Their kids have armed teacher/guards...

[Ezzzzy1]

Since America has turned into the land of the "equal" (and if you are not equal our government will bend over backwards to try and make you equal), why wouldnt they jump at the thought of arming at least the teachers that want to be armed.

Not that a single security guard will help all that much but that would be a step in the right direction as well. Obviously the people with the money see a benefit to protecting their kids in this manner.

I understand protecting the presidents kids, but im thinking any responsible parent would love to feel the same type of security that they do.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/children-of-president-obama-media-elite-go-to-schools-with-armed-security-guards.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FactorFreedomNews+%28Factor+F reedom+News%29

[Rider]

Since America has turned into the land of the "equal" (and if you are not equal our government will bend over backwards to try and make you equal), why wouldnt they jump at the thought of arming at least the teachers that want to be armed.

Not that a single security guard will help all that much but that would be a step in the right direction as well. Obviously the people with the money see a benefit to protecting their kids in this manner.

I understand protecting the presidents kids, but im thinking any responsible parent would love to feel the same type of security that they do.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/children-of-president-obama-media-elite-go-to-schools-with-armed-security-guards.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FactorFreedomNews+%28Factor+F reedom+News%29

So what makes the presidents kids more important than any other child? Who there parent's are doesn't mean shit, they are kids much like any others and are the future they all need to be protected from the deranged lunatics IMO.

[Ghosty]

People only make a stink because they hate Obama. If it was Reagan or Bush's kids, no one would say shit. Except maybe TODAY with the newfound Libertarian surge. I agree there kids are no less "valuable" then your kids, BUT I also realize they are "HIGH VALUE TARGETS" for kidnappings and harm. It's just common sense, not hypocritical, IMHO.

I don't disagree with it, for any POTUS, regardless of party or gun politics.

[madvlad]

The government is moar important brah, you know this man! :lol: I dk why people are surprised.

[Repsol a095]

I am a teacher, and I would never even consider carrying/owning a gun; nor, would I ever want my son's teachers carrying a gun for many reasons.

I am not trained, and I would not feel qualified to shoot anyone in any situation.

I did not "sign up" to carry out armed protection. I love my kids, and I would do anything to protect them, but I don't know if I could live with myself if I accidentally killed anyone or if I missed my target.

[asp_125]

Only the a-list celebrities, elite, and privileged classes get armed protection. That's just how things are in Amerika. Now back to the sweatshops with ya and quit griping. ;)

[TFOGGuys]

I am a teacher, and I would never even consider carrying/owning a gun; nor, would I ever want my son's teachers carrying a gun for many reasons.

I am not trained, and I would not feel qualified to shoot anyone in any situation.

I did not "sign up" to carry out armed protection. I love my kids, and I would do anything to protect them, but I don't know if I could live with myself if I accidentally killed anyone or if I missed my target.

But if a teacher was adequately trained, an wished to carry, should he or she be allowed to?

If I were a teacher, I'd sure as hell want something more effective than throwing a stapler (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2906398/posts)at an active assailant

[madvlad]

I think if something within the armed teachers/staff is going to happen it needs to be on the down low. Have trained security/law enforcement blend in as staff and not to alert the world of this with the news and cause a scene to draw more unstable people to defy this new system. Element of surprise needs to be on our side...

Utah's teachers are about to start packing!

http://news.yahoo.com/group-offers-weapons-training-utah-teachers-173649952.html

[Rider]

A lot of the high schools in Colorado have armed police officers in them.

[madvlad]

A lot of the high schools in Colorado have armed police officers in them.

That stop by once or twice a day, I think people are talking about constant vigilance while kids are in class and even lunch. I went to Columbine for 2 years and it is pretty heavily guarded with Jeffco presence constantly, went to pick up my sister from Columbine a month ago and there's at least 5 jeffco sheriff vehicles there. At Bear Creek only one lakewood cop for the whole school and he was there only when called out.

