dollar for dollar on tax deductions, FICA or whatever else.





Employer Payroll Tax Responsibilities

The responsibility for payroll taxes continues even after paychecks have been issued to employees. The company is responsible for paying the employer's share of payroll taxes, for depositing tax dollars withheld from the employees' paychecks, preparing various reconciliation reports, accounting for the payroll expense through their financial reporting, and filing payroll tax returns.

Employer Payroll Taxes



Companies are responsible for paying their portion of payroll taxes. These payroll taxes are an added expense over and above the expense of an employee's gross pay. The employer-portion of payroll taxes include the following:

Social Security taxes (6.2% up to the annual maximum)
Medicare taxes (1.45% of wages)
Federal unemployment taxes (FUTA)
State unemployment taxes (SUTA)

http://taxes.about.com/od/payroll/qt/payroll_basics.htm


So, might not be income tax, and you might get your share back, but the government is still making money off of the fact that you work and get paid.

But even though you might not be paying PAYROLL taxes, you can't go buy just about anything without paying some sort of sales tax, or government tax on gas, or fees to the DMV, or any of that. Why do you think they let you itemize deductions on your tax returns? So that if you can prove that you've otherwise paid the taxes they might have withheld as payroll taxes by BUYING THINGS, then they give you the difference back. So, how is not making a "pre-payment" not actually paying taxes?

[TinkerinWstuff]

http://www.donself.com/images/confused-baby.bmp

[SOCAL4LIFE!!]

[QUOTE=DeKay;521932]Is that the koolaid they feed you? So in a war we have no business in that would be murder.
QUOTE]

Regardless of your political views on the war itself that does not change the fact that civilian casualties, while sad, are apart of war. And during war, unless the act is done intentially, a death of a civilian does not amount to murder. With your comment, "a war we have no business in", would it change your mind if it, in your eyes, was a war we should be in?

[Wintermute]

Before we start on the philosophy of war and peace, what will be the practical outcomes of this?

I've been pulled over twice on my bike and only gotten warnings. (Having a clean record and wearing gear probably helps, although the last pull-over was because I had my visor open between stoplights in downtown Boulder.) No more warnings?

No more 10mph buffer zone?

[TFOGGuys]

Before we start on the philosophy of war and peace, what will be the practical outcomes of this?

I've been pulled over twice on my bike and only gotten warnings. (Having a clean record and wearing gear probably helps, although the last pull-over was because I had my visor open between stoplights in downtown Boulder.) No more warnings?

No more 10mph buffer zone?

Denver and Aurora have both stated that they will institute a "zero tolerance" policy in several areas where people habitually speed. Sucks about the open visor thing, but I wear sunglasses under my visor anyhow.... I just got done dealing with a ticket in Aurora that was dismissed, but they still charged me a $30 "court costs" fee to dismiss the ticket (which probably should not have been issued in the first place, but it was a LOT better than the speeding ticket I deserved.....). So, basically, they charged me $30 for what used to be free....

[salsashark]

Denver and Aurora have both stated that they will institute a "zero tolerance" policy in several areas where people habitually speed. Sucks about the open visor thing, but I wear sunglasses under my visor anyhow.... I just got done dealing with a ticket in Aurora that was dismissed, but they still charged me a $30 "court costs" fee to dismiss the ticket (which probably should not have been issued in the first place, but it was a LOT better than the speeding ticket I deserved.....). So, basically, they charged me $30 for what used to be free....

I wouldn't mind a zero tolerance speed trap set up by my house. I'm tired of watching people flying through the school zone and would love to see a row of Aurora's finest handing out tickets faster then old people scoop up country buffet coupons... People tear through there like it's the autobahn regardless of what time of day it is. I've seen kids run across tower numerous times. One of them will get killed.

[MetaLord 9]

Before we start on the philosophy of war and peace, what will be the practical outcomes of this?

I've been pulled over twice on my bike and only gotten warnings. (Having a clean record and wearing gear probably helps, although the last pull-over was because I had my visor open between stoplights in downtown Boulder.) No more warnings?

No more 10mph buffer zone?
Wait, what's the deal with an open visor? I have my visor open PLENTY. Is is it the eye protection thing?

[Sarge]

I wouldn't mind a zero tolerance speed trap set up by my house. I'm tired of watching people flying through the school zone and would love to see a row of Aurora's finest handing out tickets faster then old people scoop up country buffet coupons... People tear through there like it's the autobahn regardless of what time of day it is. I've seen kids run across tower numerous times. One of them will get killed.


I could deal with the zero tolerance thing, especially in school zones. But what I would LOVE to see, and something I'd seriously volunteer to do in my free time AND enjoy immensely, would be sending officers to that stretch of 25 between the Springs and Denver, and pulling over all the people that drive slower than everyone else in the left lane. :devil2:

[dirkterrell]

Wait, what's the deal with an open visor? I have my visor open PLENTY. Is is it the eye protection thing?

Yep.

Dirk

[MetaLord 9]

I could deal with the zero tolerance thing, especially in school zones. But what I would LOVE to see, and something I'd seriously volunteer to do in my free time AND enjoy immensely, would be sending officers to that stretch of 25 between the Springs and Denver, and pulling over all the people that drive slower than everyone else in the left lane. :devil2:
That's a Colorado driver issue. I've never seen more folks in the left lane driving next to someone in the right lane and going under the speed limit, than I have in Colorado

[MetaLord 9]

Yep.

