PMP trackdays rules change for 2007

[COS Mille]

I hope this is not premature, but I was checking out the PMP site and found this announcement posted by Ene on 28 Oct concerning motorcycle track days on the PMP forum. In short all non card carrying riders will have to attend a track day class in order to ride there. This is necessary for the tracks insurance.
I'm trying to get more information as 2007 is right around the corner.
Anybody here know more?
http://www.pueblomotorsportspark.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1329

I understand the why, safety has to be the #1 priority, but am sorry to see the simple track days go away, they were really a great way to get out and try it without excessive expense. It's what got me hooked.

[Bueller]

http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=7349

After Genes accident, people were moved to action, to try to prevent another needless tragedy. A little more restriction, but still the easiest/ cheapest trackday around.

[jplracing]

In short all non card carrying riders will have to attend a track day class in order to ride there. This is necessary for the tracks insurance.


Currently Earlene is on vacation and not do back to next week.

The track class is in process and waiting on a few answers back.

The reality is that for new or inexperienced riders ( or experienced riders either ) this really isn't that big of a deal. The class that earlene is reffering too is cheap compared to other track's requirements, broken bikes and broken bones.

Not to mention (and don't quote me on this) I don't believe there is a planned priced increase. So the $50/$75 is very cheap compared to other tracks in the country

[COS Mille]

I really agree with the insurance and safety issues facing PMP especially in light of what happened to Gene. I met and spoke to him at one of my first track days, he was a good guy.
I know PMP track days are among the least expensive in the country, that is what got most of us hooked on the track and off the street. I got so hooked over the past few years of track days (PMP and 2nd Creek) that I bought a track bike a month ago. Been going over it and getting all the loose things right (amazing this was a track qualified bike).
Now I'm wondering if I shouldn't take the plunge and just do the MRA race school and get licensed. Any insight into a 2007 class schedule? Cost increases for those classes? Nothing about 07 on the MRA web site yet.
I always promoted the track days to friends as a great way to ride fast in a safe environment. Wonder if the cost of the class will keep many away?
In any event, I'm looking forward to riding and getting faster (with the times I turn I can't help but get faster!). Classes are sure to help.

[jplracing]

Currently I don't believe the MRA has finalized their 07 schedule.

However, they have posted the tentative schedule at

http://forums.mra-racing.org/viewtopic.php?t=3195

Again, my opinion is that $200 is cheap compared to other tracks, and other problems. But with that said, the class structure is not finalized, therefore I don't think the cost is finalized either. Right now I have someone volenteering to provide a online "written test" thus leaving the enitre "class" day to be on track instruction...can't get much better than that, shit someone might learn something!..But again nothing is set in stone.

[green_zx7r]

Out of curiosity, I took Mark Schellinger's MRA class last summer, passed, and got my certificate, but didn't get a MRA racing license yet since I wasn't going to race this year. Is this enough to ride PMP?

Either way, I'm good with taking a class as well.

Yusuke

[Ene]

I just posted the requirements for both students and instructors. If you have show previous classes which have safety in the cirriculum your good to go.

The date of January 1 has been changed to April 1 (no foolin) to allow those wishing to take a class or get their previous creditials together to do so.

We are all on unchartered waters here but together we can make it work for all of us.

Thanks to everyone,
Earlene "Ene" Theis

[Clarkie]

so if we have been racing for many years (expert licence) but have no proof of taking a safety class are we required to go through the class?

[rybo]

Clarkie,

My prevoious conversations with Earlene indicate that the racing license IS the proof of having taken the class.

Scott

[Clarkie]

cool thanks Scott

[scott_tiller]

So lets see if I understand this correctly - I have to take a 8 hour class and pay $199 in order to ride at Pueblo, (a track that I have already had track time at this year), because I don't race and haven't taken an MRA class to get a race license?

I also assume then that if I held a MRA race license back in '99-'00 that I would also be required to attend this 8 hour class on how to ride and enter/exit a track that I have previously raced at and have had track time at this year as well?


