Sad to see, but that is reality

[Devaclis]

Was this entire thread just an ad? Mn I need to get in on the action!

[tarded400]

My wife gets scared every time go out. She thinks the next time I wreck I'm going to die. She says that she has accepted the fact, but I hate it every time she says it. I have wrecked a decent number of times, and the past 2 times have been pretty bad- the first when a car pulled out from a stop sign and I t-boned her, and then the last time while in the canyons and I broke my ankle. People have commented that anybody in their right mind would quit what was causing all of this, but I don't think I can give it up. I didn't ride for 2 days, and then the third day when I got on jst to commute in a straight line, it was like equilibrium was re-established. It was awesome. I commute 15 miles one way to school every day, and the other alternative to my 60 mpg bike is my 15 mpg car.

[Bueller]

$650.00 + $250.00 ....wow

[Nick_Ninja]

Was this entire thread just an ad? Mn I need to get in on the action!

Yes ----- but you don't have wheels

[Jayock]

I guess for me it is kind of two-fold. I got the new 1000 to keep as a fun street bike and convert for an open supersport race bike next year. Well, the bug hit me to get it out and ended up getting it race ready this year. Now I have no street bikes and two race bikes. It is still stock enough that converting it back is a mere 1-2 hours away, but then I have to do it again before the next race, so I usually just end up driving. It will be back after the race season is over.

Also, I find that after progressing as a rider, I cannot (legally or safely) have as much fun on the street as I do at the track. And racing is a whole different level than track riding (more fun still). Until I have my millions, I just wont be able to keep a street bike without thinking "this could be a great modern vintage, heavyweight, lightweight etc bike." When I have enough money, Ill definitely have multiple race bikes and a street bike.

I also bring my puppy with me just about everywhere I go, and this is much easier in the truck than on a bike

I do miss riding though, even during the short breaks between races.

[DucWise]

Interesting topic... I'd like to share a different (but similar?) perspective. When I started riding street bikes, along with most of my friends at the time, there were no Riding Courses that we knew of. I learned to ride by... riding. A lot. I made a lot of stupid mistakes/decisions and usually paid for them the hard way... but I kept "getting back on" so to speak. When I finally realized the limitations of the street I turned to the track. But I always kept riding on the street... it just became two completely different types of riding. But I still enjoyed both.

When I recently moved back to CO I had a brand new realization about newer riders these days: They had ALL taken some sort of Safety Riding Course prior to getting their license! This was a complete shock to me since I had never taken one nor had I ever known anyone who had taken one (most just rode without a MC license for years and years ). But, literally everyone I have met in CO thus far that has an MC endorsement has taken one of these courses. I think that is 1) Amazing and 2) Superb! I'm sure all of these new riders are learning things that took me years of learning... many time the hard way. Hell, they may even be learning stuff that I don't know after all these years in the saddle.

I guess my point is that it sure looks like new riders are getting off on the right foot these days. They have information and people to show them the way that was once only for the "daring" way back when. If the gap is widening between the experts and the newbies... it's just part of the natural order of things. The gap will shrink over time... then widen again. Whether you ride street, track, dirt, or some combination the thing to remember is just keep riding. After all, fear is the mindkiller


--- Jack

[lovinCO]

...literally everyone I have met in CO thus far that has an MC endorsement has taken one of these courses. I think that is 1) Amazing and 2) Superb! I'm sure all of these new riders are learning things that took me years of learning...

Positive comments. I never thought about it, but it DOES seem like more new people I meet have taken safety courses/schools. Too bad you didn't get to say this on that Alice radio show, it's a nice perspective on sportbikes.

[Spongebutt]

I ride the street because it's fun, and easier to park than the F-250 (why don't Ford Trucks turn? Because they can't). I totally get the soccer mom on the cell phone, heck, on the way to my girlfriend's house today, I got cut off by a very hot one, oh well, at least she missed. Riding with friends is simply too fun not to do.

Racing on the track is huge fun, and also makes it much less difficult to "break the wrist" going from one place to the other. If you can, do both!

Primarily, if you don't enjoy it, don't do it. If you enjoy it, do it.

