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Thread: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

  1. #25
    Senior Member Ted's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    "Stand your ground" is not whats protecting him. "Self defense" is. Its called the 2nd amendment and anytime, anywhere you feel your life is threatened you can use deadly force (and townie, no one has the right to fear for their life and run, then go back a kick someones ass. Treyvon had his chance to "fear for his life" when Zimmerman was chasing him, not after he got away and then went back).

    In cases like this apparently its up to a jury to decide if someone felt like their life was threatened. Really there wasnt enough to bring this to trial but doing so calmed the masses... Until he is proven innocent and then they will fire up again.

    The medical report being true is huge in this case because its the only leg the prosecution had to stand on.
    Lol.. You just summarily explained FL's "Stand Your Ground Statute" . I am also sure you are not implying that Self Defence and 2nd amendment mean the same thing. While the 2nd ammemdment gives one the right to bear arms, it is vague about 'self defence' which is why states such as FL and others have Castle Doctrine laws or some variation of it.

    One can also argue that the 2nd ammendment exist, and was intended to protect the pulbic from Government .

    I am not a lawyer but playing one on CSC never hurt anybody...

    Now i am gonna sit back and wait for CM's next thread ...about "Beauty pageant winner caught in ugly controversy" or "John Edwards Trial" or whatever story finds itself on Yahoo! News today .... lol

  2. #26
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    ZIMMERMAN

  3. #27
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted View Post
    Lol.. You just summarily explained FL's "Stand Your Ground Statute" . I am also sure you are not implying that Self Defence and 2nd amendment mean the same thing. While the 2nd ammemdment gives one the right to bear arms, it is vague about 'self defence' which is why states such as FL and others have Castle Doctrine laws or some variation of it.

    One can also argue that the 2nd ammendment exist, and was intended to protect the pulbic from Government .

    I am not a lawyer but playing one on CSC never hurt anybody...

    Now i am gonna sit back and wait for CM's next thread ...about "Beauty pageant winner caught in ugly controversy" or "John Edwards Trial" or whatever story finds itself on Yahoo! News today .... lol
    And you are not saying that our Government drafted an Amendment allowing people to bear guns and NOT use them. That would make no sense. Matter of fact if you look to the influence of where this particular Amendment comes from (The English Bill of Rights), you will find that the basis of it is pretty clear in this matter. "Regarded as a long-established natural right in English law, auxiliary to the natural and legally defensible rights to life."

    You have the right to protect your life. Bottom line. Floridas law was established because some of the states laws require you to retreat before using deadly force to protect yourself. Florida believed (and I agree) that you should NOT have to retreat before defending yourself (while it may be a good practice it surely shouldnt be a requirement).

    There was a video floating around on here a few months back and it drew the picture perfectly (there was one white guy getting mobbed by 6-7 black guys). In some states if you are surrounded by a group of people that are going to rob you, you are not allowed to defend yours until the group mobs you, making defense almost impossible in some situations. Florida believes that anyone, at the very moment they feel their life is at risk, can defend themselves. Meaning you could draw your gun, legally, once the group surrounded you.

  4. #28
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Yes but the problem at hand here seems that both parties could fal under the law stand your ground. This is why its going to be done away with.

    People abuse power and fuck up and the rest of us suffer for it.

    Here is a example.

    http://htpolitics.com/2012/04/30/sen...ur-ground-law/
    Last edited by #1Townie; Wed May 16th, 2012 at 02:03 PM.

  5. #29
    Senior Member TinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    If there were not 8 if the same thread, people might know if the same bullshit was being regurgitated over and over again.
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  6. #30
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Its always the same. But on another similar story.
    http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/new...mes-in-valrico

  7. #31
    Senior Member TinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Stand your ground laws do not give a guy free pass to go looking for a fight. When you carry deadly force, you have an obligation to avoid conflict, not instigate it by following people. It's that simple. He called the cops and fulfilled his obligation to society. He started a fight when he followed the kid around the neighborhood.

    I carry, believe in the 2a, and consider myself conservative. I just don't care a lot for koolaid.
    Last edited by TinkerinWstuff; Wed May 16th, 2012 at 02:16 PM.
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  8. #32
    Senior Member TinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Stand your ground law was only intended keep a jury from having to decide if a defendant did everything they could to flee before turning and using deadly force. How does a jury that wasn't present during a situation decide if a person was truely backed into a corner or not. The burdon of proof isn't on the defendant to show they did everything they could to flee when it's too easy to armchair QB such decisions later.

