Thoughts on Spies?

[kawasakirob]

With Spies not doing as well as he or the team has wanted, what's your stance on next season? Yamaha is already beginning to hint at something.... But what? With Stoner retiring there's going to be an open Repsol spot. With Crutchlow doing so well on the satellite, do you think Yamaha will bump him up to Spies spot? It has been awhile since Britain has had this capable of a rider( sorry Toseland). What do you think? Spies drops down to tech 3 again, Dovi steps up to factory(since he has already been on the Repsol) and Crutchlow steps to Repsol? Or what do you think? Your thoughts?

[kawasakirob]

What's the rule on rookies? 2 seasons on a Satellite before going factory?

[CaneZach]

I would love to see Rossi back on Repsol as a last hoorah before he hangs 'em up, but I think that bridge was burned. Crutchlow is riding his ass off, so I would love to see what he can do on a factory ride, even as the B rider.

[silkboxr]

Rossi to back to Honda Repsol, Spies goes back to Tech 3 or heads up WSBK effort for Yamaha, Crutchlow to Factory Yamaha, Hayden stay with Ducati, one of the young new riders moves up to Ducati.

[tecknojoe]

CAL CAL CAL. My god has he been strong this year. He deserves that spot. Although I'd love to see Rossi back on the horse for 2 more seasons.

Spies really just lacks character. He seems like ever since he got into GP, he's too stressed to really enjoy it

[r6rammy]

Spies to Honda, Cal to Factory yamaha, Rossi to satellite Yamaha next year....speculation ofcourse. Repsol may pay the pied piper and get Lorentho on their side in Honda. Leaving factory yamaha seats to Cal and Rossi, Spies to Tech trois and Dovi to stay put.

[silkboxr]

I can't see Spies getting a Honda ride when he can't ride the Factory M1 as good as he did the B-team Tech 3 bike. Rossi will be Honda's only hope of beating Lorenzo.

[CaneZach]

HRC's VP has said Rossi will never ride for Honda again, which is why I said that bridge had been burned. I imagine HRC can always change their collective minds since business is far more important than personal feelings, but the VP basically blacklisted Rossi a month our two ago.

[rybo]

Silly season starts earlier and earlier each year!

Valentino stands a chance of beating Ago's record for most championships - he only needs one more to tie it and two more to win it. I can't imagine that personal feelings will get in the way of any manufacturer wanting to be connected to that. Honda, Yamaha, anyone, despite past feelings.

Rossi is the only rider currently in the paddock who stands a chance at beating that record, so with almost EVERY rider in the class being up for contract at the end of 2012, I can imagine there is going to be some clamoring to get Rossi onto a competitive factory ride to challenge that record in 2013 and 2014.

I don't think that Valentino is "over the hill" - he is still fully capable of winning races and championships. Ducati has proven to be too small of a company to develop at the pace that Moto GP requires. It's possible that with the new influx of cash from the new owner that they could mount a serious and fast GP effort.

Ben Spies is as serious and as fast a rider as any out there and I fully expected that the move to the 1000CC configuration was going to benefit him. There is great disparity in weight and riding style between Ben and Jorge, which makes developing a new platform challenging. Yamaha has obviously decided to focus on their "A" rider in Jorge.

I honestly believe that Ben Spies will challenge for the world championship someday. His level of commitment to the sport is very high and I think he's one of the hardest working riders in the field. That entire field is extremely serious, however. Look Nicky Hayden - he consistently rides more laps in practice and testing than any other rider, sometime doubling their lap counts, looking for something more. It takes more than an increase in dedication to make that GP effort come together.

In the event the Moto GP moves towards the CRT formula, I think that would greatly benefit riders like Ben Spies who cut his racing teeth in production based machinery.

One more observation before I go, and that is that with the exception of Nicky Hayden, all of our Moto GP champions in the 2000's have come up through the GP ranks - 125's and 250's. So far no one out of the Moto 2 series has mounted a serious threat to the aliens and those who have come up through superbike have not either. Stephan Bradl may be the first to mount a serious threat out of Moto 2.

