MotoGP Round 3 (Spoiler!!)

[Sean]

Well...the first two laps and the last four laps were interesting. The rest was kind of boring. Usually there are such great battles at Estoril.

I was waiting for ten laps for Dani to put the move on Jorge. I like Jorge (as a rider), but I'm happy to see him take second. I just couldn't believe he got put in the dust after Dani made the pass. The Honda's this year! Although what the hell happened to Dovi?

And then Rossi had a strong showing in 4th the whole race (which is really good considering it's only race 3 on the Duc) only to get passed by the power of the Honda right before the finish line.

Bummer about Simoncelli, I thought he was going to run really hard after seeing the testing results.

[Graphite675]

Yeah, Pedrosa was just playing follow the leader the whole race. He knew he had a faster bike and could make his move at anytime, he just let Lorenzo do all the work and made his move in the last couple of laps. Made for a pretty boring race.

.

[FZRguy]

I kept wondering what happened to Spies?

http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...ril-debacle/P1

[Sean]

I kept wondering what happened to Spies?

http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...ril-debacle/P1

That helps explaine why he went wide in pretty much every corner. I just figured it was a newer track to him Because he crashed on the warm up lap last year) and he couldn't find the right animal to think of. Hell, even Loris was running wide regularly, and he's been there a hundred times.

[McVaaahhh]

That was a great race! The Honda's look like the bike to beat this year.

[Sean]

That was a great race! The Honda's look like the bike to beat this year.

Seriously! Four out of the top seven were Honda. Even the sat. teams are running really well. It would have been five out of eight if Marco hadn't crashed. I'd say it's just really good riders, but Hiroshi was seventh (not to say he's a bad rider, he just doesn't usually run towards the front). Honda's been eating it's Wheaties.

[drago52]

The hondas are fast. I don't think it's just the clutch. Dani could have blown by Lorenzo on almost any lap during that race. Very smart race ridden by Dani, but somewhat boring. I actually like watching Simoncelli ride because he is such a lunatic. I don't root for him, more like "uh oh, he's going for the pass.. (hold breath) ... " through most of every race. I'm disappointed in Spies' results this year. I really want him to put in a good result, but it seems like he's always got some excuse (seemingly legitimate) for flopping. I was happy Rossi got passed on that last lap.

[CaneZach]

The hondas are fast. I don't think it's just the clutch. Dani could have blown by Lorenzo on almost any lap during that race. Very smart race ridden by Dani, but somewhat boring. I actually like watching Simoncelli ride because he is such a lunatic. I don't root for him, more like "uh oh, he's going for the pass.. (hold breath) ... " through most of every race. I'm disappointed in Spies' results this year. I really want him to put in a good result, but it seems like he's always got some excuse (seemingly legitimate) for flopping. I was happy Rossi got passed on that last lap.

I like Simoncelli because he's crazy on the bike and he's a smartass to Jorgay Lorentho. I've liked him since he was on 250's, but I don't know what to think of his racing abilities. He's obviously talented, but he always seems to screw himself, like crashing out when he was in the lead and nobody was pressuring him a few weeks ago. He'll lay down a blazing fast lap time, then completely take himself out of the race. Earlier this year, I said Simoncelli could podium, but I didn't think he would ever be one of the "elite" racers who can challenge for the title because he always seems to mess up a good thing.

[Mother Goose]

Rossi calls MotoGP riders pussies.

http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011...est_round.html

Valentino Rossi was far more forthright in his opinions about the riders complaining about aggressive moves. Rossi conceded that in 250s, Simoncelli had made a few moves "at the limit", but in MotoGP, his moves had not been beyond the pail. The problem, Rossi avowed, lay elsewhere: "For me, the problem is that big part of MotoGP riders now are pussies," Rossi declared. "In the past, this is normal, the riders were more like real men. Now it is more like they are children."

[salsashark]

Rossi calls MotoGP riders pussies.

http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011...est_round.html

Valentino Rossi was far more forthright in his opinions about the riders complaining about aggressive moves. Rossi conceded that in 250s, Simoncelli had made a few moves "at the limit", but in MotoGP, his moves had not been beyond the pail. The problem, Rossi avowed, lay elsewhere: "For me, the problem is that big part of MotoGP riders now are pussies," Rossi declared. "In the past, this is normal, the riders were more like real men. Now it is more like they are children."

Same complaints when Toseland came in and made some aggressive moves. The whiners won out there and Toseland headed back to WSBK.

Stoner's searching for his excuse of the year... he almost retired himself from the race due to back pain... hmmmmmmm. I used to really like Stoner, but his whining and complaining is getting really tired.

[rybo]

The hondas are fast. I don't think it's just the clutch.

