how many watchlists are you on right now?Originally Posted by Webman
how many watchlists are you on right now?
You're an idiot. STFUhow many watchlists are you on right now?
2008 Honda CBR600RR - Graffiti
2002 Yamaha WR250F
Turnin postal isn't an option.
"Its all about the motorbikes, always has been and always will be.". ~~ Ewan McGregor 2007
"It's hard to play the blues when nuthin's really wrong."~~ ---- Joe Walsh 2012
I.B.A. # 14748 124@X - YRMV
a little sensitive I see. maybe it wasn't just a joke
Those stats were all from the CSP, correct? The CSP has no ticket quota, so any increase in citations is due to an increase in the actual violation of speeding, be it 5-9 over, 10-19 over, etc. I know several officer who have written a 5-9 over ticket instead of a 10-19 over ticket, especially if the violator has a good attitude.
Let's change up the scenario for a second. Try putting your video camera into ANYONE'S face and see what they do. I guarantee you most people will not like having a video camera "put in their face".put your video cam in the cops face and see if they still use that tool we give em called discretion.....or if they write you up by the book
FTW
Just to clarify, I am NOT in support of any city/county/state using the police as revenue generation, especially under the guise of "safety". Coffers are a little low? Don't hike the fines in an effort to fill them then tell the officers they MUST write X-number of citations. There are far more important things the police need to be concerned with.
Last edited by CaneZach; Tue Sep 28th, 2010 at 06:37 PM.
With all due respect - I just find it hard to believe that some cultural shift happened that changed driving habits to the point where double the number of people were speeding during the same time the following year.
That's the answer right there.
Dirk
Formerly MRA #211 - High Precision Racing
"A strict observance of the written laws is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self- preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to written law would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property, and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the end to the means."
--Thomas Jefferson
Maybe. Maybe not. Since those numbers were strictly CSP-related, a 547 citation increase translates to roughly a whopping ONE additional citation per Trooper during the time frame noted. Since it's also 547 citations across the entire State, it's not even a tremendous increase. If those numbers came from a municipality, or even just one CSP Troop, like Troop 2B in Colorado Springs, I would say something is out of the ordinary. But a single additional citation per Trooper throughout the State over the period of time mentioned? Not anything that would make you raise an eyebrows.
Obviously we won't come together on this. 1 more citation per trooper might not sound like a lot. But looking at the statistic of nearly 1/3rd more tickets for the same time period, I have to ask, "what changed?"
Other law enforcement agencies across the country have come right out and admitted to the media that ticketing is up to raise revenue.
One example: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,490629,00.html which supports your "one additional ticket" statement.
"We need to increase enforcement in areas that create revenue … write 'ONE TAG A DAY,'" Coye told officers in a memo obtained by the Boston Herald.
We can agree that policy is set at the voter's booth.
Last edited by TinkerinWstuff; Tue Sep 28th, 2010 at 10:27 PM. Reason: add image
I guess I'm still confused as to why people think that it's somehow an evil government campaign to have it's citizen's pay fines for breaking the law...
You break the law, you pay a fine. You don't like paying fines? Don't break the law.
I don't like it either, but I also understand that every time I speed I'm tempting fate. People need to grow up...
/rant
That right there doesn't make any sense at all.
"Its all about the motorbikes, always has been and always will be.". ~~ Ewan McGregor 2007
"It's hard to play the blues when nuthin's really wrong."~~ ---- Joe Walsh 2012
I.B.A. # 14748 124@X - YRMV
It's not a matter of being evil, it's a matter of how to best use the limited resources of government, in this case law enforcement, to serve the public interest. Some of us believe that having several city police cruisers sitting on I25 tagging people for going 5 mph over is much less important to public safety than having those officers patrolling neighborhoods and responding to calls for help from the public. Speaking for myself, I find it incredibly insulting when politicians make the opposite claim.
If it truly were about public safety, the penalty for speeding would be harsh application of points for violations. I guarantee you that speeding could be greatly reduced if that's what the politicians were really trying to do. But it isn't. They don't want speeding to stop. It's about generating revenue and I'd rather have law enforcement officers focusing on real crime rather than generating revenue. I'll bet that most LEOs would agree.
Dirk
Formerly MRA #211 - High Precision Racing
"A strict observance of the written laws is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self- preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to written law would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property, and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the end to the means."
--Thomas Jefferson
I think this has become a new topic.
