Rocky Mountain Minimoto

[mopoet178]

As a college student, I dont see racing MRA to be within my budget for at least the next couple years. This gives me a chance to further invest in my technique as a minimoto racer!

http://www.rmminimoto.com/

I dont have a ride yet. From what little research I have done, it seems I can pull off a whole season of racing for less than $1500 including bike purchase.

I guess I am asking for any guidance. Is my cost assumption mostly correct? What's a good bike to ride? Whats it take to setup a basic racer? I see some pretty nice condition pocket bikes on craigslist for $300-400.

This should satisfy my competition fix until I can afford to race with MRA, plus it should teach me good perception and how to work with momentum instead of with horsepower. I think it would be really good for skill building.

Any experience with racing pocket bikes? I want to know everything relevant you have to say.

-Marsh

[brennahm]

Not to take anything away from RMMM, as I think it would be a blast and if I get a minibike I'd definitely give it a shot.

As far as really racing though, I can't imagine it has a whole lot to do with MRA or real motorcycle racing unless you get something like an NSR (and that's def not going to cost you $300-400).

Obviously I'm a fan of supermoto, but in reality, it gives you real bike skills and is about as cheap as it gets ($40 annual membership, $50 for first race each weekend). Furthermore, you actually have one of the largest and most active series in the nation right here in CO.

If you just have a hard on for racing and want to have a good time then RMMM would be my choice as well. I just wouldn't justify it with getting racing experience.

Finally, I've never raced minis and am totally willing to accept I may be way off point. If I am, I apologize and do not mean in any way to demean any other series.

[mopoet178]

I dont really have a hard on for racing. I dont really care about beating people or getting beat. I just want to learn to go as fast as I can as best as I can and I think low key competition is a good way to do that. It certainly gets me around people that I can learn from. Also I have heard from many people that if you want to really rock a motorcycle, learn on the smallest thing you can find.

This is just a tester to see what other peoples idea of the value of minimoto racing is. If I can learn tons from it, I think I will do it. If my money is better spent on track time for the FZR, Ill do that.

[Bueller]

RMMM is talking about including a class that would be aimed at the ninjettes, they are working with the MRA on creating a farm system to get young racers a taste of road racing so they will hopefully move up to the MRA. With the inclusion of the 250 spec class this coming season I think a baby ninja would be a consideration. I think mine has taught me more about corner speed than any other bike I have ridden or raced. Practice is cheap and plentiful going to IMI and the "competition" is there if you like chasing sumos around, The DRZ's are a bit faster but with enough seat time and a few more mods I think I should be able to hang with some of them :)

[dragos13]

I dont really have a hard on for racing. I dont really care about beating people or getting beat. I just want to learn to go as fast as I can as best as I can and I think low key competition is a good way to do that. It certainly gets me around people that I can learn from. Also I have heard from many people that if you want to really rock a motorcycle, learn on the smallest thing you can find.

This is just a tester to see what other peoples idea of the value of minimoto racing is. If I can learn tons from it, I think I will do it. If my money is better spent on track time for the FZR, Ill do that.

I have raced with the mini moto club before on a YSR50 (which I have one for sale CHEAP) and an XR50. You can get into the racing for fairly cheap and its a TON of fun. Right now the club is being dominated by KX65's which will run you around $1000-$1500 already setup for road racing. You can find cheap XR50's for around $500 then just get some 10" roadrace tires mounted.

If you are interested in a YSR 50 (not really competitive but super fun and as close to roadracing as you get on a mini) then shoot me a message.

If you have any more questions on the mini moto scene let me know as well. I have been associated with them for about the past 3 years and know pretty much the entire club so I can get you in touch with the right people :)

[DucWise]

I dont really have a hard on for racing. I dont really care about beating people or getting beat. I just want to learn to go as fast as I can as best as I can and I think low key competition is a good way to do that. It certainly gets me around people that I can learn from. Also I have heard from many people that if you want to really rock a motorcycle, learn on the smallest thing you can find.

This is just a tester to see what other peoples idea of the value of minimoto racing is. If I can learn tons from it, I think I will do it. If my money is better spent on track time for the FZR, Ill do that.

Just throwing this into the mix... that you already have a "big bike" (ala FZR) and you don't care about beating people or getting beat. Isn't the Endurance races with the MRA around ~$60 for the first entry? You get Saturday AND Sunday practice and a full 30 minute "big bike" race for $60. That's a shite load of track time AND a race with the MRA (on a real bike :) ) for almost half a Franklin. It seems like the FZR on a big track would be a great tool to learn how to "really rock a motorcycle".