[Rider]

That stop by once or twice a day, I think people are talking about constant vigilance while kids are in class and even lunch. I went to Columbine for 2 years and it is pretty heavily guarded with Jeffco presence constantly, went to pick up my sister from Columbine a month ago and there's at least 5 jeffco sheriff vehicles there. At Bear Creek only one lakewood cop for the whole school and he was there only when called out.


Yea I can see the logic in that :roll: Columbine was shot up so it needs more protection than the other schools.

FYI I am not implying what you said was dumb , what you stated you saw just furthermore proves my point that the decision of who gets more protection than others is fucking stupid.

So we will put 1 officer who goes to a few different schools everyday to "checkup" on them, untill one of them gets shot up then we put a handful of officers and metal detectors in the school because we all know that school was targeted for a reason and its bound to happen again :roll:.

If they hired more Police officers to protect our schools our children and our educators then it would create more government jobs in which we need, but logic doesn't seem to be in the Governments vocabulary.

[madvlad]

I see your point, I was just stating what I saw while going to school and what my siblings see when they go to school as well. With the firemen being shot up and our service force being targeted plus with the economic troubles I doubt they'll hire more policemen.

[jbnwc]

If a government has the legal right to tell people that they can't have a gun in this building or that park, then I think they also have a legal OBLIGATION to staff those places with security.

[jbnwc]

Also, being married to someone who worked in a school that saw daily stabbings and other miscellaneous violence, I think it is appalling that an employee wouldn't at least be allowed the decision to either arm themselves or be defenseless. At the very least, employees should be allowed to have a gun in their car. Otherwise, they are not only defenseless at work, but also to and from work.

[Repsol a095]

But if a teacher was adequately trained, an wished to carry, should he or she be allowed to?

If I were a teacher, I'd sure as hell want something more effective than throwing a stapler (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2906398/posts)at an active assailant

Never. That would be the day I quit. I am sure that others have their own opinion, but all of my coworkers would opt for something different if we were forced to carry.

[Repsol a095]

That stop by once or twice a day, I think people are talking about constant vigilance while kids are in class and even lunch. I went to Columbine for 2 years and it is pretty heavily guarded with Jeffco presence constantly, went to pick up my sister from Columbine a month ago and there's at least 5 jeffco sheriff vehicles there. At Bear Creek only one lakewood cop for the whole school and he was there only when called out.

My high school has two Arapahoe county sheriffs that are armed and stay there all day.

[madvlad]

My high school has two Arapahoe county sheriffs that are armed and stay there all day.

Arapahoe county is no joke, given they have no off campus policies (or at least it was that way when I went to Chaparral HS) it doesn't surprise me they have officers there all day.

[Repsol a095]

The kids are allowed to go off campus now.

[madvlad]

They budged in after all then lol

[TFOGGuys]

Never. That would be the day I quit. I am sure that others have their own opinion, but all of my coworkers would opt for something different if we were forced to carry.

I'm not advocating "forcing" anyone to carry, it would be counterproductive at best. I do know a a number of teachers that are well trained(ex-police in one case, former Marine in another) that are very frustrated that they are held defenseless from potential assailants by statute. I'm not recommending that ALL teachers be forced to become SWAT officers, I'm suggesting that those that are motivated to bet the training and choose to be sheepdogs instead of sheep be allowed to.

[#1Townie]

If a government has the legal right to tell people that they can't have a gun in this building or that park, then I think they also have a legal OBLIGATION to staff those places with security.


Good luck with that. The government has ZERO obligation to protect citizens.

[#1Townie]

Never. That would be the day I quit. I am sure that others have their own opinion, but all of my coworkers would opt for something different if we were forced to carry.

What if we put troops to work in schools? Our soldiers these days have tons of experience that can be be applied to a class room along with the military background. Pe teachers. Computer teachers. Janitors. Our troops getting out of the service are at a 30% unemployment rate. We could kill two birds with one stone.

[Repsol a095]

What if we put troops to work in schools? Our soldiers these days have tons of experience that can be be applied to a class room along with the military background. Pe teachers. Computer teachers. Janitors. Our troops getting out of the service are at a 30% unemployment rate. We could kill two birds with one stone.

