Tires

[dm_gsxr]

Ok, with the last set of tires (Pirelli's) that were well worn last year, I was able to get around the track at IMI pretty quickly and even got my knee down the first time around the track. I replaced them with Metzler Z3's (the Sportec ones) a couple of months ago mainly because I like the Z6's for the 'busa.

At IMI Saturday, I was really stepping the rear out. Probably 5 times the rear slid a little and on the last curve, it stuttered (got my knee down and my lower leg down). Even Marney, who was watching Tom, saw the stutter and commented.

With the Pirelli's, I got my knee down easily and went from edge to edge on the tires. And while I don't _try_ to get my knee down, because of the slides, I didn't feel as confident to push it.

Conditions wise, it wasn't real hot although there was a good wind blowing.

Are the Pirelli's that much better or was I just luckier because I got the Pirelli's already broken in?

Obviously I'll be sticking with the Z3's, at least for the life of the tire but, at least with this one time experience with the Metzler's, I'm leaning towards getting the Pirelli's next time.

Carl

[rybo]

Carl,

If the metzeler and the pirelli are in the same model class (ie. sport street tire) then they are probably exactly the same tire with a different name on the side and a different tread pattern. Pirelli / Metzeler are the same company.

Now if you went from a DOT race tire to a street tire, then they are a completely different tire and the issue is probably set up more than the grip the tire offers. Conditions, tire pressure etc all play a part in this equation too...The M3 is a great tire and should be well suited to use at IMI, so I would start looking to the set up as the culprit.

Another option, you're getting better and going faster, so new problems are starting to arise because you're in a different part of the performace envelope. Just a thought.

s

[2Blue]

Just my 2 cents. I can't comment on Pirelli's, but +1 for Michelin Pilot Power 2ct's street tires. I've been running them during the past 2 races and they stick and give great feedback! My best time at Hastings this past weekend was 1:42 with them. I planned on running the pilot race tires but put on the 2ct's for the expected rain, which we never got. Go Michelin!!!!

[dm_gsxr]

Carl,

If the metzeler and the pirelli are in the same model class (ie. sport street tire) then they are probably exactly the same tire with a different name on the side and a different tread pattern. Pirelli / Metzeler are the same company.

Ok, that's what Mike said up at Epic so that's good confirmation.

Now if you went from a DOT race tire to a street tire, then they are a completely different tire and the issue is probably set up more than the grip the tire offers. Conditions, tire pressure etc all play a part in this equation too...The M3 is a great tire and should be well suited to use at IMI, so I would start looking to the set up as the culprit.

I don't have it any more, but the tire did have a tread pattern. Aren't race tires slicks? Otherwise I'd have to ask to make sure.

Another option, you're getting better and going faster, so new problems are starting to arise because you're in a different part of the performace envelope. Just a thought.

s

Heh, I'd like to believe that of course. I'll be going out as the summer wears on so maybe I'll see improvement.

Carl

[rybo]

Hey Carl,

Not all race tires are slicks. There are DOT race tires that have to be used in supersport classes. They have exactly the minimum amount of tread cut into them to be road legal, but have race tire construction, which generally means VERY different rubber compounds and carcass shape than most street tires.

Generally speaking DOT race tires have more in common with slicks than they do with street tires, and as such switching to them (or away from them) on your bike may cause some of the issues you're talking about. Race tires tend to be a bit taller in the center than street tires and have a bit more of a triangular profile to the tread shape. This gives them a larger contact patch on edge, which is where racers spend most of their time. Street tires tend to have a very round profile so they transition smoothly from side to side and give a very consistent contact patch size.

Hope that helps

s

[dm_gsxr]

Hey Carl,

Not all race tires are slicks. There are DOT race tires that have to be used in supersport classes. They have exactly the minimum amount of tread cut into them to be road legal, but have race tire construction, which generally means VERY different rubber compounds and carcass shape than most street tires.

Generally speaking DOT race tires have more in common with slicks than they do with street tires, and as such switching to them (or away from them) on your bike may cause some of the issues you're talking about. Race tires tend to be a bit taller in the center than street tires and have a bit more of a triangular profile to the tread shape. This gives them a larger contact patch on edge, which is where racers spend most of their time. Street tires tend to have a very round profile so they transition smoothly from side to side and give a very consistent contact patch size.

Hope that helps

s

Yep, sure does. Sounds like they were probably DOT race tires then. They certainly were higher in the center. I just figured he'd just tore the sides up and didn't ride any straight lines

Thanks.

Carl

[D Berns R6]

Michelin DOT race tires have that triangle shape to serve as a greater contact patch plus you can flick the bike right over onto it. Bridgestones however are round so its takes more effort to flick it over but as you increase your turn radius, you have the same amount of contact patch that you wouldn't on a michelin. So really it's up to the rider and their preference. I haven't ridden dunlop or pirelli so I am unaware of their profiles.

Derek

[Dave]

If the metzeler and the pirelli are in the same model class (ie. sport street tire) then they are probably exactly the same tire with a different name on the side and a different tread pattern. Pirelli / Metzeler are the same company.

Good info.

[t_jolt]

While they are both the same company, they are different tires. According to to pirelli/ metzler, the pirelli is more sport directed. Where as the Z 3 are more for commuting.

I remember reading it from here, just dont remember if it was under the superstore tire review, or if it was under the usa- tire review

www.motorcycle-usa.com
www.motorcycle-superstore.com

Tyrel

[rybo]

T-Jolt

The M3 is Metzeler's full sport tire. The Z6 is the sport touring tire.

I'm not sure of the alignment with the Pirelli brand, but there are comparable tires in the Pirelli line for both of these tires.