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View Full Version : It's still a Prius....



TFOGGuys
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 03:18 PM
But a darn quick one...

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-20099308-48/toyota-sets-ev-lap-record-at-nurburgring/?tag=mncol;posts


As a reference, the fastest timed full lap on a motorcycle is about 7:46.

Ghost
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 03:23 PM
Neat. Still rather have a TT ICE powered car though...

asp_125
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 03:23 PM
Looks like it understeers a lot on the slow corners. Neat.

Sean
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 03:24 PM
Exactly, it's still a Prius. :down:

Ghost
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 03:31 PM
Exactly, it's still a Prius. :down:

Technically, it's a full EV, Prius is a hybrid, so at least a Prius has an ability to drive without X hours of downtime waiting to charge before you can take it out...

vort3xr6
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 03:53 PM
I just got done driving the Volt around town today. We had a Demo in at the chevy store. The GoPro mounted to it. I went up and down lookout mountain and around Golden without using a single drop of gas. Pretty damn cool vehicle, just not worth 45g's.

asp_125
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 05:22 PM
Technology is still new. EVs and EV-bikes are not yet mature enough to drop the price down to where it's competitive with fossil fuel offerings. Infrastructure still needs to be in place. We will see gas-electric hybrids for a while longer.

Ghost
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 07:25 PM
Technology is still new. EVs and EV-bikes are not yet mature enough to drop the price down to where it's competitive with fossil fuel offerings. Infrastructure still needs to be in place. We will see gas-electric hybrids for a while longer.

We need Hydrogen cars, not EVs.

brennahm
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 07:29 PM
Baby steps, Ghost...baby steps.

Shea
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 07:47 PM
"Baby steps" would imply that the technology for EV's is a stepping stone to hydrogen. Unfortunately they are two entirely different technological paths. Further they require entirely different infrastructure to support them. Choose one and the other is a completely wasted effort.

Vellos
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 07:51 PM
We need Hydrogen cars, not EVs.

It takes a lot of energy to produce hydrogen if they were to replace fueling stations. And as of current that energy would have to come from our fossil fuel based power plants. So either way, it would be expensive and non-ecological until the technology and infrastructure develops enough to make the options practical.

Ghost
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 08:52 PM
Baby steps, Ghost...baby steps.

Hehe, patience is a vice, not a virtue.

The longer you "wait and see" the more you'll wait and the less you'll see. :p


"Baby steps" would imply that the technology for EV's is a stepping stone to hydrogen. Unfortunately they are two entirely different technological paths. Further they require entirely different infrastructure to support them. Choose one and the other is a completely wasted effort.


It takes a lot of energy to produce hydrogen if they were to replace fueling stations. And as of current that energy would have to come from our fossil fuel based power plants. So either way, it would be expensive and non-ecological until the technology and infrastructure develops enough to make the options practical.

We developed a fantastically complicated infrastructure for our national power, communications, water, transport, and traffic systems--including both our national power grid and our gasoline fuel network.

I don't think developing an equivalent system for Hydrogen would be beyond our capabilities, and it's better to start now instead of waiting until it's too late.

Choosing between HFC & EV should be simple, and it should be HFC. For range, refill/recharge and life cycle impact and usability, the EV can't compare.

It does take energy to create Hydrogen, but it takes coal plants to power the electric grids that charge an EV, and it takes rare earth metals to produce the batteries, fuel to ship it all over the globe, energy to refine it, energy to charge the car, and landfills to deal with the spent batteries when their life is over.

GM had their surfboard concept out years ago, and Honda has some HFC cars running around CA, but EVs have stolen the limelight. Still, that doesn't make them a good or even very feasible choice.

I do think Shea is right, we're nearing a point of choice, but I firmly believe that EV shortcomings will prove their downfall and we'll see Hydrogen take the lead. The infrastructure will come, especially once the energy companies realize they've no choice but to build it.

vort3xr6
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 09:26 PM
Look up the Hindenburg on Wikipedia. /sarcasm I sure as hell do not want a soccer mom in a hyrdogen bomb Tahoe driving down the road. Not to mention the inexperienced truck driver rolling the tanker full of Hydrogen and taking out I-70 in one swoop.

The Black Knight
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 09:32 PM
Look up the Hindenburg on Wikipedia. /sarcasm I sure as hell do not want a soccer mom in a hyrdogen bomb Tahoe driving down the road. Not to mention the inexperienced truck driver rolling the tanker full of Hydrogen and taking out I-70 in one swoop.
Yeah it takes a little more than that to create a Hydrogen explosion. Even in the event of a crash or leakage, you'd still need an atomic reaction in order to make the hydrogen go fusion/critical. Last I checked, most trucks used for hauling HAZ-MAT, aren't exactly a carbon copy of Ivy Mike or Castle Bravo. ;)

You're average run of the mill fender bender or even roll over isn't going to produce this:

http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/8924/1tzarb.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/195/1tzarb.jpg/)

vort3xr6
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 09:52 PM
My exagerisms were a little outlandish yes, but Hydrogen is still much more explosive than gasoline. Even a fender bender that ruptures a fuel cell with minimal spark could cause a pretty serious fireball.

Vellos
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 10:00 PM
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-05-06/toyota-targets-50-000-range-for-hydrogen-powered-sedan-planned-by-2015.html

http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/8409/honeysoon.jpg

Ghost
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 10:03 PM
My exagerisms were a little outlandish yes, but Hydrogen is still much more explosive than gasoline. Even a fender bender that ruptures a fuel cell with minimal spark could cause a pretty serious fireball.

By the time any HFC makes it to market, you'll have a better chance of dying in an exploding Pinto than some hydrogen explosion...

Vellos
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 10:08 PM
You'll have a better chance of dying on a motorcycle than exploding in a Pinto too.

Ghost
Tue Aug 30th, 2011, 10:09 PM
You'll have a better chance of dying on a motorcycle than exploding in a Pinto too.

Shhhhh, don't tell anyone that or they'll never ride!