Maybe? I would never stop blaming myself if anything happened to the kids like an accidental shooting. I also wonder what would happen if any kid got their hands on a gun accidentally as well?

[#1Townie]

Maybe? I would never stop blaming myself if anything happened to the kids like an accidental shooting. I also wonder what would happen if any kid got their hands on a gun accidentally as well?

One could deal in what ifs all day long.

[Airreed]

I don't think it's a fiscal answer to put LEO in every school.I know a lot of high schools have them in larger cities,but to put them in every school is going to mean the dreaded tax increase to hire more LEO's....I'd like to see those that work in the school carry concealed. Not every teacher wouldn't feel comfortable about carrying....but if you get 5-10 in the school to carry to include coaches, maintenance, admins. Again background checks, training and yearly qualifications would be in order. For those that carry a "pro pay" of 100-200 dollars a month would be afforded to those teachers.

Just my two cents as a parent with a kiddo in school.

[Ezzzzy1]

I don't think it's a fiscal answer to put LEO in every school.I know a lot of high schools have them in larger cities,but to put them in every school is going to mean the dreaded tax increase to hire more LEO's....I'd like to see those that work in the school carry concealed. Not every teacher wouldn't feel comfortable about carrying....but if you get 5-10 in the school to carry to include coaches, maintenance, admins. Again background checks, training and yearly qualifications would be in order. For those that carry a "pro pay" of 100-200 dollars a month would be afforded to those teachers.

Just my two cents as a parent with a kiddo in school.

And I think this is the solution. Im not sure the extra pay would even need to be there (especially if we are talking about fiscal answers), it would just be something they are "allowed" to do.

There are a ton of teachers that would CCW and it sure would put the kibosh on shootings in schools, if anything else hopefully limit the casualties if someone was stupid enough to try.

Hell, even if no teachers carried in a certain school still the thought that they might be would be a huge deterrent.

Put them through a full blown training and let em' carry.

PROBLEM SOLVED

[Captain Obvious]

Not unlike Arapahoe, we had designated School Resource Officers when I was growing up. Elementary, Middle AND High School. Officers designated to the school for several years, then they would rotate out and new officers would be assigned. Sometime they would return after a while for another multi-year stint.

They handled all the legal issues that occurred instead of calling an on duty patrol. And my middle school in particular was bad.

Perhaps it cost a bit more in taxes, but doesn't that argument seem stupid when it comes to the safety of kids? Bet all the parents in Newtown would be willing to pay an extra $20 in taxes (or whatever the tax hike would be).

I would also support a training and licensing program for educators (at any level) to be able to concealed carry and be considered a "first responder". Heck, if I was a teacher, I would WANT to be part of the solution.

[Hoot]

Maybe? I would never stop blaming myself if anything happened to the kids like an accidental shooting. I also wonder what would happen if any kid got their hands on a gun accidentally as well?

Don't wonder. Teach them how to properly handle the situation. Firearm education goes a long way.

I'm curious. Based on your statements, is it safe to say you have never handled or fired a gun?

Many people who are opposed to them have never been around them and seem to fear them. I'm convinced a better understanding of how to safely handle and/or use a firearm would change some people's view. Firearms are not unsafe.

http://m.kptv.com/w/main/story/80962521/

We always here about children who are killed accidentally when they find a weapon. Maybe if there were taught how to safely handle the situation there would be less chance of accidental deaths due to firearms.

[Repsol a095]

I have fired a few guns at the range with my brother-in-law who is a retired marine. It was fun there, but I still have no interest in owning or using a firearm in the classroom.

In my opinion, carrying is not the solution, just a band aid that is going to lead to fear and more problems.

I am not willing to be a part of that "solution" nor would I want my son's teachers to do the same.

[The GECCO]

People only make a stink because they hate Obama. If it was Reagan or Bush's kids, no one would say shit. <snip>

That's because it's not hypocritical when (most) Republicans are pro-gun for the protection of themselves and their family members...

[Hoot]

I have fired a few guns at the range with my brother-in-law who is a retired marine. It was fun there, but I still have no interest in owning or using a firearm in the classroom.

