Great news. Thank you so much for all your hard work. I am still hoping I can make it up there on the 7th.
Great news. Thank you so much for all your hard work. I am still hoping I can make it up there on the 7th.
LAC hearing is at 3 PM Monday November 7th, 2011. Audit Committee Hearing Room – 1st Floor....any of you that can attend please do so. As I said in an earlier post...we cannot speak, but our presence will speak volumes!!
Terry
I'll try and make it down. Just depends on my work load.
Chadwick
MRA #825
"You live more for five minutes going fast on a bike like that, than other people do in all of their life." - Marco Simoncelli
Unless something unexpected comes up, I should be able to make it. I will cage it, but should I'll prob have my leathers with me anyways.
Would that be appropriate? Or no motorcycle gear? I mean, I don't wanna be confused with them Occupiers.
Last edited by Ninja2; Thu Nov 3rd, 2011 at 10:27 AM.
Now that I'm working downtown, I might be able to make this... especially considering it's a 5 minute walk!
Bob <------ Asshole Nazi devil moderator out to get each and every one of you
- 2002 Yamaha R1 (92K+ miles... bought new) ---------------------------------------->
- 2015 Yamaha Bolt C-Spec (Cafe Racer)
- 2004 Yamaha R6 (racebike)
- 2006 Yamaha R1 (racebike)R.I.P. 502 ~ Everything works out in the end. If it hasn't worked out, it isn't the end.
I do not agree with MOST. You should not be taxing people (fee) for a few. this is coming from me who I paid $20 in MI for the ERC and the wife paid $20 for the MSF because they heavily support the programs through taxes. It is wrong to support these programs through tax money. Collecting a fee is a form of tax.
I am a rider, and I don't support the fees, so saying all RIDER do is wrong. You making a decision on what fees I should pay is WRONG. That liberal thinking is getting old.
Rider training WILL not end....
I had similar questions and spoke with Terry. Maybe give her a call.
I look at it this way - and my apologies if there are any math errors in here: I took the basic MSF course (uhm, I actually took it twice). That probably saved me $70 for each course due to the MOST program. You pay an extra $4 for an initial registration and an additional $2 for each year’s renewal. So let’s say you’re sticking with the same bike, you're really only paying "taxes" after the 33rd year. Needless to say, if you take more MSF courses, the longer that period. So you really didn't pay for a few, but yourself, too.
Additionally, my personal belief still is that courses will be less or scaled back.
No, it is an involuntary fee/tax. What if I don't want to take the MSF or ERC, what if I did not even take it in this state? So I am taxed $2 a year to renewal my license for something I have never used or plan to use?
Is this just on MC licenses or does my neighbor pay the same fee with a normal non MC endorsed license? If that is the case, why should they pay for MC training?
MC only.
I have to pay school district taxes, and do not have kids. Would I like to use that money for motorcycle parts? Of course, but I also think it is important to have an educated youth. Same applies to motorcycling. I want to be able to take an MSF course with the same curriculum and length that is available today, not some DMV test. And I want others to have that option, too. In that regard, sure. You have a point. But then you need to decide how important it is to have this option available. Because the next option would be to take it to the track and learn how to ride there, and that option is a LOT more expensive than $4 or $2 renewal.
Last edited by Ninja2; Thu Nov 3rd, 2011 at 01:04 PM.
I am sorry that you feel you have no need or use for education applying to motorcycling. Yes the fees are only assessed to motorcyclists. We pay a ton of fees that the majority of us never use. Why do I have to pay more in medical insurance just because I am over age 50? Doesn't matter that I am healthy...I am paying for those that don't have insurance. Why should I pay school taxes? I have no children. There are a lot of questionable taxes and fees that we pay. When you say you don't approve of the fee....80% of ABATE's 1500 members agree to the fee. This issue was sent out to our membership for a vote...ABATE acts on what our members want us to do. In 1989 motorcyclists, Riders for Justice, ABATE, 1% club members and several unaffiliated riders agreed to assess this fee. Why? There was not enough viable training in the state....they wanted it to be affordable and accessible to perspective riders. I happen to agree that motorcyclists should watch out for each other...because no one else will. I'd rather have my fees going to improve something I enjoy than pay for someone else's medical bills. Personally, I am all for less taxes and less regulation...but chaos tends to erupt when there is no regulation what so ever.Originally Posted by modette99
No training will not end, but the prices will increase significantly in a poor economy, mobile training in remote areas will end, and there will be NO oversight or control of rider education in this state. It's a rosy picture painted that all training companies will "do the right thing" but it is not reality. Colorado will be the only state in this country's history to eliminate a viable safety program. When you have the MRF and AMA and the insurance industry supporting the continuation of this program...it must be a good program. By the way, the majority of states charge some kind of fee on motorcyclists to run their training program. I can get an exact number if you so desire. Not trying to change your mind...just my 2 cents for what it's worth....
