Sad to see, but that is reality

[pilot]

Reality or not, it is my perception, and perhaps yours, that more and more experienced riders are "hanging up the helmet" aka, selling the bike and gear, cutting back on social rides, sticking only to the track, etc. And, more and more inexperienced riders are joining us on the roads. It appears that the gap is widening.

It is kinda like watching the Race of the Rockies. If the leader is way out in front--that's cool but, we tend to watch the battle for second or third--where the action is. Just like we are seeing more articles and postings about accidents between cagers and newer/unprotected riders. Not so much, about those that are taking the sport in a positive direction.

This perception has even come up in my recent discussions with all classes of racers.

What to do? I'm not sure. Keep learning and passing it on, I guess.

Your thoughts?

~P

[BlueDevil]

Natural progression I guess.... Its really always been that way... If I did the stuff now that I did when I 1st started riding on the street... Id be dead for sure... I admit I was one of "those guys" Not that I dont ride street... Im not hanging up my street riding... but Id say Im more of a commuter now than anything else... no more hanging at "the spot", cruisin, canyons and SUV dodging, etc........

Several reasons why this happens.... One realizes his own mortality, to many costly tickets, mmm possibly license taken away, and old fashion maturity.... As you get older you realize that to enjoy certain things you have ot take control of safety 1st, fun second.... Im sure Ive left many angles of your discussion out... but these are a few thoughts I have on the topic

Disclaimer: This was in no way to bash street riders.... There are equal amounts of bad riders and good riders on both streets and track.....

[pauliep]

Well, I sat out most the season sitting in stands (or at the computer) reading the reports of the all accidents and deaths that have occured on the public roads. I mean just feel safer on the track. I still consider myself a young rider with a year or so of riding, but I don't feel inexperienced. Traffic goes the same direction and there's no intersections either, or even as many distractions also. Although there are some here that have good arguements that I've gotten hurt more on the track this year but I'm happy to say I jumped up each time and walked away and even rode away. Should those same low sides happen on the public roads with traffic in both directions to include cars, I might not be around. Did I mention the cell phone use on public roads. It's scary to think about and to take to time to notice how many are on their phones out there. Just my two cents, can't wait to get my MRA license

[Sortarican]

Saw TT5.0's FS post and started thinking the same thing.
The FOG forum is gonna consist of three street riders, a couple trackers, and old women like Krissy and Terri.
(Ouch, I'm smoking a turd in Hell for that one.)

Ah well, all we street riders are SUV fodder anyway.
I think the track guys may be onto something.

But who wants to live forever?......Really I'm asking.....Show of hands?

[Devaclis]

This entire topic irritates me.

Don't switch to track only riding because you are afraid of riding on the street. Do it because you love the track.

This board does a great job of reinforcing the need to ride safely. It also goes too far. It scares people out of riding. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO DIE ON YOUR BIKE. Get out and fucking ride for christ's sake. I have not been on a bike since Monday and I am going nuts!! I'd give just about anything to ride right now. I pretty much live to ride. It was a dream of mine for over 30 years.

People die in the shower, in their cars, giving birth to babies, playing basketball. Maybe we can all sit at home and knit protective helmets for our kids with REALLY dull knitting needles and sit slightly warm tea while petting our declawed, neutered, rabies vaccinated cats.

[pauliep]

This entire topic irritates me.

Don't switch to track only riding because you are afraid of riding on the street. Do it because you love the track.

Don't get me wrong, Boy do I love riding the track! I keep seeing that damn commerical for kawi with the guy that has like 5 turns in his drive way. I have serious thoughts of what kind of investment that would entail.

[Sully]

This entire topic irritates me.

Don't switch to track only riding because you are afraid of riding on the street. Do it because you love the track.

This board does a great job of reinforcing the need to ride safely. It also goes too far. It scares people out of riding. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO DIE ON YOUR BIKE. Get out and fucking ride for christ's sake. I have not been on a bike since Monday and I am going nuts!! I'd give just about anything to ride right now. I pretty much live to ride. It was a dream of mine for over 30 years.

People die in the shower, in their cars, giving birth to babies, playing basketball. Maybe we can all sit at home and knit protective helmets for our kids with REALLY dull knitting needles and sit slightly warm tea while petting our declawed, neutered, rabies vaccinated cats.