In my opinion, carrying is not the solution, just a band aid that is going to lead to fear and more problems.

I am not willing to be a part of that "solution" nor would I want my son's teachers to do the same.

No matter how I say this its gonna sound like a dick question but I'm just wondering.

If this solution isn't viable in your opinion. What is? How do we prevent this from happening?

[Zanatos]

I am a high school teacher who is also a retired Air Force security specialist. I would feel completely comfortable carrying a weapon while teaching. However, I would be very concerned about personal liability.

I am alarmed at how many people purchase weapons and are able to get concealed carry permits, but do not practice with their weapon and do not know the laws and rules regarding the application of deadly force.

[TFOGGuys]

I am a high school teacher who is also a retired Air Force security specialist. I would feel completely comfortable carrying a weapon while teaching. However, I would be very concerned about personal liability.

I am alarmed at how many people purchase weapons and are able to get concealed carry permits, but do not practice with their weapon and do not know the laws and rules regarding the application of deadly force.

You would be the ideal type of person for this program. Liability issues could be resolved by granting teachers that use their CCW in defense of children the same sort of sovereign immunity(criminal and civil) granted to police officers in the course of their duties.

[jbnwc]

Good luck with that. The government has ZERO obligation to protect citizens.

That's EXACTLY my point! The gov't has NO obligation to protect us and I don't think they should. More importantly, however, is that they also have no right to say that we can't protect ourselves.

[jbnwc]

I don't think it's a fiscal answer to put LEO in every school.I know a lot of high schools have them in larger cities,but to put them in every school is going to mean the dreaded tax increase to hire more LEO's....I'd like to see those that work in the school carry concealed. Not every teacher wouldn't feel comfortable about carrying....but if you get 5-10 in the school to carry to include coaches, maintenance, admins. Again background checks, training and yearly qualifications would be in order. For those that carry a "pro pay" of 100-200 dollars a month would be afforded to those teachers.

Just my two cents as a parent with a kiddo in school.

I like this, too. Rational, easy, cost effective, and certainly better than what we currently have.

[jbnwc]

I have fired a few guns at the range with my brother-in-law who is a retired marine. It was fun there, but I still have no interest in owning or using a firearm in the classroom.

In my opinion, carrying is not the solution, just a band aid that is going to lead to fear and more problems.

I am not willing to be a part of that "solution" nor would I want my son's teachers to do the same.

Here's another perfect example of why parents should be allowed more freedom to choose the school their kids go to. If one school has CCW's and one doesn't, let the parents decide whether or not their kids go there.

Off topic!

[JKOL]

No matter how I say this its gonna sound like a dick question but I'm just wondering.

If this solution isn't viable in your opinion. What is? How do we prevent this from happening?

:imwithstupid:

I was just about to ask the same thing. Clearly the GUN FREE DRUG FREE school zone signs aren't doing their job. Time to try something new.

The nice thing about America is freedom of choice. There are people like Repsol a095 that aren't comfortable with firearms and don't feel they need one, I can understand that and respect that opinion. I fall on the other side of things, I would rather have a gun and not need it, then need it and not have it.

I don't have a problem with the presidents kids having secret service protection despite my dislike of Obama, I understand the reasons we protect the presidents kids. I do have a problem when people that have never held a gun, decide they are experts on firearms and tell me I have zero use or need for a firearm. I have a problem with the hypocrisy of politicians like Dianne Feinstein that are trying to pass a ridiculous weapons ban, while she herself has a concealed carry permit. I have a problem when members of the media tell the NRA the idea of having armed security in schools is insane, crazy, careless, but they themselves send their kids to private schools with armed security. Few things piss me off more than the "do as I say, not as I do" mentality that seems to apply to so many politicians, celebrities, and media personalities.

[Ghosty]

Tackle the mental health issue. Very few of these "mass murder/suicides" were done by mentally stable people, and NONE were done by stable responsible gun owners.

Congress doesn't have a clue.

[Ezzzzy1]

Tackle the mental health issue. Very few of these "mass murder/suicides" were done by mentally stable people, and NONE were done by stable responsible gun owners.