Since it's begun - here are my predictions:

Valentino will stay with Ducati - he and the new ownership will convince Jerry Burgess to stay on as well and they are going to dedicate resources never before seen to making that pair world champions once again. Valentino will eclipse the remaining Ago record that he has to overcome.

Jorge will stay with Yamaha - it's been a good relationship and they will both look to continue it

Casey Stoner will retire as predicted

Suzuki will make a re-appearance on the Moto GP scene and will look to re-acquire Bautista in the process. Alvaro clearly has the talent to make a bad bike work OK and isn't getting the support he wants / needs from Honda.

Yamaha will bring Cal onto the factory squad.

Ben Spies will get an offer from Honda

Bradl will get an offer from Honda

Dovi will get a factory ride with Yamaha on a 3rd bike


CRT will continue for another year, but ultimately the field will return to all prototype machines with a spec ECU. This will satisfy both Dorna's desire to reduce cost and the manufacturers desire to retain brand identity in the championship. This has been one of the major failings of Moto 2 in my opinion - no one roots for the Suter or the FTR- they want to root for a brand or a team that they recognize and can go see in their local dealership. That being said, Moto 2 has produced very close competition and is extremely interesting to watch. This is why the spec ECU will make an appearance in Moto GP.

-s

[FZjake719]

Spies is having a hell of a rough season this year, I dont know whats going on with him, but its definitely dissappointing as a fan. Im sure its dissappointing to his team and himself as well....we'll see.

I'm fairly certain things will shape up similar to this:

Dovi to Yamaha

Spies to Tech3

Cal to stay where he is

Rossi to stay where he is(as he said he plans to until he retires after the 2014 season)

I'd honestly hate to see Spies leave the factory ride, but if he doesnt get his shit together he will most likely lose the ride. You can tell Dovi is riding his ass off, and really pushing himself to pick up a factory ride, and honestly you cant deny the fact of the results he's been getting on the Tech3 bike all season. The guy is talented as hell, and while Cal is too, Dovi is pretty much starting to "show him up".

Rossi also said he plans to finish his career on the Ducati in the Speed.com interview. He said something along the lines of staying with Ducati to prove the bikes capabilities. And lets be honest, after his finish this weekend the capabilities are obviously there given the right conditions/setup.

Now, as far as who's taking the Repsol ride, thats all up for speculation Id dare say, allthough I think Bradl could have a shot at that once he gets more into the swing of things on the bigger bikes....

Either way, it was definitely nice seeing Rossi back at the front of the pack, and just the same Spies needs to get his shit together!!

[dirkterrell]

And lets be honest, after his ****** finish this weekend

Ok, how about a spoiler alert before announcing the past weekend's race results in a thread not obviously devoted to the weekend's results? Some of us haven't watched the race yet...

[CYCLE_MONKEY]

Silly season starts earlier and earlier each year!

Valentino stands a chance of beating Ago's record for most championships - he only needs one more to tie it and two more to win it.

Actually, that's way wrong. Sorry Scott. The Great Agostini has 15 total Championships, and since 8 of them were in the now defunct 500cc class while 2 of Rossi's champoinships came not in 500cc or MotoGP but in 125cc and 250cc, he has only 5 top class crowns, so he's still 3 behind the great Ago there, and 8 behind in total. I don't know that Rossi will ever amass as many championships (very unlikely), although with the much longer seasons now he may amass more wins. Plus, well, he was from the Olde School and actually raced at and won the Isle of Man against the likes of Hailwood and Reed, et. al..


Ago Stats:
Starts: 186
Wins: 122
Podiums: 159

Rossi Stats:
Starts: 262
Wins: 105
Podiums: 176


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giacomo_Agostini


On a side note, I think Ago is like Schumacher in F1, that noone will ever topple him.

[CYCLE_MONKEY]

I've been disappointed in Spies performance this year as well. But, I still believe in his talent, and think he'lll keep his seat, especially since he gets on well with Lorenzo. I think Honda will try for Rossi, and if not, probably draft Dovi back into Stoner's vacant position, especially since dovi eneded the season higher than Pedrosa.