:think:

(I would like to also throw out that I think mini moto and super moto would both rock as well :loop: )

[UglyDogRacing]

RMMM is talking about including a class that would be aimed at the ninjettes, they are working with the MRA on creating a farm system to get young racers a taste of road racing so they will hopefully move up to the MRA. With the inclusion of the 250 spec class this coming season I think a baby ninja would be a consideration. I think mine has taught me more about corner speed than any other bike I have ridden or raced. Practice is cheap and plentiful going to IMI and the "competition" is there if you like chasing sumos around, The DRZ's are a bit faster but with enough seat time and a few more mods I think I should be able to hang with some of them :)

It's confirmed that RMMM will have a ninja250 class - http://forums.mra-racing.org/viewtopic.php?t=12013

[Sean]

Wow, there's going to be lots of 2fiddy racing next year. :up:

[mopoet178]

Just throwing this into the mix... that you already have a "big bike" (ala FZR) and you don't care about beating people or getting beat. Isn't the Endurance races with the MRA around ~$60 for the first entry? You get Saturday AND Sunday practice and a full 30 minute "big bike" race for $60. That's a shite load of track time AND a race with the MRA (on a real bike :) ) for almost half a Franklin. It seems like the FZR on a big track would be a great tool to learn how to "really rock a motorcycle".
I work for the MRA. Its a hoot and I get paid to be there. Basically, it's worth more to me to work for the MRA than to race in it.

Little bikes look fun.

Keep talking guys, It all helps.

[dragos13]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7pz51FH93E&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEy66apfya8&feature=related

[dragos13]

Just search YouTube under Ricky00187 for tons of mini bike videos.

[mikesf4i]

Marsh
I know this thread has been out there for a while , but I'm going to throw out my $.02 anyway. We raced with Chris and the guys at RMMINIMOTO last year and had a blast. I have 13 year old twin boys and we have been racing supermoto for a couple of years now. After having one of my kids win his first supermoto championship in 09 (he won his second in 10) we figured that we would do pretty well in Minimoto against adults on the same size bikes that my kids were running. You know, power to weight ratio and all.... We were wrong. The kids got spanked by the RMMINIMOTO regulars. This group is FAST! We stuck with it and looked at it as a challenge and a great opportunity to learn. The guys with RMMINIMOTO were all super helpful and both of my kids riding skills grew in leaps and bounds. We even managed a few podium finishes by the end of the season. All told, we broke one shift lever and two on board camera mounts (one of the camera mounts was broken when my kids ran into each other...damn kids). We even used the same tires we used in 09 for supermoto.
If your looking for a way to increase your riding skills for as little money as possible, this is it! Trust me, this is real racing against very fast riders. Look on page 62 of the 2010 MRA season program for a guy by the name of Jason Madama (Hammer). As of 2010 he holds lap records at pueblo and ppir. Hammer is fast! This is the type of racers you will be running against and learning from. It also costs less to buy a mini and race it for a year than it does to throw an FZR 600 down once during a track day. We have crashed our bikes numerous times , including the above mentioned sibling rivalry incident, and last year only broke one shift lever. We also had zero injuries from racing. Partly because the speeds are lower and partly because kids crash like rubber chickens.
Keep your eyes peeled for the schedule and come out and join us. Adam promised me more podium finishes and he is going to try his hardest to see if he can beat Hammer this year! Oooo I can feel the excitement already!

[martincjm]

We are looking forward to having the boys out again this year, Mike.
I should have the schedule up in a week or so, which will include 4 races at IMI with the 250s and 4 at Bandimere with F1-F5.

As far as bikes go, the NSF 100 is the bike to beat in F1. It's also hard to find and not inexpensive. I'm taking the alternate route this year and stuffing a 110cc china 4stroke into my NSR 50. The brand new, prepped engine was $350. How's that for cheap racing. F2/3 and F4/5 will see the 65cc two strokes like Casey said, along with big bore NSRs and 4 strokes.

If I could give any advice to building a bike, I would say, get a reliable engine in that chassis first, and then spend cash on suspension. Don't tweak the engine to within explosive limits just to get another 1-2 Hp. We've seen it happen many times.
It's gonna be a very competitive season this year and I can't wait to race.

Chris

[vort3xr6]

What would be a good bike to compete in 2 classes for a bigger dude around 6'1? I was thinking a KLX 110, or an RM 85 2 stroke, or a YZ 85.