Congress doesn't have a clue.

Its more like tackle the poor parenting issue. Its to the point in this country that even if (and I really do mean EVEN IF) a parent has the tools to raise their kids correctly they either cant or dont.

No one that ever shot up a school surprised anyone. Every single time tons of people are like "yeah, we figured that was coming"...

Chris Rock "that kid never had a chance, if you met his momma youd know that"

[asp_125]

I don't think it's a fiscal answer to put LEO in every school.I know a lot of high schools have them in larger cities,but to put them in every school is going to mean the dreaded tax increase to hire more LEO's....I'd like to see those that work in the school carry concealed. Not every teacher wouldn't feel comfortable about carrying....but if you get 5-10 in the school to carry to include coaches, maintenance, admins. Again background checks, training and yearly qualifications would be in order. For those that carry a "pro pay" of 100-200 dollars a month would be afforded to those teachers.

Just my two cents as a parent with a kiddo in school.

But if the NRA is soooo behind this proposal why would it cost tax dollars? Why doesn't the NRA put the money where their mouth is? *sound of crickets*

You could subsidize this with a portion of gun sales / registration fees etc and that way the gun owners would feel all good about themselves towards helping fix the problem. *sound of more crickets*

[hcr25]

In my opinion there is more value on material things then human life. Walk into a bank and there is a armed guard, same at many jewelry stores. Cash and jewelry has more value then our kids?

We will never be able to stop all the broken people from doing terrible things to our children or us. Training peolpe who are willing to learn how to use a firearm in defense is a good start. We always here teachers say they would do anything to protect their students. I have alot of respect for that and everything else they do. Unfortunately throwing a text book at the shooter or being a human shield wont deter a gunman want to kill people.

[JKOL]

Tackle the mental health issue. Very few of these "mass murder/suicides" were done by mentally stable people, and NONE were done by stable responsible gun owners.

Congress doesn't have a clue.

Exactly. As an example of how highly I regard all politicians, I truly believe they saw Newtown not as a tragic event, but as a means to push their agendas. It seemed like it went from "26 people killed" to "ban all guns, gun owners are evil people that don't care about our children's safety" so quickly, the tragedy was lost and it was time to use the event to capitalize on pushing the gun banning agenda. The solutions politicians have proposed have been 1 of 2 things, ban everything that goes bang or lets create a permitting system that will generate more revenue for the government. No solution they proposed to this point addresses the problem.

Here is a solution worth trying. Lets have a system for gun dealers that says someone tried to buy a gun from you, but they refused to fill out background check, call your local police department. A cop could take 20 minutes out of their day of writing traffic citations, and ask some questions. Why did this person not want the background check? Did they forget their ID, or maybe they are illiterate and are embarassed to admit it, or maybe there is a reason they know they won't pass a check, and yet they are still trying to get a gun. Maybe a cop would have realized this kid was off. The cops could have asked the mother "do you own any firearms?" and informed her that her crazy son is trying to get his hands on a gun, so she knows she needs to make sure her guns are out of the house. The problem is, this will never happen, because we are too afraid of violating someones rights. God forbid we discover that strange kid isn't just shy or socially awkward because Sarah wouldn't go to Prom with him, but he is actually F&*KING NUTS. As a gun owner, I would have zero problem with a few extra steps in purchasing a firearm if it was designed to actually help prevent sick people from getting them legally.

Is it flawless? Absolutely not, is it better than just banning or creating a revenue generating permit system? Absolutely.

[asp_125]

Exactly.. if the CSC is representative of the larger population, the threads immediately after the Newton shootings went quickly from talk of tragedy to defense of guns. Priorities are really screwed up in this country.

[CaptGoodvibes]

I am a teacher, and I would never even consider carrying/owning a gun; nor, would I ever want my son's teachers carrying a gun for many reasons.

I am not trained, and I would not feel qualified to shoot anyone in any situation.

I did not "sign up" to carry out armed protection. I love my kids, and I would do anything to protect them, but I don't know if I could live with myself if I accidentally killed anyone or if I missed my target.
Obviously not.