[Slo]

I hope Honda does try for Rossi and he goes public with a big fat NO.

[kawasakirob]

What's the rule on rookies? 2 seasons on a Satellite before going factory?

Sorry I had to quote my own quote. Just found the answer. A ROOKIE is a rider who has competed in 9 or more premier races( regardless of # wildcard rides). The only exception is Suzuki, who will not be participating in satellite operations. The rule was to have taken affect at the beginning of the 2010 season....so that leads me to believe it is still in effect. I'm sure most of you knew about this already, but I needed clarification for myself.

This is a good discussion going on!

With the entry of Suzuki in 13' that will bump up prototype manufacturers to 4 which will be good to see. Any one know the # of Suzuki's to be funded? Also, do you think Repsol will keep the 2 bikes or bump it back up to 3 with the absence of Stoner? Part of Stoners reasons(amongst other things(don't want to start an argument)) was the introduction of CRT racing in a pure prototype class. Do you think other riders will possibly follow him if CRT starts to become more of something it already is?
With Spies, I personally do not see him riding for Yamaha in the near future. Maybe take up a Satellite position at Honda or Something, or joining a CRT class with Colin?

[The Black Knight]

Actually, that's way wrong. Sorry Scott. The Great Agostini has 15 total Championships, and since 8 of them were in the now defunct 500cc class while 2 of Rossi's champoinships came not in 500cc or MotoGP but in 125cc and 250cc, he has only 5 top class crowns, so he's still 3 behind the great Ago there, and 8 behind in total. I don't know that Rossi will ever amass as many championships (very unlikely), although with the much longer seasons now he may amass more wins. Plus, well, he was from the Olde School and actually raced at and won the Isle of Man against the likes of Hailwood and Reed, et. al..


Ago Stats:
Starts: 186
Wins: 122
Podiums: 159

Rossi Stats:
Starts: 262
Wins: 105
Podiums: 176


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giacomo_Agostini


On a side note, I think Ago is like Schumacher in F1, that noone will ever topple him.

Ummm, Rossi has 7 MotoGP(premier class) Championships and one 125cc crown and one 250cc crown.


Check this for reference:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...orld_Champions

it defines a MotoGP championship as 500cc or bigger. To which effect, Agostini has 8 Championships and Rossi has 7. He needs two to surpass Agostini.

In the grand scope of things, when you add everyone's combined championships(from 125cc to Open Class MotoGP) yes Agostini still has 15 championships and Rossi has 9. So he's five away from that title.

However, in the Premier Class, Rossi just needs two to surpass.

[CaneZach]

Ummm, Rossi has 7 MotoGP(premier class) Championships and one 125cc crown and one 250cc crown.


Check this for reference:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...orld_Champions

it defines a MotoGP championship as 500cc or bigger. To which effect, Agostini has 8 Championships and Rossi has 7. He needs two to surpass Agostini.

In the grand scope of things, when you add everyone's combined championships(from 125cc to Open Class MotoGP) yes Agostini still has 15 championships and Rossi has 9. So he's five away from that title.

However, in the Premier Class, Rossi just needs two to surpass.

Am I missing something or is your math off?

[rybo]

Ummm, Rossi has 7 MotoGP(premier class) Championships and one 125cc crown and one 250cc crown.


Check this for reference:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...orld_Champions

it defines a MotoGP championship as 500cc or bigger. To which effect, Agostini has 8 Championships and Rossi has 7. He needs two to surpass Agostini.

In the grand scope of things, when you add everyone's combined championships(from 125cc to Open Class MotoGP) yes Agostini still has 15 championships and Rossi has 9. So he's five away from that title.

However, in the Premier Class, Rossi just needs two to surpass.

Yeah Frank - what he said!

Am I missing something or is your math off?

yeah, and him too.