I'm afraid of Devaclis and his BIG YELLOW Honduuh... have you seen him wheelie that thing ? ...

As much as I love riding the track and gaining amazing knowledge, I will still love riding on the street... and will continue to do so

[Xtremjeepn]

Funny you should post this.

I was big time into sport riding and a bit of racing in the early 90s. Been on a bike since 1979(as a kid learning).

It always goes in "spurts". I felt exactly as you describe in your post, but back in the 93-94. Lost interest, felt the street was getting too dangerous, no money for the track and simply got into other hobbies. Got tired of all the new kids on the block etc.

Now I'm back on a sportbike. Have zero intention on riding the way I used to. But I am back no the less and enjoying every minute of it. Mostly as a squid commuter on my liter bike .

It really is just your perception on where you and your current friends are in the cycle.

[TT5.0]

I'm giving it up because it was getting to the point where I was dodging soccer moms on their cell phones daily. I'm pretty good at watching the cars around me, but it only takes one screw up to mess up your whole life, if not end it. I'm actually not as worried about myself, as I am for my wife. I'm giving up riding so that she will give up riding. Just the thought of her getting hurt on a bike, or even having to worry about it at all just isn't worth it in my book. If I get the bug again, I'll buy a track only bike. Much safer, and much more fun anyway.

[konichd]

For me, its not the risk, its the enjoyment.

I don't enjoy communting, its not for me. I do it every now and then and it just doesn't get me excited about riding a motorcycle.

However, heading out to the MoCo makes my heart race and I look forward to every weekend. There's something about heading out early and hitting the twisties that reminds me of the pure joy of riding a motorcycle. Same for the track, I love track days and it gets me excited to head out to Miller, VIR, Pueblo, etc. it gives me the sensation I'm looking for when I ride my bike.

Now I have wood

[pauliep]

Now I have wood

Some reason I think it's not totally because of thinking about riding a motorcycle... lol

[Sortarican]

......Now I have wood

That ain't wood! That's a toothpick!

Attachment 5292

[Bassil Duwaik]

the street is too costly for me. Seems like it's cheaper to fly down the track then it is to pick up a few traffic tickets. Even if I wreck at the track chances are that with so many experienced riders on the field I can get some constructive criticism. Not like wrecking on the street where all the witness have to say is "omg are you okay...you sob you were flying"

[pilot]

Very interesting posts and pretty much staying on track with the thoughts. It would be nice to hear from some more riders on this, too. Cruisers, some more racers (thanks DB for the input), how about the ladies and those who just ride to work each day?

As for me, I'd have to invest in a touring suit if I were to commute. It just is so much easier to hop in the truck, buckle up and drive away. I use to get the grief riding into work with all my gear on. I felt safe, but out of place.

The massive amount of time I have spent with MC training and speaking with and to many folks has also led to a change in my lifestyle. I now ride faster and what some would call harder, but with more finesse. Funny though, I now smoke and drink less, but with more expensive liquor. Go figure.

[Crashdaddy]

As for me, I'd have to invest in a touring suit if I were to commute. It just is so much easier to hop in the truck, buckle up and drive away. I use to get the grief riding into work with all my gear on. I felt safe, but out of place.

Sorry Pilot, I got confused when you started talking about having a job.

How long ago was that?

Sorry, could not resist.

[dillinger09]

i feel as though all my track riding has made me a better/safer rider on the streets. when i hit the twisties now, all i see are guardrails, gravel, oncoming traffic, etc. i will still go make a canyon run, but i do so with more control and a better knowledge of myself and my bike and i owe this all to my time spent on the track and the racing school i took back in Va.

i commute (10 mi. roundtrip) on my bike everyday.......through the streets of denver. this is after a year stint of no street riding whatsoever. i love riding way too much to restrict myself to track only again.

[salsashark]

Gonna have to agree w/ Dana on this one... It's a scientific fact that life kills 100% of its participants.

Hedge your bets and do what you want. I don't ride track because I don't find it fun to go around in circles. I ride to see new and different areas. Sitting on I-25 w/ a bike in the back of the truck doesn't sound like fun to me. On that same note, I completely understand the safety element of riding track. It's a simple matter of eliminating variables. However, I think we have all witnessed what can happen on a track (whether in first person or by proxy) and that alone proves that no one is immortal.