But think of the bright side. If you are in the worst possible scenario, you will be the first to be gunned down in the massacre just before all your "kids" get it too.

Anything? Hardly.

Really, it doesn't matter. If you die, you won't care. :devil1:

[CaptGoodvibes]

Maybe? I would never stop blaming myself if anything happened to the kids like an accidental shooting. I also wonder what would happen if any kid got their hands on a gun accidentally as well?

You honestly think the specter of armed soldiers in school is better for your "kids" than if you were to HTFU and get some training so you can keep the constant watch hidden from young student's eyes?

[Hoot]

Exactly.. if the CSC is representative of the larger population, the threads immediately after the Newton shootings went quickly from talk of tragedy to defense of guns. Priorities are really screwed up in this country.

Yeah, why worry about the economy or a fiscal cliff when we can take away thousands of jobs of people that work in a legitimate industry because you don't like what they like?

[Radek]

even if you carry gun ,if someone shows up in armed force gear with assault rifle you cant just fire at him .Good thing they work allone,cant immagine whole track peoples like that arrives somewhere and then tell public they all not there and it wasnt planed

[Hoot]

But if the NRA is soooo behind this proposal why would it cost tax dollars? Why doesn't the NRA put the money where their mouth is? *sound of crickets*

You could subsidize this with a portion of gun sales / registration fees etc and that way the gun owners would feel all good about themselves towards helping fix the problem. *sound of more crickets*

I'm sure the NRA would be happy to fund training courses for teachers who would be willing to conceal carry. Why hire a single uniformed officer when you can train multiple people who are already there and won't be known to the public for less and arguably be more effective?

Oh wait, an idea that makes sense... We don't like that so it couldn't work.

[The Black Knight]

even if you carry gun ,if someone shows up in armed force gear with assault rifle you cant just fired at him .Good thing theywork allone,cant immagine whole track peoples like that arrives somewhere and tell public they all not there and it wasnt planed

:wtf:

[rforsythe]

:wtf:

Drugs are a much larger problem in schools.

[bluedogok]

But if the NRA is soooo behind this proposal why would it cost tax dollars? Why doesn't the NRA put the money where their mouth is? *sound of crickets*

You could subsidize this with a portion of gun sales / registration fees etc and that way the gun owners would feel all good about themselves towards helping fix the problem. *sound of more crickets*
It isn't like it was a "new idea", former President Bill Clinton proposed the same thing back when he was president on the first anniversary of Columbine.

Los Angeles Times - April 16, 2000: Clinton Pledges Funds to Add Police to Schools (http://articles.latimes.com/2000/apr/16/news/mn-20323)




Exactly.. if the CSC is representative of the larger population, the threads immediately after the Newton shootings went quickly from talk of tragedy to defense of guns. Priorities are really screwed up in this country.
Both sides didn't take long to use the event as a means to their ends, Mayor Bloomberg was calling for gun control a few hours after Newtown. Neither side has any room to blame the other for not allowing enough time" to begin discussion on things surrounding the event.

As others have stated, the mental health issue of the 800 lb. gorilla in the room and neither side really wants to deal with that issue when the object is easier. We are seeing the results of The Community Mental Health Act of 1963 dismantling the mental health care system in this country.

[#1Townie]

Exactly.. if the CSC is representative of the larger population, the threads immediately after the Newton shootings went quickly from talk of tragedy to defense of guns. Priorities are really screwed up in this country.

Oh i agree with you with all that. As to the reference of how the thread about the ct shooting went to where it did you only have to look at the very first post. "And people say we dont need gun control." How do you not defend guns when they are blamed before we even know what happened? I truly agree with you that our priorities are very screwed up. Everytime something like this happens we blame guns. We never talk about the mentally ill even though most of the shooters of mental illness. So yes i agree with you that our priorities are very screwed uo because once again we are talking about the tool used and not the cause.

Not trying to blamr anyone for anything it was a emotional response to a very sad thing.

[TFOGGuys]

More people are killed with hammers each year than with the types of firearms they are trying to ban...