What would you say is the best bike for the following criteria.

-cheapest to build
-easiest to maintain
-reliable and crashable
-inexpensive to modify for road racing
-competitive in multiple classes
-under $2500 total

[OUTLAWD]

I work for the MRA. Its a hoot and I get paid to be there. Basically, it's worth more to me to work for the MRA than to race in it.

Little bikes look fun.

Keep talking guys, It all helps.

Race end sat, work sunday?

[martincjm]

Brad,
For multiple class bikes, you could either do a 110 china 4T in a pit bike , or tune the crap out of a nsr 50. That would get you F1 and F2/3. To do F2/3 and 4/5 your 2T limit would be 72cc and 4T would be 152cc. That's around 13Hp and torque up the wazoo. The KLX110 in stock auto clutch trim isn't going to compete too well. The vendors on planet minis.com will give you an idea of new bike costs. I'm happy with my china bike and I paid $1200. Tires last over 1 season too.

Some of the 65cc guys can tell you more about them than I can. I raced an NSR50 until the 4T took over.
Hope this helps a bit
Chris

[vort3xr6]

Brad,
For multiple class bikes, you could either do a 110 china 4T in a pit bike , or tune the crap out of a nsr 50. That would get you F1 and F2/3. To do F2/3 and 4/5 your 2T limit would be 72cc and 4T would be 152cc. That's around 13Hp and torque up the wazoo. The KLX110 in stock auto clutch trim isn't going to compete too well. The vendors on planet minis.com will give you an idea of new bike costs. I'm happy with my china bike and I paid $1200. Tires last over 1 season too.

Some of the 65cc guys can tell you more about them than I can. I raced an NSR50 until the 4T took over.
Hope this helps a bit
Chris

Thanks for the help. What china brands have stepped up their game? I know a few of the older ones were garbage and fell apart in 2 rides. So you could technically just buy a china bike, toss sumo tires on it and compete?

[dragos13]

Hey Brad also consider a KX or RM 65. That would allow you to run F2-3 and F4-5 and be competitive in both.

The bikes (being dirt bikes) are made to crash and are really fast. They might also work better for you since you're a bit bigger guy, then say a MSR50 which might be a too cramped up.

You can definitely buy/build one for less then $2500. The tires last all season so you basically just show up and pay for food and gas. I rode a KX65 around Bandimere last year and it was AWESOME. Very good for roadrace practice too. These things teach you a ton about being smooth when you transfer weight cuz even small movements will upset the chassis.

[martincjm]

Brad,
Mine is a YX, and I adjusted the valves once last season. GPX is a good one. My new 110 is a Piranha YX. You do have to keep up on your maintenance checks a little more with Chinese than Japanese but parts are everywhere and are inexpensive.

Chris

[coax]

As far as really racing though, I can't imagine it has a whole lot to do with MRA or real motorcycle racing unless you get something like an NSR (and that's def not going to cost you $300-400).

Obviously I'm a fan of supermoto, but in reality, it gives you real bike skills and is about as cheap as it gets ($40 annual membership, $50 for first race each weekend). Furthermore, you actually have one of the largest and most active series in the nation right here in CO.

If you just have a hard on for racing and want to have a good time then RMMM would be my choice as well. I just wouldn't justify it with getting racing experience.

Finally, I've never raced minis and am totally willing to accept I may be way off point. If I am, I apologize and do not mean in any way to demean any other series.

When you look at the World Championship level of racing, it is dominated primarily by Europeans. One of the reasons is a farm system and the other is minimoto racing. In 2005, every class champion in the Moto GP series went from pocket bikes, to minimoto gp/shifters, to big bikes (Rossi was a factory Polini pocket bike racer). The trend continues today. Lorenzo's injury in 2009 (?) was from a crash on real racing pocketbikes practicing with Carlos Checa. If you're familiar with former and to be again MRA racer Tracy Schram, a big part of his training program in Japan was racing mini motos. Austin DeHaven, AMA Superstock champion came up thru the SC MiniGP series. The list goes on and on.

[coax]

What would be a good bike to compete in 2 classes for a bigger dude around 6'1? I was thinking a KLX 110, or an RM 85 2 stroke, or a YZ 85.

What would you say is the best bike for the following criteria.

-cheapest to build
-easiest to maintain
-reliable and crashable
-inexpensive to modify for road racing
-competitive in multiple classes
-under $2500 total

I would probably look at a Pitster X2 (like Chris) or X4 which is larger and get it with a 150cc engine and have the head ported, or better yet throw on a Trail Bikes V2 racehead.