Cheers

[denverbusa]

When I got my first bike it was a VFR 1000 Interceptor. It was a lot of bike for a street noob and I got it to cut down my commute from Huntington Beach to Hollywood. A 3 hr commute in the Jeep down to 1.5 hours by lane splitting. I rode everywhere out there and would go on long trips but I never did get into the whole speed or hardcore canyon riding. I bought that bike because it looked cool and I just got tons of experience without really putting myself in danger, at least anymore than the minimum required to get that kind of experience at the time. Sold the bike and the jeep and the 65 conv. mustang to settle down, buy a home and have a family. It is what was right for me at the time. 15 years later I got back into sportbikes and have never had so much fun. I was one of the noobs again but did my time and learned from a group of experienced riders here on the board that have moved away from the road or at least public rides. While I am not giving up on the street because the track just doesn't come often enough I do enjoy getting out with a group and going for a ride. I will not be joining in on any of the scheduled rides when numerous people show up that I have not ridden with before. Too often I have seen them show up for their first ride and try to show off and it just isnt pretty. I am not just talking about wrecks here. Stupid turns in front of cars, poor decisions when passing etc... I try to lead by example, but I now limit my group rides to smaller groups.
Today was a great example, 7 of us left, and only one rider that I had not ridden with before. We all took turns leading and everyone was riding within their experience level. There was no testosterone passing. When some riders were behind me I waved them by and let them lead, when they were going faster than I wanted to go I didn't have to keep up I just rode my speed and we all had a great day. No DRAMA. If I don't feel comfortable with the group I will either bail or ride sweeper.

I will continue to ride on the street but I no longer commute and do not even like driving across town to a friends house because of the variables.

So here is to the next good ride. May it always be the next ride.

[Nick_Ninja]

I'm a FOG and proud of it. I'm riding tomorrow and NOT inviting anyone else along. I'm selfish, conceded, and a general pain-in-the-ass to ride with. There --- that should have covered all the bases that seem to be of concern to the topic.

[crunch]

I might get flamed for this, but I think too many people buy bikes that are way over thier abilities and don't have the sense to ride within thier abilities. I am all about people having freedoms to buy whatever they want, but someone who has never ridden before and 18 years old can go out and buy a GSXR1000 because his dad has money. It is that person you will read about, not the guy who has been riding for 5 years and is still not sure if he needs more than his SV650 because he still has so much fun on it.

I love sport bikes, but I am gonna sell mine for a bike that I think will be more fun and for a change in riding styles. Having road raced in the past, I know how much fun it is, but I like riding too much to hold myself captive to the racetrack.

[Nick_Ninja]

I agree. I was told by characters years ago that I needed to put 25,000 miles on my XL500S prior to buying the Honda CBX. They were right. But I got away with 18,000 before I jumped into the horsepower pond.

BTW ---- Your sig line is hilarious

I'm drowning in the estrogen ocean.
Thank god for toys.

[FastFrenchy]

As far as new riders, I think that they should start on what ever feels comfortable as long as they have the proper training. Back in Europe you have to spend lots of time and money to get your DL. When you finally get your DL if you are under the age of 21 you have to ride something that has no more than 34 hp. Once you have been insured for one year, you are free to ride as pleased. I think that it is a good system, and limits the 18 year old retards buying 1000 cc's and getting into accidents within 48 hours of purchase.

Otherwise I personaly could not do without riding canyons or track I see myself riding a sport bike until 85 years of age. I thrive to improve my riding skills and can't wait to get back at Pueblo!

[Crashdaddy]

As for me, I'd have to invest in a touring suit if I were to commute. It just is so much easier to hop in the truck, buckle up and drive away. I use to get the grief riding into work with all my gear on. I felt safe, but out of place.

Sorry Pilot, I got confused when you started talking about having a job.

How long ago was that?

Sorry, could not resist.

[dillinger09]

i feel as though all my track riding has made me a better/safer rider on the streets. when i hit the twisties now, all i see are guardrails, gravel, oncoming traffic, etc. i will still go make a canyon run, but i do so with more control and a better knowledge of myself and my bike and i owe this all to my time spent on the track and the racing school i took back in Va.

i commute (10 mi. roundtrip) on my bike everyday.......through the streets of denver. this is after a year stint of no street riding whatsoever. i love riding way too much to restrict myself to track only again.

[salsashark]

Gonna have to agree w/ Dana on this one... It's a scientific fact that life kills 100% of its participants.

Hedge your bets and do what you want. I don't ride track because I don't find it fun to go around in circles. I ride to see new and different areas. Sitting on I-25 w/ a bike in the back of the truck doesn't sound like fun to me. On that same note, I completely understand the safety element of riding track. It's a simple matter of eliminating variables. However, I think we have all witnessed what can happen on a track (whether in first person or by proxy) and that alone proves that no one is immortal.

As for the buying a bike that is way over powered for the street or the rider... ummm well I have no comment on that, but I believe that people should not be told what they can and can not ride. Remember this long forgotten notion of personal responsibility and accountability? I could just as easily kill myself on a SV650 as I could on my ZX-14. Engine displacement does not equal a death certificate.

These threads contrasting the two are totally over rated. Ride what you want, where you want, when you want. Two wheels is just that... enjoy them. Whether your dragging a knee around turn seven or throwing saddle bags on for a multi-day ride, just go out and ride.