    There's nothing in it that says you are free to look for a fight. Zimmermans problem is he admitted he saw danger (calling the cops) and then proceeded into danger by following the guy. I don't see what stand your ground had to do with anything here.
    Last edited by TinkerinWstuff; Wed May 16th, 2012 at 02:33 PM.
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  9. #33
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerinWstuff View Post
    Stand your ground law was only intended keep a jury from having to decide if a defendant did everything they could to flee before turning and using deadly force. How does a jury that wasn't present during a situation decide if a person was truely backed into a corner or not.

    There's nothing in it that says you are free to look for a fight. Zimmermans problem is he admitted he saw danger (calling the cops) and then proceeded into danger by following the guy. I don't see what stand your ground had to do with anything here.
    Thats the point of the law... You DONT have to be backed into a corner to defend yourself there.

    If you want to insist that Zimmerman was "looking for a fight", all you are doing is not following the facts. He said he followed him because he was watching his neighborhood and the kid looked suspicious. Its not that hard to understand. Matter of fact its what most of us would have done. See someone suspicious, call the cops and follow them. Nothing wrong with that.

  10. #34
    Senior Member TinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Exactly my point, everything wrong with that.

    How about another Zimmerman thread tomorrow and we can do this again?
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  11. #35
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerinWstuff View Post
    Exactly my point, everything wrong with that.

    How about another Zimmerman thread tomorrow and we can do this again?
    So you are saying in every case that you should have to be backed into a corner before defending yourself?

    Or are you saying that him calling the cops and following him was wrong?
    Last edited by Ezzzzy1; Wed May 16th, 2012 at 02:46 PM.

  12. #36
    Senior Member TinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Did not say that nor do i believe that.

    Saying it again, I believe when you carry deadly force, you have an obligation to avoid conflict as opposed to instigating it.
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  13. #37
    Senior Member Dr. Joe Siphek's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by grim View Post
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    I surf all day long for Grim's funny posts...and this is one! Lock him up and throw away the key...he's a lady killer!
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  14. #38
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    What did you mean by this?

    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerinWstuff View Post
    Exactly my point, everything wrong with that.
    Everything wrong with what?

  15. #39
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Um no i dont follow suspicious people. I will step in when i see a crime. Not before. It never ends well. Both larties feel threatenedand things get out of line.

    And what facts mr z? The facts he didnt follow the neighborhood watch protocol? The fact a witness claims she heard zim start the fight? The fact that martin also didnt have to backed into a corner? The fact martin was committing no crime when he was engaged? How many facts do you yourself want to ignore?

    No one is bitching about him calling the cops. We bitch because he claims after he left the safety of his vehicle a unarmed person was killed by him. I dont know what hapened in that fight and neither do you, but can you really say a fight would have happened if zim would have followed neighborhood watch protocol?

    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...OvpYVNm-LJxA4Q

    And this is the straight up dude yiu guys want to defend our rights for.

    According to a records search on George, he was previously arrested for domestic violence, resisting an officer without violence and most shockingly, resisting an officer with violence — a felony charge that surely could have landed him in prison.

    http://rollingout.com/culture/george...losed-arrests/

    So yeah cm and z a grown ass man with a history of violence should be in court for the death of a unarmed person.

  16. #40
    Senior Member TinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    Thats the point of the law... You DONT have to be backed into a corner to defend yourself there.

    If you want to insist that Zimmerman was "looking for a fight", all you are doing is not following the facts. He said he followed him because he was watching his neighborhood and the kid looked suspicious. Its not that hard to understand. Matter of fact its what most of us would have done. See someone suspicious, call the cops and follow them. Nothing wrong with that.
    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerinWstuff View Post
    Exactly my point, everything wrong with that.

    How about another Zimmerman thread tomorrow and we can do this again?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    What did you mean by this?



    Everything wrong with what?
    The man saw danger. If danger would have attacked him right then and there, bam, dead, no question.

    Instead, danger kept walking away from Zimmerman. Zimmerman put himself in danger by following him. I don't give two shits about neighborhood watch. He watched and he called the cops and then he should have avoided conflict. Self defense laws protect your right to defend yourself. No obligation to defend your neighbor or their property. Nor does it give you the right to pick a fight.

    If he would have stood his ground instead of stalking the hoodlum's ground, he would have been fine.
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  17. #41
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerinWstuff View Post
    The man saw danger. If danger would have attacked him right then and there, bam, dead, no question.