As for the buying a bike that is way over powered for the street or the rider... ummm well I have no comment on that, but I believe that people should not be told what they can and can not ride. Remember this long forgotten notion of personal responsibility and accountability? I could just as easily kill myself on a SV650 as I could on my ZX-14. Engine displacement does not equal a death certificate.

These threads contrasting the two are totally over rated. Ride what you want, where you want, when you want. Two wheels is just that... enjoy them. Whether your dragging a knee around turn seven or throwing saddle bags on for a multi-day ride, just go out and ride.

[rforsythe]

Remember this long forgotten notion of personal responsibility and accountability? I could just as easily kill myself on a SV650 as I could on my ZX-14. Engine displacement does not equal a death certificate.

I agree with what you're saying, but there's also the point to be made that inexperienced riders are perhaps more impressionable to suggestion on what they can and can't handle, because they listen to anyone with an opinion on it rather than experience they don't yet have. There should also be some accountability for those who convince a new rider that they can control a bike with so much higher performance just as well as a smaller one. Experience trumps balls any day.

just go out and ride.

Amen to that!

[pilot]

Sorry Pilot, I got confused when you started talking about having a job.

How long ago was that?

Sorry, could not resist.

Oh, that hurt.

[Bueller]

I ride track, I ride streets, can't imagine not riding street, I just don't ride with many people (less after every attempt ).

[rforsythe]

I ride track, I ride streets, can't imagine not riding street, I just don't ride with many people (less after every attempt ).

Yep. Had an interesting conversation with Rybo on the way back from Nebraska this weekend about this, and how the stupidity we see in group rides makes us want to limit whether we ride in groups at all. We both came to the conclusion that noob rides are about as far as we want to go into those, beyond that just riding with people that we know have a history of not being stupid. We also equated it to shooting guns with/around other people, and there are some on this board I will never do that with again either.

I suppose it may seem bad that as one of the people who run this club, I don't even want to go on our group rides anymore unless it's a mellow noob ride where we set a limit on what people do. It's also something I (and some others) have felt is necessary because of what happens with some riders in groups. On the other hand, it also kind of speaks to the changes that maybe need to happen in group rides when some of the longest-time members of CSC won't touch them out of mortal fear.

[pilot]

Danged if it raining again, ha. (inside joke)

[Redflash3]

Basicly it's all a risk that each rider takes when he or she pulls out of the garage or takes it to the track. But honestly who consistantly thinks about the risk each moment their riding. Everything in life is a risk on some level and we all know that but who wants to allow it to take control of oneself. I also enjoy playing basketball and I've gotten several injuries and ackes from past and present some serious ones. But I keep playing because I enjoy it too much for several reasons. My wife sometimes says I should stop playing but injury and sports go hand in hand. Some might say that motorcycle riding is 10x worst and their probably right but what is the risk compared to the true enjoyment riding brings. That's what each of us must ask ourselves. Yes, there are deaths, injuries and accidents that we all hear about and it may even frighten you sometimes or put doubt in your mind about riding. But it's your choice if you allow those "fears" and "what if's" influence your decision to continue to get back on that bike. I've been riding for 4 years and should have started a long time ago but fear prevented me from doing so. I decided to put my fears away and at least try it and I love it to this day. I totalled my first bike and injuried myself and seriously doubted my riding desire after that. But it came down to the enjoyment riding gave me and how much I appreciated the comradeship that I see by riders. My hope is that each year the population of 2 wheel riders continue to increase. To bring awareness to the country that riding is as natural and as common as 4 wheels. That laws will be passed to protect those who utilize alternative moods of transportation. And that those who ignore the inevitable are held responsible (cell phone users while driving for example). Like most things in our society NUMBERS influences change.

I think is good to see new young riders.....we were all new young and old rides at one point in our riding careers....lets not forget that. The new riders just need mentors to teach them how to ride and how not to ride. Which is the major appeal and strong point of the CSC club.

[Nick_Ninja]

I'll see you on the road with the same guys I have been riding with for 30 years. I'll continue to ride untill pigs fly.