BTW - I don't mean any disrespect...I understand the point of the classes. I think its a great idea for newbies, but having raced and having done plenty of track days I'm trying to see the value of the class.

[jplracing]

Scott

No disrespect taken

You may also find out more information on this thread

http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9665

Also, realize that the class structure isn't formal yet. The chances of us actually dealing with anybody for 8 hours and have them not go on overload is going to be pretty slim.

The current working idea is to do this insturction on a online format with with a 4 hour track day.

The other 2 things I want to point are:

1) I still need to talk with Earlene to discuss how far back MRA certification will go. Intially I would say that if your certification is still valid to qualify for a race license then you are good. But, please don't quote me on this but that is my first thought

2) I have received comitments from 2 very respectedcoaches in Colorado as well as some very accomplished racers to act as instructors. I plan on having a meeting before Christmas to confirm with all the instructors and will make an announcment then. But realize your time will be well spent with quality instruction

Please remember that just because we have done something before doesn't mean that we can't learn more. Personally I appauld Earlene and the PMP managment for taking this step...it has been a long time coming

[COS Mille]

Thanks for all the answers. $200 for the class isn't too bad. Will this "certificate" be transferable at other tracks like Hastings, or Miller? Is the MRA license usable at other facilities in the US?

[rybo]

Mille,

There is recopricity among many race organizations in the US that allow those with an MRA license to race with other organizations. Most other tracks I've been to outside of Colorado do not have open track days like we have here. We've been very lucky for a very long time to have such an inexpensive way to get onto the track.

Other places I've been only allow track time with organizaitons there to "run" the track day, such as NESBA or Sportbike Tracktime. These organizations charge big money (over 200 a day) for tracktime. I've been to several such days and have never been asked for any kind of credential. Most do a basic tech inspection to make sure that your bike is suitable to be on the track and do a basic riders meeting, but no real instruction of value.

PMP is going above and beyond to make sure that an inexpensive way to get on the track remains available to us. While an initial cost of about $200 seems like a lot, it is a one time expense and keeps open track days at a reasonable price. I applaud the effort!

Hope that helps

Scott

[jplracing]

Thanks for all the answers. $200 for the class isn't too bad. Will this "certificate" be transferable at other tracks like Hastings, or Miller? Is the MRA license usable at other facilities in the US?

Remember that this is a Pueblo only requirement as of today. I am unsure how other tracks handle the open track days. So to answer your question directly, the Cert is only for Pueblo. Ideally, I would like to see this format be continued in other area tracks, however I personally don't have the ability to make this happen as of today

Also this is NOT a MRA cert. This is a Pueblo Cert. You are more than willing to take the MRA cert class instead of this one if you wish. BUT AGAIN THIS CLASS WILL NOT ALLOW FOR MRA CERTIFICATION. The only reason that the MRA cert is allowed as an acceptable method of training is that some of the same information is covered there as well. This class is an alternative to those of you who do not want to race.

In terms of cost, I understand it may be a burden to some. However, please realize that a single track day in other parts of the country, Thunder Hill in N Cali for example, costs like $300. The Star School cost $300ish dollars a day. Freddie Spencer is more than that I think. So if some of you have to pay $200 up front to keep the track days at $50/$75 at Pueblo, I see it as a great investment not to mention the comittments I have received from some very fast ama level guys to help teach is well worth the money...remember you may learn something!

[elbromisto]

As an irredemable squid, I much prefer to have all the training/classes possible. This is especially true of guidance on specific environments. Even if I think something is redundant I still need reinforcement of basic techniques (this is a clutch, there are only two wheels on this vehicle, etc.). I appreciate PMP's effort and affordability.

[Ene]

I just received a phone call so please let me clarify. The basic safety class at Pueblo does NOT give you a MRA race license. You do NOT have to be a member of the MRA to take the Pueblo Class. If you can prove attendance at another safety class within the past 2-3 years this will be acceptable. Yes, some track do offer to acknowledge a class from their tracks as well. We do. Therefore, if you have taken a class at Miller, for example and have some documentation concerning that, PMP will honor it. We are NOT trying to "go into the business" of teaching nor do we want this mandated insurance requirement to give any user the idea they do not need further instruction. We highly encourge anyone which has not taken the MRA class or a private class to do so. They are the professionals and what they can teach you is invaluable.