    Instead, danger kept walking away from Zimmerman. Zimmerman put himself in danger by following him. I don't give two shits about neighborhood watch. He watched and he called the cops and then he should have avoided conflict. Self defense laws protect your right to defend yourself. No obligation to defend your neighbor or their property. Nor does it give you the right to pick a fight.

    If he would have stood his ground instead of stalking the hoodlum's ground, he would have been fine.
    You, like a lot of people, are missing a huge part to all this. Zimmerman followed Treyvon and lost sight of him. Zimmerman then headed back to his car and was jumped by Treyvon. Treyvon asked him if he wanted a piece of him and beat the shit out of Zimmerman. Zimmerman pulled out his gun, from his back, and shot Treyvon. There is no law that says you have to stay in your car, thats crazy! If you are looking for suspicious people and you see one you are supposed to stay in your car?

    Show me somewhere where it says Zimmerman "stalked" Treyvon....

    If your neighbor hood was stricken with theft and violence you would not do something about it? You wouldnt get tired of punk ass kids breaking into peoples houses? You wouldnt do anything about people robbing others? There was even a murder in that neighbor hood that year!

  18. #42
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Well z I guess you still haven't learned to read links.

  19. #43
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    "In no program that I have ever heard of does someone patrol with a gun in their pocket," Carmen Caldwell, the Executive Director of Citizens' Crime Watch of Miami-Dade, told theGrio. "Every city and municipality has their own policies. Here in Miami-Dade we train people only to be the eyes and ears of their communities. Not to follow and most definitely not to carry a weapon."

  20. #44
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by #1Townie View Post
    "In no program that I have ever heard of does someone patrol with a gun in their pocket," Carmen Caldwell, the Executive Director of Citizens' Crime Watch of Miami-Dade, told theGrio. "Every city and municipality has their own policies. Here in Miami-Dade we train people only to be the eyes and ears of their communities. Not to follow and most definitely not to carry a weapon."
    Townie, I can read. I can also interpret what I read. Because Carmen says he has never heard of something makes it wrong? No. Zimmerman was well within his rights to do what he did. You can follow WHOEVER THE FUCK YOU WANT.

    Carmen can suck it... If someone wants to follow a suspicious person, they can and if someone with a CCW wants to carry a gun, they can. You dont set the rules and neither does Carman.

    Zimmerman played by the rules that were set.

  21. #45
    Member Yearly Supporter Hoot's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Yeah you can, but it's just not smart. Like riding without gear here in CO, you can, but it's still dumb.

  22. #46
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoot View Post
    Yeah you can, but it's just not smart. Like riding without gear here in CO, you can, but it's still dumb.
    I see your point but carrying a gun for protection is not stupid. Pulling it out if you fear for your life is not stupid either.

    Honestly if you ask me? The only stupid thing that happened was Treyvon going back to fight Zimmerman.

  23. #47
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    You, like a lot of people, are missing a huge part to all this. Zimmerman followed Treyvon and lost sight of him. Zimmerman then headed back to his car and was jumped by Treyvon. Treyvon asked him if he wanted a piece of him and beat the shit out of Zimmerman. Zimmerman pulled out his gun, from his back, and shot Treyvon. There is no law that says you have to stay in your car, thats crazy! If you are looking for suspicious people and you see one you are supposed to stay in your car?

    Show me somewhere where it says Zimmerman "stalked" Treyvon....

    If your neighbor hood was stricken with theft and violence you would not do something about it? You wouldnt get tired of punk ass kids breaking into peoples houses? You wouldnt do anything about people robbing others? There was even a murder in that neighbor hood that year!
    I don't know why people have such a hard time getting this. SRSLY? Jesus... Again, the ONLY thing that matters is can the prosecution PROVE that Zim was NOT in fear for his life at the EXACT moment Martin was shot. From the evidence it looks like Zim was beaten and had EVERY right to defend himself. Nothing up to that point matters. Zim broke ZERO laws, Martin broke one by ASSAULTING him. Friggin' simple. Why is it simple minds can't grasp a simple concept????
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  24. #48
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    Re: If Zimmerman's medical report is true.....

    Why can't you understand we see it differently? You are flat out ignoring just as much as you claim we are. Zimmerman has a violent background. Deny that. Go ahead. A unarmed kid was killed. I even read a article when zimmermans brother did a interview that made it sound like the gun was out before the fight. If thats the case martin had every right to swing. in fact the moment zimmerman started to follow martin the stand your ground law kicked in for martin. He was scared and being followed. He had the right to defend himself from this strange man following him home.

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