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View Full Version : Switching back from Water to Antifreeze ?



BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 06:39 AM
Alright so winter is coming and Im told I should change the water out of the R6 and put anti freeze in during the winter. I have never had to do this before and Im not sure where to start.
First of all: Its in a garage all winter....is it a must?

If so where do I begin? I obviously know where the radiator is and all but what do I need to do to drain it? Also what do I need to get to put in it? Reg old anti freeze or is there a special kind I need for bikes? Also do I mix with water or just fill with straight anti freeze?

The more specific the better. Im plannin to do it this weekend so post up all........



Thanks for any suggestions and info.

yakuza
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:00 AM
Hey Dion, if you don't have the service manual for the bike, I'd get that ASAP. It will outline all the steps needed, including the torque settings for the drain bolt at the water pump and the drain bolt on the engine block. Usually you remove the radiator cap, open the drain bolt at the water pump (mine is indicated with a mark to show which bolt is the drain), and then remove the drain bolt at the engine block (mine is behind the headers on the block). It wouldn't hurt to run some distilled water through there to flush out the system, I'd recommend distilled water to avoid adding minerals or other contaminates from tap water. Then you should be able to just reinstall the drain bolts and fill the system with your distilled water/antifreeze mix. Oh, drain and fill the overflow reservoir too.

Your bike might be fine in the garage over the winter, as long as it is attached and/or heated. The danger is that water expands, and if it were to freeze it could crack your block and destroy your radiator. Also, something people often don't think about is how cold it can get on the way home from a trackday over the winter, especially if your bike is on a trailer. That's a lot of cold air flowing through the radiator, and if it's even close to freezing it could freeze the water and destroy the block/radiator as mentioned above.

Good luck, and get that service manual! :up:

BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:07 AM
AS always Alex. Thank you. I do have the service manual for my R1 and I have been working to find an online copy for the R6. As soon as I find it I will print it off as well.

The garage is attached and stays pretty warm but I dont want to take the chance.

What kind of anti freeze do I need? Reg stuff or something special? I think from your explanation I will be able to get the job done. Ill get on that Serv manual today as well. Thanks for the tips.

yakuza
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:14 AM
Ya know, I don't have a clue what antifreeze to get, but I do know to not just get automotive antifreeze, some of those have additives (silicates, I think?) that can be harmful to the bikes system. Whatever they have at the Yamaha shop should be fine. :up: Oh, and I bet the process for the R1 is nearly identical to the R6, you could probably use it as a reference for basic stuff like that until you get the R6 service manual.

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:14 AM
Alright so winter is coming and Im told I should change the water out of the R6 and put anti freeze in during the winter.

You should NEVER run just plain water in your engine. Antifreeze not only provides freezing protection but, provides boil-over protection and corrosion resistance as well. Your engine will definitely run hotter on just plain water.

While we're at it... A lot of people also think removing the thermostat will make an engine run cooler too. Big time myth!!!!! When the thermostat is removed, the water doesn't sit long enough in the water jackets to absorb any heat. It's like touching a hot stove burner real quick - no burn. Leave it there for a second and your hand will absorb a lot of heat - big ol' burn. If your bike or car is running hot and the radiator is clean, believe it or not, a hotter thermo is usually the answer. It allows the water to sit a little longer in the radiator and cool more while also staying in the jackets longer to absorb more heat. Removing the thermo also causes cavitation at the water pump. Air bubbles = over-heating.

Ring! Ring! Class is over 8)

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:22 AM
Ya know, I don't have a clue what antifreeze to get, but I do know to not just get automotive antifreeze, some of those have additives (silicates, I think?) that can be harmful to the bikes system.

Yamaha says to use any coolant with corrosion resitance for aluminum engines. Automotive is perfectly fine. That same manual, also, says never run just water.

BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:23 AM
Well I have water wetter in there too. Not just plain water.

The fan has been set up on a manual switch as well to turn on and off as I want to keep the temp where I need it. Generally its on all the time. Or most of it anyway. I run about 190 deg. I assume the thermo is gone with this set up......

ANyone finds an online copy of the serv manual post a link. Im on R6-forum looking now........

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:34 AM
Well I have water wetter in there too. Not just plain water.

Chech this out - http://www.redlineoil.com/redlineoil/wwti.htm


I run about 190 deg. I assume the thermo is gone with this set up......

My R1 runs at 165. You better hope there's a thermostat in there. I know mechanics who think removing it works too. Just more proof that people don't know what they're talking about. Please don't take this the wrong way. I'm just trying to kill a few myths while, hopefully, helping out.