[FZjake719]

Ok, how about a spoiler alert before announcing the past weekend's race results in a thread not obviously devoted to the weekend's results? Some of us haven't watched the race yet...

Apologies, sir. Didnt even cross my mind... Ill edit my post.

[CYCLE_MONKEY]

Ummm, Rossi has 7 MotoGP(premier class) Championships and one 125cc crown and one 250cc crown.


Check this for reference:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...orld_Champions

it defines a MotoGP championship as 500cc or bigger. To which effect, Agostini has 8 Championships and Rossi has 7. He needs two to surpass Agostini.

In the grand scope of things, when you add everyone's combined championships(from 125cc to Open Class MotoGP) yes Agostini still has 15 championships and Rossi has 9. So he's five away from that title.

However, in the Premier Class, Rossi just needs two to surpass.

Oops! Yeah, bad math. But, he's still nowhere near Ago's total. And, funny, Mv STILL has the most constructor championships. Now THAT'S a name I'd love to see back in MotoGP with a serious effort.

[kawasakirob]

This is great

[The Black Knight]

Am I missing something or is your math off?

Math off and typo. Did it from my phone.

[dirkterrell]

Apologies, sir. Didnt even cross my mind... Ill edit my post.

Thank you.

[kawasakirob]

CAL CAL CAL. My god has he been strong this year. He deserves that spot. Although I'd love to see Rossi back on the horse for 2 more seasons.

Spies really just lacks character. He seems like ever since he got into GP, he's too stressed to really enjoy it

CAL has been strong this year, and is putting everything he has into it. I think your right that he deserves that spot. It sucks to see Ben riding like this, and I also agree with you that he seems to be stressed in finding a way to handle his situation. He definetely has the talent. Unfortunately I believe he will be demoted shortly after this season. I just dont see him getting the Repsol Spot, or staying in the same spot that he is in.

r6rammy
Spies to Honda, Cal to Factory yamaha, Rossi to satellite Yamaha next year....speculation ofcourse. Repsol may pay the pied piper and get Lorentho on their side in Honda. Leaving factory yamaha seats to Cal and Rossi, Spies to Tech trois and Dovi to stay put.

BOOM! Lorenzo to Honda! I never thought of that, but I think its possible. Good point. That would be a killer combination. And hey why not? That would be Lorenzo and Pedrosa on the Honda, Then leave Dovi and CAL on the factory Yamaha's? crazy, but i think its possible, wow, that would be something to see.

rybo Re: Thoughts on Spies?


Silly season starts earlier and earlier each year!


I don't think that Valentino is "over the hill" - he is still fully capable of winning races and championships. Ducati has proven to be too small of a company to develop at the pace that Moto GP requires. It's possible that with the new influx of cash from the new owner that they could mount a serious and fast GP effort.

Ben Spies is as serious and as fast a rider as any out there and I fully expected that the move to the 1000CC configuration was going to benefit him. There is great disparity in weight and riding style between Ben and Jorge, which makes developing a new platform challenging. Yamaha has obviously decided to focus on their "A" rider in Jorge.

I honestly believe that Ben Spies will challenge for the world championship someday. His level of commitment to the sport is very high and I think he's one of the hardest working riders in the field.

In the event the Moto GP moves towards the CRT formula, I think that would greatly benefit riders like Ben Spies who cut his racing teeth in production based machinery.

One more observation before I go, and that is that with the exception of Nicky Hayden, all of our Moto GP champions in the 2000's have come up through the GP ranks - 125's and 250's. So far no one out of the Moto 2 series has mounted a serious threat to the aliens and those who have come up through superbike have not either. Stephan Bradl may be the first to mount a serious threat out of Moto 2.

Since it's begun - here are my predictions:

Valentino will stay with Ducati - he and the new ownership will convince Jerry Burgess to stay on as well and they are going to dedicate resources never before seen to making that pair world champions once again. Valentino will eclipse the remaining Ago record that he has to overcome.