Just an FYI: I haven't seen them setting up shop the past two mornings. I thought it might be a regular thing, turns out I was wrong. Just didn't want anyone to get nailed for tempting fate.
well said Dirk.
Not just public safety...
Property crime prevention too.
I would love to have more LEO presence in my neighborhood to reduce the rampant 'tagging', the illegal dumping & the stealing. Instead of setting up speed traps, how about a graffiti trap?
89 EX500 RIP
06 R6S RIP
03 R6
Numbers are just numbers. They don't mean anything by themselves.Obviously we won't come together on this. 1 more citation per trooper might not sound like a lot. But looking at the statistic of nearly 1/3rd more tickets for the same time period, I have to ask, "what changed?"
Other law enforcement agencies across the country have come right out and admitted to the media that ticketing is up to raise revenue.
One example: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,490629,00.html which supports your "one additional ticket" statement.
We can agree that policy is set at the voter's booth.
"What changed?" - try the total population of the state. To get something meaningful these numbers need to be divided by the total population of the state for the given year. I'd be willing to bet the percentage of tickets issued based on the population is almost the same year to year.
2005 Yamaha YZF-R6 (SOLD)
2013 Yamaha FZ6R
Stupidity should be painful.
How much would you like to bet or would you like to try again. When you are talking about numbers that large, "almost the same year to year" is quite a debatable figure.
Population change 2008-2009 was roughly 100,000.
http://www.google.com/publicdata?ds=...ado+population
That means tickets issued in 2008 were .5309% of population and increased to .5540% of population in 2009. Doesn't sound like a huge number. But I bet if you're one of the nearly 10% unemployed right now and ended up as part of the "crackdown", you're not happy.
Last edited by TinkerinWstuff; Wed Sep 29th, 2010 at 01:00 PM.
1998 VFR800 Interceptor - resurrected and custom tail http://vfrworld.com/forums/5th-gener...98-vfr800.html
1999 DR650SE
Replace the "population" number with the number of Registered Colorado Drivers to get a more relevant number
[SIGPIC][SIGPIC]
^^smart thinking
makes me curious
1998 VFR800 Interceptor - resurrected and custom tail http://vfrworld.com/forums/5th-gener...98-vfr800.html
1999 DR650SE
As always. Dirk for POTUS!
--------------------------------------------------
"...There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag. We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language...and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."
-Theodore Roosevelt 1907
--------------------------------------------------
Blu/Wht '01 Gixxer 1K, '91 KX500
--------------------------------------------------
Tokin' SortaTalian
(Pronounced: Kind-A-Dago)
I'd also be curious to see how many "first time" offenders got tickets versus repeat offenders. I'd say that a "first time" offender would be someone who hasn't had a moving violation in the past 3 or 5 years, whichever one it is that a ticket's points drop off of your license. It would be interesting to see how much more likely a "repeat" offender is to A. offend again and B. receive a ticket for being a repeat.
[SIGPIC][SIGPIC]
To add to this argument, draw the timeline out and assume that increasing fines drops moving violations to almost zero. Without this revenue piece in place, what would you say the odds of seeing an incredible tax hike would be? Does anyone think that there is even the remotest of chances that politicians would credit the police for their keeping the roads safe and then walk away from the now missing revenue without an attempt to recoup this loss in another manner?
[SIGPIC][SIGPIC]
Difficult to find current data. As of 2003, there were 2,975,337 registered drivers ( http://www.statemaster.com/graph/trn...s-total-number) when the population was 4,548,339 (same population source linked above).
So at that time, 65.4% of the population were registered drivers. Assuming the same=
% of tickets issued based on registered drivers in 2008 = .0812
% of tickets issued based on registered drivers in 2008 = .0847
In numbers that might be easier to relate to; I extrapolate that the number of drivers in the state probably increased by 55,781.
Registered drivers increased by about 2% while tickets issued based 2008-'09 increased by nearly 5%
calculations:
extrapolated drivers 2008 based on assumed 65.4% of population divided by the same for 2009 = .9830
Tickets issued 2008 divided by 2009 = .9420 (data from KDVR)
Last edited by TinkerinWstuff; Wed Sep 29th, 2010 at 01:26 PM. Reason: add bold to emphasize line
1998 VFR800 Interceptor - resurrected and custom tail http://vfrworld.com/forums/5th-gener...98-vfr800.html
1999 DR650SE
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