If you have any questions, please let me or Joe know.

[Bassil Duwaik]

Thanks for the heads up

[N1KSS1KS1x]

As an irredemable squid, I much prefer to have all the training/classes possible. This is especially true of guidance on specific environments. Even if I think something is redundant I still need reinforcement of basic techniques (this is a clutch, there are only two wheels on this vehicle, etc.). I appreciate PMP's effort and affordability.

Yeah ok I'm lookin forward to dropping 2bills for someone to teach me how to use common sense Whoo hoo

[Clarkie]

Yeah ok I'm lookin forward to dropping 2bills for someone to teach me how to use common sense Whoo hoo

Lack of common sense got someone killed this year jackass

[rybo]

Yeah ok I'm lookin forward to dropping 2bills for someone to teach me how to use common sense Whoo hoo]

I can assure you that if these courses don't happen we would loose the ability to use Pueblo for test and tune trackdays all together. This option is far better. I've been to a fair number of trackdays both in the west and the midwest and have never seen places that allow the average rider, be them a racer or a street rider, the kind of access that the tracks here in Colorado have.

This ease of access is the reason that the accident that Clarkie speaks of ocurred. The rider that caused the accident had never been on a track before and didn't get ALL of the information he needed before heading out. The result was 2 riders dead at an open trackday in Colorado in 2006. It was an incredibly sad day as many of us here lost a friend and had to come to grips with the fact that what we do for recreation is very dangerous. One way to mitigate the risk is to assure that EVERY rider on the track demonstrates that they have the necessary skill to make the day as safe as possible.

Every other trackday I've been to has cost over $200 for the day. The $75 for a full day at Pueblo has been an amazing value and the $200 you are going to spend one time is worth keeping the track open to riders using it for test and tune.

Finally, I've seen a preliminary list of instructors for the courses and can promise you that by taking this course you WILL learn something (so long as you can remain open minded enough to do so).

Scott

[jplracing]

]

I can assure you that if these courses don't happen we would loose the ability to use Pueblo for test and tune trackdays all together. This option is far better. I've been to a fair number of trackdays both in the west and the midwest and have never seen places that allow the average rider, be them a racer or a street rider, the kind of access that the tracks here in Colorado have.

This ease of access is the reason that the accident that Clarkie speaks of ocurred. The rider that caused the accident had never been on a track before and didn't get ALL of the information he needed before heading out. The result was 2 riders dead at an open trackday in Colorado in 2006. It was an incredibly sad day as many of us here lost a friend and had to come to grips with the fact that what we do for recreation is very dangerous. One way to mitigate the risk is to assure that EVERY rider on the track demonstrates that they have the necessary skill to make the day as safe as possible.

Every other trackday I've been to has cost over $200 for the day. The $75 for a full day at Pueblo has been an amazing value and the $200 you are going to spend one time is worth keeping the track open to riders using it for test and tune.

Finally, I've seen a preliminary list of instructors for the courses and can promise you that by taking this course you WILL learn something (so long as you can remain open minded enough to do so).

Scott

Well said Scott!

[Auron]

So, after completing the new requirments, the track will be available to us as it was in 06'?

[jplracing]

So, after completing the new requirments, the track will be available to us as it was in 06'?

Correct.

[Ene]

Ditto Scott and Joe. The cost for track rental in 2007 will REMAIN the same as 2006. Your support of us is very appreciated. If we can help you enjoy your day, safely, at PMP and keep it within reach for all of us then life is good.

Thank you so much,
Ene

PS. To clarify- the only change in fees is: An exclusive for the day was changed from $1,000 per day to $1,200 per day for cars or bikes Monday through Friday. The individual rental rate did not change.