Jorge will stay with Yamaha - it's been a good relationship and they will both look to continue it

Casey Stoner will retire as predicted

Suzuki will make a re-appearance on the Moto GP scene and will look to re-acquire Bautista in the process. Alvaro clearly has the talent to make a bad bike work OK and isn't getting the support he wants / needs from Honda.

Yamaha will bring Cal onto the factory squad.

Ben Spies will get an offer from Honda

Bradl will get an offer from Honda

Dovi will get a factory ride with Yamaha on a 3rd bike


CRT will continue for another year, but ultimately the field will return to all prototype machines with a spec ECU. This will satisfy both Dorna's desire to reduce cost and the manufacturers desire to retain brand identity in the championship. This has been one of the major failings of Moto 2 in my opinion - no one roots for the Suter or the FTR- they want to root for a brand or a team that they recognize and can go see in their local dealership. That being said, Moto 2 has produced very close competition and is extremely interesting to watch. This is why the spec ECU will make an appearance in Moto GP.

-s

I believe as well that Valentino is still competitive and fast. The Ducati...with its issues, I believe can and will be cureable by Rossi and his team. The "only" issue I find that would not help in Rossi's favor is if he loses Burgess as his crew cheif "possibly of course" due to increased family issues. I seriously doubt anything less than something serious would keep Burgess from retiring while Rossi is still racing. But the issue has been brought up in the past and it has resurfaced lately( granted a small resurfacing) but still it is on the radar of some important people.

With Spies and CRT racing, given his background in production based machinery, it WOULD be interesting to see how he would do in the event that the series goes more into a CRT format. I am with you and think he would have a leg up. Similar with Nicky.But, similar, I do not think that CRT will last very long. If a push to unanimously put the field on CRT bikes, I believe some of the more..."elite" riders will backout of the series. The Spec ECU would work, and after some bickering, would be a great compromise. Also, the rebound of this "sump" that Moto GP has been in as well as the manufacturers I believe will soon be over...(3-5yrs) with an increased field and atleast 5 manufacturers. Honda, Yamaha, Ducati, Suzuki, and BMW. With as much success they have had with the S1000R and their current progress in WSBK, I cant help but think if this continues, they will make a push towards GP.

FZjake719 Re: Thoughts on Spies?

Spies is having a hell of a rough season this year, I dont know whats going on with him, but its definitely dissappointing as a fan. Im sure its dissappointing to his team and himself as well....we'll see.

I'm fairly certain things will shape up similar to this:

Dovi to Yamaha

Spies to Tech3

Cal to stay where he is

Rossi to stay where he is(as he said he plans to until he retires after the 2014 season)

I'd honestly hate to see Spies leave the factory ride, but if he doesnt get his shit together he will most likely lose the ride. You can tell Dovi is riding his ass off, and really pushing himself to pick up a factory ride, and honestly you cant deny the fact of the results he's been getting on the Tech3 bike all season. The guy is talented as hell, and while Cal is too, Dovi is pretty much starting to "show him up".

Now, as far as who's taking the Repsol ride, thats all up for speculation Id dare say, allthough I think Bradl could have a shot at that once he gets more into the swing of things on the bigger bikes....

Either way, it was definitely nice seeing Rossi back at the front of the pack, and just the same Spies needs to get his shit together!!
Mon May 21st, 2012 07:43 AM

So if Spies goes to Tech 3 who do you think would fill the remaining Factory spot?
Bradl is looking good, but with the rules stating an entering rider coming into the premier class rides a satellite first, then a factory,where do you think they will put him? Cal move up, Bradl tech 3? Bautista to Suzuki, Bradl Honda? Man the more I think about it, the more I see Spies going to a CRT to make room, or a Honda "possibly of course.

And yeah, Its awesome seeing Rossi back at the front of the pack!

My Predictions to go with ya'lls

-Rossi to stick with Ducati
-Spies to Yamaha satellite
-Lorenzo to stay with Yamaha
-CAL to take le Repsol spot
-Dovi to take Yamaha Factory
-Bradl to take Honda satellite
-Bautista to Suzuki....or Spies? hell why not?