For what it's worth - some drag racers do remove the thermo, however, they also have to add a restrictor in the thermo location to prevent cavitiation and to slow the water speed down. But that's drag racing - i.e. very short run times.

Hoopty
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:41 AM
Dean, he has no antifreeze in his bike because it is not allowed in race bikes (super slick if it gets on the track). You use water wetter instead...

BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:45 AM
Dont get me wrong the bike runs much cooler at high speeds. But on average when Im slow enough to check it its about 185 - 190. My R1 with Anti in it rund that up to 210 deg.

I dont dispute what U say. Im sure U R right. Main focus at ths point is just making sure I dont crack a block.......Cant afford that for sure.

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:45 AM
Dean, he has no antifreeze in his bike because it is not allowed in race bikes (super slick if it gets on the track). You use water wetter instead...

Yeah, I get it. I'm just saying never run plain water. Water wetter is what we used to run in our dragsters. Works GREAT with antifreeze in cars too. Lowers your temp. an easy 10 deg.

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 08:48 AM
Main focus at ths point is just making sure I dont crack a block.......Cant afford that for sure.

No doubt, bro. I missed a drain plug (1 out of 6) on my boat one year. Fortunately, it was right next to a freeze plug and that's what popped instead of the block. Shwuuu!!!!!!!! Had to pull a motor mount to put it back in, though. :x

BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 09:02 AM
Whoo hooo found it

http://stuff.onyxs10.com/R6_Manual_2003.pdf


Yeah My father missed one hose in his boat as well. Put a crack in the block so big U could put your hand in it.....Ooooops new engine on that one...... Gave a chance to upgrade to a 350 Block though. tee hee.


I also use Water wetter in it as well.

I printed the manual so I have it to find all the drains on her. Ill run by and get some Anti freeze at the dealer as well.

Thanks guys U are always the best place for the right answers.

yakuza
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 09:12 AM
Dean, weren't you telling me at Pueblo a couple months ago that you had taken your thermostat out, and you were having trouble with temps? ;)

BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 09:20 AM
:shock:

haha Busted. j/k

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 09:41 AM
Dean, weren't you telling me at Pueblo a couple months ago that you had taken your thermostat out, and you were having trouble with temps? ;)

Wasn't me. I've never been to the track at Pueblo or any track with my bike, except Bandimere.

yakuza
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 10:00 AM
Doh, I'm sorry, I've totally had you confused with someone else, my bad. :oops:

Hoopty
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 10:44 AM
That's the other Kim and Dean you're thinking of. :slap: :P

yakuza
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 11:21 AM
I know, right, how many can there be? :lol:

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 11:34 AM
Yeah My father missed one hose in his boat as well.

I also use Water wetter in it as well.

So, you must have a closed cooling system on that boat. I've always run anti-freeze in a closed system. Then, there's nothing to do when winter comes. ;) I'm laaaaaaaazy

BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 02:29 PM
If by closed U mean it doesnt pull water in from outside to use......no. It pulls water in from the lake to use for coolant. Then when winter comes pull all hoses off and plugs to get every drop of water out of there. Only a small amount = death thats for sure.

But I dont know a ton of that stuff. I just wake board when he says lets ride...... haha

Kim-n-Dean
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 02:54 PM
I thought you said you used water wetter in it. How do you do that if it's open?

Anyway, I have a special pan that wraps around my drive and I can run anti-freeze through my engine first. Then I pull my plugs. Although, the purpose of the drive pan is so you don't have to pull any plugs (or hoses) I just like to make sure. I got it from Overton's.

BlueDevil
Tue Sep 30th, 2003, 03:01 PM
:lol: Water wetter is in the bike. haha Sorry for the confusion. Guess that happens when we drift off topic. haha

Nah the boat runs water in it to cool it. In the Bike I use water as well with water wetter added to it. That clear it up?

Bryce
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 01:30 PM
hey Dion why even bother putting antifreeze in it just drain the system an refill when you go out riding that way you don't have to flush it next year?

BlueDevil
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 01:48 PM
That makes sense. Only reason not to is if a track day comes up in the winter time but I doubt that. Im just gonna start early next season. WHo knows? Thanks for the idea. I have the R1 for street riding and I still ride it all the time so that sounds like a good idea.

yakuza
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 01:49 PM
Bryce, any danger of the cooling system rusting or anything like that if you leave it drained for long periods of time?

BlueDevil
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 01:54 PM
Good call. I would think if U had it drained and dry then no.....but if U dont.....Eeeeek!

266
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 03:03 PM
If the bike is not going to be exposed to freezing temps. I would just leave it alone. Also, if it is going to sit for awhile add stabilizer to the fuel. If it is a carburated bike start the bike so the stabilized fuel gets into the float bowls. Or you can just drain the bowls and tank. You dont want to have to clean the carbs next season.

Anonymous
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 03:09 PM
If the bike is not going to be exposed to freezing temps. I would just leave it alone. Also, if it is going to sit for awhile add stabilizer to the fuel. If it is a carburated bike start the bike so the stabilized fuel gets into the float bowls. Or you can just drain the bowls and tank. You dont want to have to clean the carbs next season.

Yep, turn the fuel petcock off and run it til it dies, then crank it for 30 more sec. Empty the tank into your car.

Or just ride it over the wintertime, heck it's chilly but the weather here ain't that bad. :idea: Even when I can't ride, I always run it every week when it's cold out for about 20 minutes in the garage. This keeps fluids moving, burns off condensation, and lets me annoy my neighbors.

BlueDevil
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 03:13 PM
If the bike is not going to be exposed to freezing temps. I would just leave it alone. Also, if it is going to sit for awhile add stabilizer to the fuel. If it is a carburated bike start the bike so the stabilized fuel gets into the float bowls. Or you can just drain the bowls and tank. You dont want to have to clean the carbs next season.


Well it will be in the garage and its attached. Im not sure it gets to cold in there. My windows never freeze or anything......... Its an 03R6 so its FI but I will run the gas out or remove it anyway. Old gas = bad news.

Will it be fine in the garage?

Thanks everyone. I appreciate your suggestions.

266
Wed Oct 1st, 2003, 09:48 PM
If the bike is not going to be exposed to freezing temps. I would just leave it alone. Also, if it is going to sit for awhile add stabilizer to the fuel. If it is a carburated bike start the bike so the stabilized fuel gets into the float bowls. Or you can just drain the bowls and tank. You dont want to have to clean the carbs next season.


Well it will be in the garage and its attached. Im not sure it gets to cold in there. My windows never freeze or anything......... Its an 03R6 so its FI but I will run the gas out or remove it anyway. Old gas = bad news.

Will it be fine in the garage?

Thanks everyone. I appreciate your suggestions.

I doubt it will get to freezing in your garage.

Since it is fuel injected. I would add stabilizer to the fuel and run it through. If you can, run it from time to time. That will never hurt it. If you add more gas add more stabilizer. It is best to keep the tank full. An empty tank will rust. Colorado or not, RUST HAPPENS.

BlueDevil
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 06:35 AM
Thanks for the tip. What is a good fuel additive to use for that?

266
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 09:36 AM
It is called "Sta-bil". It can be found at any automotive parts store. You wont need to buy the biggest bottle. I think 1 ounce treats 2-1/2 gallons of fuel. I have some here at the shop also. Though I only have the big bottles, I use it to winterize jet skis.

BlueDevil
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 10:00 AM
Thanks. THen when riding time comes again I just fill it up as normal and ride. No other maint needed?

Ill get some today. Thanks.

BTW? Is this Sean from Metro? or do U all share the sign on?

Anonymous
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 10:06 AM
Just run that tank through like any other as you ride, then just fill up at the pump like normal.

Hoopty
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 10:11 AM
Sean is a bitch. :doublefinger: :lol: How's your shoulder buddy?

BlueDevil
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 10:18 AM
Doh!!

Yeah I saw the crash on Sun. U mentioned U felt like U were going to puke...... everything ok now?

266
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 11:18 AM
Doh!!

Yeah I saw the crash on Sun. U mentioned U felt like U were going to puke...... everything ok now?

Healing.

I learned a lesson. As good as Go-Fast are any other time of the day. It is not a good idea having one after crashing. Really upsets the body.

Also with the Sta-bil. When ride time comes just fill and go. No need to drain anything.

266
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 11:25 AM
Sean is a bitch. :doublefinger: :lol: How's your shoulder buddy?

Shoulder is better.

Easy with the name calling. Or I'll have to retaliate and I dont want to hurt anyones feelings. You panzy sack licker. :shock: :alien:

:D

Anonymous
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 11:28 AM
You panzy sack licker. :shock: :alien:

:D

Doubt that will hurt his feelings ... I mean, he IS a panzy sack licker, that's just reality...

Hoopty
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 11:31 AM
Ummm Ralph? He was talking about me, not Big J. :lol: :doublefinger:

BlueDevil
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 11:32 AM
Slam dat dada dat dada
Slam dat dada dat dada

haha


Thanks for the tip.

266
Wed Oct 8th, 2003, 12:30 PM
You panzy sack licker. :shock: :alien:

:D

Doubt that will hurt his feelings ... I mean, he IS a panzy sack licker, that's just reality...

So calling him a hetero male will hurt more?