Some of the stuff I've read indicates that the clutch / gearbox system is worth a few hundreths of a second per shift, so let's say .03 s.

At HPR I shift the ducati 15 times per lap, so 15 x .03 = .45 seconds per lap.

For the average racer this is almost incosequential. Most of us have more than that in variation lap after lap anyways. If I get some clear track and can run a bunch of laps within a half second of each other, I'm VERY happy about it.

At the GP level it's a whole different thing. That 1/2 second per lap is a real eternity when you have a bunch of folks all running within 1% of each other.

Is it JUST the gearbox? No, Dani rode perhaps the best race I've ever seen him ride, waiting patiently for the right moment and seizing that moment with authority. Testing, but not straining at various points on the track. Not repeating mistakes from previous years. As much as he's not my favorite, he earned that win and did it like a champion.

This is the last year for the true prototypes, we'll probably never see a return to this level of machine again. Honda seems to have gotten most of the package right for 2012 with Yamaha capatalizing on the knowledge and experience they gained from Burgess and company in making the bike handle. Jorge was clearly more comfortable on the brakes than Dani was (or really any of the other hondas in the field).

What happens next?

s

[drago52]

Dani dropped Lorenzo like a bag of rocks. I think the honda clutch system helps the most in the corners to keep the bike planted. I watched a video from stoner's view of driving out of a corner while shifting at near full lean angle and it was incredible. Maybe they have more speed because they are exiting the corners faster, but they do certainly look faster down the straight.

On another note: I seriously wish they would remove the traction control and anti-wheelie control. There is too much of the machines doing the work that the riders used to do. It's amazing that any one of us can go buy a new ZX10R with traction control, drop it into a corner and give it full throttle without worrying about kicking it out. It doesn't take skill to do that.

[Sean]

What I didn't understand, is why Jorge didn't really fight back? He never really attacked Dani after the pass.

Rossi calls MotoGP riders pussies.

http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011...est_round.html

This might be going a little far, but he could be moving in the right direction. Then again, aren't almost all sports/competitions softer? At least to a point?

[rybo]

What I didn't understand, is why Jorge didn't really fight back? He never really attacked Dani after the pass.

Because he's a smart rider and knows the championship is currently his. Better to get second in the race and retain the championship than push too hard and crash, letting someone else gain an advantage.

Dani also did an excellent job of opening a gap almost immediately preventing Jorge from making an immediate counterattack. If that had been possible it may have been possible for Jorge to run a defensive line and use the Yamaha's superior stability on the brakes to keep Dani behind him on the last lap.

Like I said earlier, it was one of the best races I've ever seen Dani ride. The timing and execution of his attack were perfect. It was a bit like watching Dani do a Rossi from several years ago - Stalk, plan, execute. It

The Honda is probably the best bike on the grid this year. It appears that it's both incredibly fast and seems to handle well. Ducati has the equation wrong again, it looks like they're starting to sort out the handling, but now appear to be down on power. The Yamaha is still benefiting from the development work that Burgess and company did with it, and while it's no longer the fastest bike on the grid it still appears to be the most ridable at or near the limit.

So now the big question....

There are only two riders left in the Moto GP who competed on 500cc two strokes - Valentino and Loris. We all know that Loris's days of running at the front have come and gone, but what of Valentino? Is 2011 a development year for Ducati with the championship again being in play for them and Rossi in 2012 or has his day also passed?

[CaneZach]

So now the big question....

There are only two riders left in the Moto GP who competed on 500cc two strokes - Valentino and Loris. We all know that Loris's days of running at the front have come and gone, but what of Valentino? Is 2011 a development year for Ducati with the championship again being in play for them and Rossi in 2012 or has his day also passed?

I don't think Rossi's time has passed. Even with his bike still needing to be sorted out, he's riding it better than Nicky and he's still better than Spies is on Rossi's old bike. I'd venture to say Rossi can win the championship next year, assuming they get the bike worked out.

[Sean]

Because he's a smart rider and knows the championship is currently his. Better to get second in the race and retain the championship than push too hard and crash, letting someone else gain an advantage.

And I get that, but he didn't do anything about it. Smart, yes. Disappointing, yes. Rossi and Stoner would have easily fought it for a few laps. There was only four laps left. You could tell by his speed he gave up as soon as it happened. If you watch the first couple of laps, his elbows were dragging on the ground in every corner, but towards the end it wasn't even close. Maybe there were some other issues? tires, fatigue?

I read an interview with Burgess in some mag recently (it wasn't well written, I don't recommend it), but he was talking about how he and Rossi only had a few years left in racing. I got the impression that they'll be out in 2-3 years. Maybe they are prepping for next year so he can retire with one last championship on another manufacturer?