Terry
Leather jacket...or t-shirt motorcycle related would be good. Most will probably be caging it as well.
Terry
will try to make it
I'm just not a fan of a lot of these "protect your riding groups", and never been a fan of Abate. Sorry 'ABATEStateCoord' I'm sure your a nice guy, just these groups are not my cup of tea.
I just don't see $70 in savings as being that significant, I mean you buy a $10K new motorcycle, so what if you spend another $300 in some training program??? It's like the people that buy the new $12K motorcycle but complain about gear cost.
If you want training to stay around and have better riders, why not mandate everyone coming into riding HAS to go to a course!!!! Do away with the DMV test altogether. There will be more programs, and competition and thus lower training cost.
Sorry I did not find the ERC beneficial when I took it. So I have never been a promoter of it. Wife already knew how to ride too, not sure MSF did much for her either.
Just my opinion, although I still tell new riders that never have touched a bike to do the MSF before even buying a bike...I just don't want them to spend thousands on a motorcycle and be one of those where it then sits int he garage for 5 years....LOL Riding is not for everyone.
In NJ, the MSF class was offered for free...this program is far from that, but at least there is something, and even though I will never take advantage of the savings, its only a few bucks that will go toward someone educating themselves and becoming a safer rider (hopefully), plus I spend more in a week on Monster
Please do not drink Monster before the committee hearing.
OK...I guess I can have RedBull instead
Just a note...I am female...no offense taken. I appreciate the fact that you refer new people to the program. Is the MSF course the best curriculum? I can't say I am a huge fan...however, it is what is offered nationwide to waive license testing. So for now, that is what we have to offer. For example, we teach the Evergreen Safety Council's Sidecar/Trike Education Program. We feel it is more beneficial than the MSF 3 wheel. I wasn't a fan of these protect your right to ride groups either until politics knocked on my door. $70 to me isn't a big deal either...but when you have an 18 year old that just purchased Uncle Joe's bike sitting in the shed...$70 is a big deal. I'd rather have something available with some regulation than something with NO regulation...complete chaos! A note on mandatory training....I fully agree to that...but there should be mandatory Driver training as well...don't discriminate against one faction of motor vehicles.
Last edited by THoward; Thu Nov 3rd, 2011 at 07:16 PM. Reason: Forgot a comment
Terry
Thanks Terry and to any who are able to make time in their day to show up and represent the rest of us who support this.
1998 VFR800 Interceptor - resurrected and custom tail http://vfrworld.com/forums/5th-gener...98-vfr800.html
1999 DR650SE
For those of you that plan on attending the hearing, it is not at the Capitol, but across the street (south side) from the Capitol in the Legislative Legal Services building I believe it is called. 200 East 14th Avenue, Denver, CO 80203-2211. 1st floor Audit Committee Hearing Room still at 3 PM.
Terry
+1
I think everyone can get behind improving ur skills but I am sick and tired of government fees, taxes, surcharges and involvement. Let me keep my money and I will decide how to spend it. For around $300 I can spend the day at HPR with Pridmore let alone practice going around cones in a parking lot. Just my 2 cents.
Its not how fast you go, its how little you slow down.
You're comparing apples and oranges in your argument. An MSF basic rider course is designed for new riders, some who have never ridden before, to learn the fundamentals and get their motorcycle endorsement. It is by no means a track school like Pridmore's Star School. Even the level II BRC and Advanced Rider Course are more street specific and can not be compared to a track school. And I am probably the biggest advocate you will find for street riders to enhance their skills at the track.
As far as government involvement goes, would you prefer no oversite over the entities that have the ability to license motorcyclists to ride on the street?
Website - http://www.leg.state.co.us/osa/coaud.../home?openform
Agenda - http://www.leg.state.co.us/osa/coaud...df?OpenElement
Map - http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=...ed=0CBoQ8gEwAA
Dang. I call that a service, Jim. LOL
No wonder legislators are not familiar with the MOST program. They have so much other stuff on their plates. Another reason to show up and show that we have a large motorcycle community in CO who cares.
The Audit Committee killed this bill yesterday afternoon. Thanks to those who came out to support the MOST program.
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