Dirk
And here I thought it was just common sense...

[Sarge]

That's a Colorado driver issue. I've never seen more folks in the left lane driving next to someone in the right lane and going under the speed limit, than I have in Colorado


+1, and I grew up in Southern California. At least down there everyone just tries to go as fast as possible...

One thing I have to say though, and this is sort of a running game between my wife and I, is that it seems to be females who do this more than anyone. I mean, I'm not trying to be sexist or anything, but the next time you're in your car driving somewhere, even better if you're with a spouse/sig other, count how many people you see doing stupid sh*t like this, and how many people are driving on their cell phones, etc, and count how many are male vs female.

When I was on R&R in August, my wife and I drove from Lake Tahoe to Dayton, NV and counted 47 women on their phones, vs 7 men... This was about a 45 mile trip, btw.

[DFab]

although the last pull-over was because I had my visor open between stoplights in downtown Boulder.) No more warnings?

No more 10mph buffer zone?

Not wearing glasses I guess?

[Aphrodite]

Seriously another thread on this issue? :no:

[TinkerinWstuff]

http://www.theyre.us/images/SA/macros/deadhorse.jpg

[brennahm]

That's a Colorado driver issue. I've never seen more folks in the left lane driving next to someone in the right lane and going under the speed limit, than I have in Colorado

Apparently you've never visited anything east of the Mississippi River.

[Bueller]

That's a Colorado driver issue. I've never seen more folks in the left lane driving next to someone in the right lane and going under the speed limit, than I have in Colorado

Everyone seems to forget that the majority of so called "Colorado drivers" are all the retarded transplants from all over the rest of the country.

[FZRguy]

I don’t mind paying the ticket tax once in a while....just a cost of riding/driving. But I do mind taking it in the ass for the next three years from my insurance company.

[brennahm]

Everyone seems to forget that the majority of so called "Colorado drivers" are all the retarded transplants from all over the rest of the country.

Exactly, I just can't understand why all the asshats out here drive 10mph in the wet/rain, and 40mph in the snow?:wtf:

[Aphrodite]

Exactly, I just can't understand why all the asshats out here drive 10mph in the wet/rain, and 40mph in the snow?:wtf:

Been all over the country and it happens everywhere, 10 years ago it wasn't like that, it is now, everywhere.

[Sarge]

Been all over the country and it happens everywhere, 10 years ago it wasn't like that, it is now, everywhere.

Speaking of which, isn't it about time we had flying cars and time machines? I mean, all the good science fiction and things like Back to the Future basically said we'd be living on Mars by now...

[Aphrodite]

^ Was working on Mars but the budget got cut, LOL.

[MetaLord 9]

Apparently you've never visited anything east of the Mississippi River.
Nope, definitely wasn't born and raised, and spent the entirety of my life (minus the last three years) east of the Mississippi in several different states. :D

It's definitely worse and more pronounced in Colorado. Also, the rubbernecking here is pretty ridiculous nowadays.

Everyone seems to forget that the majority of so called "Colorado drivers" are all the retarded transplants from all over the rest of the country.
I'm not making the assumption that they grew up & learned to drive in Colorado. I don't really care where they are from, just that they get to Colorado and decide to drive that way.

[Aphrodite]

When I moved here from Blaine, WA I was culture shock due to the size of this metropolitan area and the associated traffic. One just learns to deal with it after a while, took me three years to.

[dapper]

I don’t mind paying the ticket tax once in a while....just a cost of riding/driving. But I do mind taking it in the ass for the next three years from my insurance company.
There's more to a citation than just the fine for the offense.
These surcharges include, but are not limited to: victim fine, brain trauma fee, DV fine, court cost fee, credit card fee, double fine fee, fuel charge fee, detention fee, etc.

I'm wondering if I will ever see the day where many people will have offshore accounts and then say they won't pay the fine.
Eventually the jails will fill up and the system who chooses to punish the people will have to look at what to do if the people no longer pay.:bigeyes:

[Wintermute]

Not wearing glasses I guess?

Too dark at the time. It was down by the Rio where traffic goes all of walking speed during happy hour on a weekend night. I think he just wanted to see if I'd been drinkin downtown.

(Luckily, I was just out warming the oil up to figure out how much to replace after the sight tube failed and leaked a few ML. You gotta account for hot oil expansion in dry sump LC8s, I still ended up overfilling it a little.)

[Wintermute]

Exactly, I just can't understand why all the asshats out here drive 10mph in the wet/rain, and 40mph in the snow?:wtf:

We have a fairly-busy street right by the agency and it kills me when I try to time it so that I can cross right behind a car, stepping off the curve as they approach, and they just about get rear-ended stomping on the brakes happily waving me across in front of them, totally screwing up the timing of the crossing.

Wanted: A little bit of "I dare you to walk out in front of me fucker" Manhattan cabbie attitude in CO drivers. Less glued-to-IM attitude.

[puckstr]

Wait, what's the deal with an open visor? I have my visor open PLENTY. Is is it the eye protection thing?

He was in Boulder. Maybe your Visor is for Hippie protection?

I Ride with mine up all the time, but I have shades on too.

I got pulled over last week. You know the shake down "lookin for DUI thing". Suprise Buddy not a drop to drink. The retarded thing was I got pulled for liscense plate lights on my Audi A4. :wtf:

Got a warning and lost 30 minutes of my life. :no: