Returning a bike to stock gearing

[GMR]

Sorry I've been on a thread-making tear lately...

I'm in the market for a new bike. I'm a purist and prefer my bikes to be pretty much stock, but unfortunately for me the sprocket mod is very common. How much money should I expect to spend on returning it to stock? And please enlighten me on speedohealers. Do I just take it off once I put on stock sprockets?

Also, how much top end do you lose when you go say one down in front, +2 in the rear? Not that I'm likely to ever go that fast or should, but still curious

[Generic]

On my bikes it's all of about $50 for a stock set of gears and then about 45-1 an hour for the change.
Speed healer you'd just remove if it was ever installed.

Top end? Depends on the bike, 10-20MPH

http://www.gearingcommander.com/

[Wrider]

Keep in mind the gearing change is nice because it gives you more power in a usable range rather than high up.

[Generic]

Keep in mind the gearing change is nice because it gives you more power in a usable range rather than high up.

It's like you gain back all the HP you lost due to altitude. However if you are doing a lot of hwy riding be aware that it can push the RPMs up into the "buzzy" region depending on the bike, one reason I went back to stock on my Z

[GMR]

Keep in mind the gearing change is nice because it gives you more power in a usable range rather than high up.

Yea but I've never ridden a geared bike so I'm used to it. I want to feel the raw power difference between a 600 and 750, not a geared bike. I can always go back, but except for my R6 which has horribly sluggish low end I think bikes are fast enough as is.

[FZRguy]

Well, everything about a new to you bike is gonna be different. Ride the bike as is, and change whatever you don't like.

[Wrider]

It's like you gain back all the HP you lost due to altitude. However if you are doing a lot of hwy riding be aware that it can push the RPMs up into the "buzzy" region depending on the bike, one reason I went back to stock on my Z

Yeah that's the same reason I'm at stock gearing. I wish I had the option because of the acceleration and lack of top speed anyway, but I really don't want to be buzzy on the highway.

[rybo]

Changing the gearing doesn't "give you back the power" you lose due to altitude, it simply changes the number of engine revolutions per mile traveled. We can argue that it "puts you in the power band" or something like that, but really all it does is change the number of engine revolutions per mile traveled.

Putting it back to stock depends a lot on what modification has been done. Has the chain size been changed? Lots of bikes come with a 525 chain stock and when the gearing gets changed they install a 520 chain. How far back to stock do you want to go?

Regardless, unless the chain is almost new, I would strongly suggest changing the chain if you change the sprockets. The two pieces wear together and usually if you just change sprockets and there are lots of miles on the existing chain you will start tearing up sprockets pretty quickly.

Cost? A good chain is about $100 and good set of sprockets will be between $50 and $100 depending on what you want.

Speedohealer - yup, all you have to do is unplug it.

Best!

[Generic]

Changing the gearing doesn't "give you back the power" you lose due to altitude, it simply changes the number of engine revolutions per mile traveled. We can argue that it "puts you in the power band" or something like that, but really all it does is change the number of engine revolutions per mile traveled.


I understand that, it's why I said "it's like" not "It does" I was trying to keep it simple because the question itself wasn't technical in nature. Besides, what it actually does it change the the torque multiplying effect of the transmission and gears, again making the bike ride as if it had more power lower in the band vs. actual power higher up to drive it to higher speeds.

[jlr]

I don't think you guys are using the strict technical definitions of power and torque. If you do, then while changing gearing doesn't change the power of the bike, it definitely does change the torque at the rear wheel. Since torque is what determines acceleration, the -1/+2 setup will definitely pull harder with everything else being the same, even though the engine is producing the same amount of power in either case. So, it definitely does more than just change the RPM at a given road speed.

[UHATEIT]

I don't think you guys are using the strict technical definitions of power and torque. If you do, then while changing gearing doesn't change the power of the bike, it definitely does change the torque at the rear wheel. Since torque is what determines acceleration, the -1/+2 setup will definitely pull harder with everything else being the same, even though the engine is producing the same amount of power in either case. So, it definitely does more than just change the RPM at a given road speed.

Since I know nothing of this whole stuff, I really want to actually get that lower end torque. I recently bought a Ninja 636 but really miss the all around torque I have on the SV650. Would this 1 down in front and 2 up in rear give me somewhat of a noticeable difference? I am actually due for a chain soon so I would like to see about getting the torque up if at all possible since I rarely get into the higher rpm range and have no desire to max out the overall speed

[Generic]

Since I know nothing of this whole stuff, I really want to actually get that lower end torque. I recently bought a Ninja 636 but really miss the all around torque I have on the SV650. Would this 1 down in front and 2 up in rear give me somewhat of a noticeable difference? I am actually due for a chain soon so I would like to see about getting the torque up if at all possible since I rarely get into the higher rpm range and have no desire to max out the overall speed

Yes, it will be very noticeable, I went just one down on my Z and it picked right up. It's not going to replace all that down low torque the SV had but it will make the 636 pull better down low.

[jlr]

Yes, it will be very noticeable, I went just one down on my Z and it picked right up. It's not going to replace all that down low torque the SV had but it will make the 636 pull better down low.

Yep, better down low and a little scarier :scream2: up top.

BTW, I've heard that on some bikes the stock gearing is higher than optimum simply so the manufactures can pass the federal noise regulations. Taller gearing keeps the RPM and noise level down for the test, but resulting in a bike that is geared taller than it would have been without the noise requirement.

[UHATEIT]

Wow now I really would like to get this done. Like I said I need a new chain coming up soon so I want to know what the best option is for me. Granted yes it will not be SV torque but a little more would be excellent!

I have a 2005 Ninja 636 model. How many up or down for front and back?

[jlr]

The common kits are -1 up front and +2 at the wheel. I think the reason they do this is it keeps the chain length almost the same. If/when you do it let us know what you think.

[Wrider]

Yep, better down low and a little scarier :scream2: up top.

BTW, I've heard that on some bikes the stock gearing is higher than optimum simply so the manufactures can pass the federal noise regulations. Taller gearing keeps the RPM and noise level down for the test, but resulting in a bike that is geared taller than it would have been without the noise requirement.

That's not true because they test exhaust noise levels at a certain RPM level, not at a certain speed, at least on a federal level. Some states apparently do it by speed, but it's the feds that the manufacturers are complying with. IIRC it's 5500 RPM at which the feds check noise levels.

[jlr]

That's not true because they test exhaust noise levels at a certain RPM level, not at a certain speed, at least on a federal level. Some states apparently do it by speed, but it's the feds that the manufacturers are complying with. IIRC it's 5500 RPM at which the feds check noise levels.

Can't remember where I saw/heard that? One of the m/c rags or you tube or... Anyway, I just googled it and it looks like you're correct, so I stand corrected on that one.

[FZRguy]

Down 1 on the counter = up 3 on the rear sprocket. So -1/+2 is similar to +5 on the rear, which is a faily large change. Unless wheelies are your bag, I'd be reluctant to make that big of a change from stock on a street bike. Could just do -1 or +3 for a less dramatic change....but you really won't know if that's what you want til you ride the new gearing.

[FZRguy]

If I did the math correctly, -1/+2 on my FZR would result in a 12% increase in RPM for a given gear and speed. 75 MPH in 6th gear is currently about 5800 RPM. Geared RPM at 75 would = about 6500.

[UHATEIT]

I have been discussing with people at some shops and with some on the kawasaki forums and yes the -1 front and +2 rear is the combo people seem to like, and will still use the 520 chain that I have. There is supposedly some change in mpg due to being at a higher RPM on the freeway (rather than cruising on the freeway at 70MPH and being at 6500 rpm you would be at 7500-8000 or so). I could see that as being annoying on the freeway due to more droning from the exhaust and echoeing in the helmet.

Some people have said just doing a $20 front sprocket and dropping it -1 in front wont even be noticeable, while some others have told me it is noticeable, and others have said its a big difference. I'm a little lost on that. One guy mentioned that he did -1 up front and enjoyed it, but now is at -1 front and +2 rear and likes it even more. Mentioned that the -1 up front only raised the freeway cruising RPM about 500RPM which wouldnt be too bad, you would of course sacrifice some MPG with that. I do have to commute about 25-30 miles to get to the mountains for riding so that would be affected mainly.

The other thing the guy who disd a -1 up front and changed to the -1/+2 mentioned was that the difference at needing to shift quicker on the streets can sometimes seem to excessive and aggressive for riders who do a lot of just plain street riding. Have any of you noticed that being a bit too fast having to shift a lot quicker with the setup or is it not really that much of a hinderance

I imagine that regardless of doing JUST the -1 front or the full on -1/+2 combo either way I would need that motomummy speedo healer option as both of them will change the mileage on the bike and the speedo will also be off. That's another $70 to ad to the pot.

[BikesRider777]

From what I have read, the manufacturers do put taller gearing on bikes, but not for noise as much as gas mileage. Taller gearing keeps the rpms lower for a given speed, therefore requiring less gas to travel at given speed.

I always change my gearing to a shorter ratio, and it's always better for me. Especially at these higher altitudes. Yes I give up top end, but I stopped caring about going really fast in a straight line after about 2 months of riding. Though I must admit I love to haul balls up HP hill!