The best bet for a competitive dual class bike is the KX65, as mentioned above (6 speed, disk brakes, not a lot of moving parts, and the lowest dyno I have ever seen is 14hp bone stock).

[coax]

Very good for roadrace practice too. These things teach you a ton about being smooth when you transfer weight cuz even small movements will upset the chassis.

Tru dat!

Matter of fact, Hammer told me racing minis took him to the next level on his big bike. He stated that minis are so sketched out that it made his R6 feel like it was on rails all the time. Not to mention that you can f'up, get up, and still finish the race. I got ran over last year (not hit-and right up my back and still finished a race last year [made for a happy 45 yr. old]) and still had a great day!

[vort3xr6]

Okay guys. I need some advice. I am ready to start looking at mini moto bikes and pick one up. My budget for the bike is between 1000 and 1200.

I am looking primarily at KX-65's and RM-65's. I noticed for the wheels, there were some different options. I could get another rear and put the front hub on that, or I can spend the coin and get acutal 12 inch 2.15 width rims for some serious rubber.

Would a pitster pro or any of the others be cheaper or easier to get? I am still leaning more towards the 2 strokes but I wanted to get some options.

[mikesf4i]

Brad
We went with the 12x2.15 width rims on both the 80 and the 65. That way you can run the TT92 tires in 100 and 120 width. I don't know what tires are available for the narrower rim width. I would think cost wise all of the mini dirt bike stuff should be close as long as you can use the stock hubs.
Our KX80 is a 91 and parts availability has been very good. Kawasaki made a million of them so even aftermarket parts are still available. I would think the KX65 would be the same. Looking back on things, as much as we have had great luck with our KTM 65SX, I would look really hard at a KX65.

[vort3xr6]

should I buy stock and build it myself?

or

Buy an already race prepped version?

My buddy is telling me that once a top end blows, the bike will never run the same.

[mikesf4i]

Its the same as with every modified vehicle, you will save some $$$ if you spend a little more and find one already built. I would probably stay away from the 2 strokes with the built motors that have been super tweaked for every ounce of power though, they don't seem to last. There is nothing to 2 stroke top ends. Its just a piston, a cylinder with some ports in it and a head that does nothing more than hold the spark plug.

[martincjm]

I'm with you, Mike. Better to look at a $700 kx65 (on Craigslist now) that some kids putted around on bone stock, than to hope a tweaked out grenade of a motor makes it to the starting line 3x per day. To take it further, an abused bike is more risky than a neglected one.

Chris

[vort3xr6]

The one I am looking at now is not a built motor. It was an MX motor that was rebuilt top and bottom 17 hours ago. No increased compression or anything like that, just rebuilt. My buddy swears that once you rebuild a 2 stroke, it doesn't run right anymore. I disagree.

If I have the dough, I would consider getting a stocker and converting it. But once you add it all up, it doesn't make sense.

[mikesf4i]

As long as you do quality work and use good parts, you can rebuild anything.

[dragos13]

The one I am looking at now is not a built motor. It was an MX motor that was rebuilt top and bottom 17 hours ago. No increased compression or anything like that, just rebuilt. My buddy swears that once you rebuild a 2 stroke, it doesn't run right anymore. I disagree.

If I have the dough, I would consider getting a stocker and converting it. But once you add it all up, it doesn't make sense.

I know the history of that bike and it was done very well. You got a great deal.

As for rebuilding a two stroke and it not working right, thats ridiculous. We rebuilt the YSR50 and it ran stronger than ever. We just replaced piston and rings so no actual build or compression increase.

[mike]

I'm looking forward to another good mini-moto season! I'm working on getting a CR85 motor in my old NSR50 for F4/F5, and will also have a Ninja 250 for IMI.

I still have my stock NSR50 for F1, but it looks a lot less generic now thanks to the Un!nk Printworks graphics. Here's a pic from the M1GP 24 Hour Endurance Race last September:

http://mikekionka.com/NSR/DSCN0710s.JPG

[Zach929rr]

Posting to confirm that riding brad's 65 around IMI was shit loads of fun and is making me want to get one.

[vort3xr6]

Posting to confirm that riding brad's 65 around IMI was shit loads of fun and is making me want to get one.


Do IT. 50 bucks for 4 races and practice. Bandimere is minutes from your house. And a 65 WILL fit in your explorer.