[voncon]

I can't resist - When I started racing back in the 80's our Hurricane 600's were at 75-80 hp and we had production classes, supersport classes and Superbike. Novices could not race any larger than a 750. If you wanted a race-bred machine like an RS250 or TZ... you had to apply and submit a race resume.

Now we have 18 year old new riders waltzing in to the dealer and financing a new 160 HP R1 or GSXR for their first bike! 600's now are making more power than than the 1000's of my prime. I'm a huge fan of the sport and it saddens me to see the industry implode itself. Inevitably over time - legislation / insurance / and other factors are going to drive the sport down if we don't begin to police oursleves.

Either the manufacturer has to offer a free performance riding class with purchase or the gov't will have to limit hp and cc's based on documented experience.

I wrote an article on this subject when the FI R1's came out and it wasn't very popular.

[salsashark]

Inevitably over time - legislation / insurance / and other factors are going to drive the sport down if we don't begin to police oursleves.

There's that whole "personal responsibility" thing again...

[Xtremjeepn]

Reality or not, it is my perception, and perhaps yours, that more and more experienced riders are "hanging up the helmet" aka, selling the bike and gear, cutting back on social rides, sticking only to the track, etc. And, more and more inexperienced riders are joining us on the roads. It appears that the gap is widening.

...........Your thoughts?

~P

I have put a bit more thought into this and here is another take.


I think "mid-level" riders are "hanging up the helmet" as you put it.


The "real" experienced riders are still riding on the streets. They just choose their battles(rides) better now. They may do any one of the following.

-Avoid group rides with random groups.
-Stick to riding only with guys they know and trust
-Commute, ride alone, enjoy weekend rides with friends and family.

Basicly what I'm saying is that they just don't get caught up in the noob group/social part of it and that is why you see very few of them. They ride on their own terms. They are all still out there, just not as visable as those guys jumping in the group rides, going to the track etc.


I can see that whole "rider life cycle" in my own riding. Noob.....group rides.....select trusted groups.....track only......bored.....cruiser.....old friends only.......new sport bike(LOVING my commute)...etc etc

[rforsythe]

Remember this long forgotten notion of personal responsibility and accountability? I could just as easily kill myself on a SV650 as I could on my ZX-14. Engine displacement does not equal a death certificate.

I agree with what you're saying, but there's also the point to be made that inexperienced riders are perhaps more impressionable to suggestion on what they can and can't handle, because they listen to anyone with an opinion on it rather than experience they don't yet have. There should also be some accountability for those who convince a new rider that they can control a bike with so much higher performance just as well as a smaller one. Experience trumps balls any day.

just go out and ride.

Amen to that!

[pilot]

Sorry Pilot, I got confused when you started talking about having a job.

How long ago was that?

Sorry, could not resist.

Oh, that hurt.

[rforsythe]

I ride track, I ride streets, can't imagine not riding street, I just don't ride with many people (less after every attempt ).

Yep. Had an interesting conversation with Rybo on the way back from Nebraska this weekend about this, and how the stupidity we see in group rides makes us want to limit whether we ride in groups at all. We both came to the conclusion that noob rides are about as far as we want to go into those, beyond that just riding with people that we know have a history of not being stupid. We also equated it to shooting guns with/around other people, and there are some on this board I will never do that with again either.

I suppose it may seem bad that as one of the people who run this club, I don't even want to go on our group rides anymore unless it's a mellow noob ride where we set a limit on what people do. It's also something I (and some others) have felt is necessary because of what happens with some riders in groups. On the other hand, it also kind of speaks to the changes that maybe need to happen in group rides when some of the longest-time members of CSC won't touch them out of mortal fear.

[Devaclis]

^^ I like the idea of riding with buddies I know how to ride with. It is more comfortable. No surprises. I like the shooting analogy too.

[Sully]

This entire topic irritates me.

Don't switch to track only riding because you are afraid of riding on the street. Do it because you love the track.

This board does a great job of reinforcing the need to ride safely. It also goes too far. It scares people out of riding. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO DIE ON YOUR BIKE. Get out and fucking ride for christ's sake. I have not been on a bike since Monday and I am going nuts!! I'd give just about anything to ride right now. I pretty much live to ride. It was a dream of mine for over 30 years.

People die in the shower, in their cars, giving birth to babies, playing basketball. Maybe we can all sit at home and knit protective helmets for our kids with REALLY dull knitting needles and sit slightly warm tea while petting our declawed, neutered, rabies vaccinated cats.

I'm afraid of Devaclis and his BIG YELLOW Honduuh... have you seen him wheelie that thing ? ...

As much as I love riding the track and gaining amazing knowledge, I will still love riding on the street... and will continue to do so