GoPro. Does it contain evidence that can help or hurt you?

[Cornfed]

There is talk all over and on several different forums about video taping traffic stops. Knowing on any ride I have probably broken the law at some point I lean towards it providing evidence against me. However, there are alot of stories about that footage proving innocence in the court room. And going a step further and proving LEO acted unlawfully and unethically.
Can LEO seize, or even just view your camera without your permission?
Is it lawful to video a traffic stop/arrest?



Thanks for your input.

[Grim2.0]

Far as I know there is no Law stating you cannot record your interaction with police been pulled over. As far as when an officer tells you to turn the camera off I don't know, to be honest with you I wouldn't turn mine off and every time I have been pulled over I have not turned mine off.

Plus you and mostly everyone else here on the forum knows that I got pulled over for an illegal pass that I was recording, I went to court with pictures off of the footage from the go Pro fought the ticket showed the judge the pictures that prove the sheriff didn't even see me make the Pass as well as the past is legal in itself.

You would know chad you were there you were looking at the sheriff like you wanted to kill him.

[Aaron]

It is lawful to videotape any Police action as long as you are in a place you're legally allowed to be, you are not interfering with the Police in any way, and you follow their lawful orders if they give any.

In order for them to seize your camera, they have to have probable cause that it contains evidence. I doubt many Officers are going to be able to reach that level, because they need more than a reasonable belief. I doubt your camera will ever get taken. It does happen, but a lawsuit will usually follow.

I won't take somebody's camera unless there's video of a homicide on it. I've got better things to do than watching a 4 hour clip to catch you passing on a double yellow.

I've been considering getting one myself. And many cops won't even know it's going if it's not on your helmet, so don't tell them.

[Cornfed]

I didn't forget but that's just one example where it worked it in "the defendants" favor. Trying to get some sort of consensus.

[Cornfed]

It is lawful to videotape any Police action as long as you are in a place you're legally allowed to be, you are not interfering with the Police in any way, and you follow their lawful orders if they give any.

Is shut off that camera a lawful order?
Is let me see the footage on that camer a lawful order?

[Aaron]

An Officer cannot order you to turn the camera off. There's exceptions if you're in certain buildings, but not on a traffic stop.

The second part is tricky, and I'm not aware of high court decisions. I doubt you'll ever be asked, but if you are, I'm honestly not sure. There's arguments both ways. That's something my agency would never do, so I'm not sure. Sorry I can't reall help ya with this one.

[madvlad]

Well the only way to obtain the camera or footage is if its consider evidence right?

[Aaron]

Correct, and in order to do that he needs probable cause to believe there is evidence on it. Well if he observed you pass on a double yellow, and you were recording, then that meets probable cause. And there's no law which specifies how serious a crime must be to collect evidence. It relies on the reasonableness of the Officer and his administration.

[spideyrdr]

Probably the first example I think of is this dude who was riding like an ass-hat and was pulled over by an LEO. Ok, probably justified to pull him over, the manner he did it was straight out of Super Troopers. But they tried to charge the rider with wire tapping or some craziness since he had a GoPro camera and recorded the encounter. It looks like the judge eventually ruled the officer has no expectation of privacy, which I think we all could agree is expected in a situation where a cop cuts off the rider in an unmarked car, emerges with a weapon drawn, and identifies himself only as "state police". WTF.

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news...ping_case.html

Now, all this said, remember if you HAVE done something stupid and get pulled over, an amped up LEO may find every single possible thing to charge you for especially if you're being a dick and say "Smile, pig, you're on candid camera". The situations where video evidence will exonerate you are probably far less than those where it will actually be helpful. But if the question is can you have a camera on at any time on public roads, I think (and this is opinion only) it is legal and does not constitute wire tapping.

[madvlad]

Probably the first example I think of is this dude who was riding like an ass-hat and was pulled over by an LEO. Ok, probably justified to pull him over, the manner he did it was straight out of Super Troopers. But they tried to charge the rider with wire tapping or some craziness since he had a GoPro camera and recorded the encounter. It looks like the judge eventually ruled the officer has no expectation of privacy, which I think we all could agree is expected in a situation where a cop cuts off the rider in an unmarked car, emerges with a weapon drawn, and identifies himself only as "state police". WTF.

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news...ping_case.html

Now, all this said, remember if you HAVE done something stupid and get pulled over, an amped up LEO may find every single possible thing to charge you for especially if you're being a dick and say "Smile, pig, you're on candid camera". The situations where video evidence will exonerate you are probably far less than those where it will actually be helpful. But if the question is can you have a camera on at any time on public roads, I think (and this is opinion only) it is legal and does not constitute wire tapping.

Man this leo was heated, if you're not in uniform and flashing a gun how do you expect the rider to follow orders? He didn't even show a badge for the love of God and I don't care if he said state trooper or not. I wouldn't have followed a single commannd till he proved he was a cop to me, mainly with all the crazy shit and mind unstable people out there these days.

[spideyrdr]

Man this leo was heated, if you're not in uniform and flashing a gun how do you expect the rider to follow orders? He didn't even show a badge for the love of God and I don't care if he said state trooper or not. I wouldn't have followed a single commannd till he proved he was a cop to me, mainly with all the crazy shit and mind unstable people out there these days.

Yeah, this was just a few years back too. The video linked on that site seemed to cut out how aggressive the non-uniformed, unmarked-car-driving, gun-pulling LEO was in the stop. Point being was the video itself (not the CONTENT of the video, but the fact he was recording when he was stopped) was initially being used AGAINST the rider. The judge tossed the wire tapping charges, and the rider, who was being a major douche in traffic, there is no doubt there, was charged with what he actually did.

Frankly I don't have an answer to if video is a good or a bad thing if you get pulled over based on this example alone. One over the top rider against an over the top LEO could have been a major civil rights battle, and I would encourage anyone not to use video evidence unless absolutely necessary.

[nicklk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyYlRZAdPGk

This is a great example of a cop trying to seize a GoPro, in hopes to use it as evidence against other crimes. Didn't quite work out too well for the LEO, as he was put on leave for his actions. Pretty interesting

[CYCLE_MONKEY]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyYlRZAdPGk

This is a great example of a cop trying to seize a GoPro, in hopes to use it as evidence against other crimes. Didn't quite work out too well for the LEO, as he was put on leave for his actions. Pretty interesting

Ok, so, the cop may not have the right to take the camera away, but if he saw people doing illegal things, and he saw there was a camera rolling, seems like evidence to me.

The rider was a total dick, and whe you're ordered to do something by a LEO, do it, and then let the court sort it out if oyu have an issue with it. You go trying to be an asshole, and, well, look what happened to the guy. I've got no sympathy for him.

[madvlad]

I love it how you say let the courts sort it out... Ummm that cop that made up a charge to arrest that rider for doing nothing works for those courts... What makes you think that "justice" will prevail when they just want to seize a chance to make $$$... Please dude, makes me laugh how everyone in this country thinks that the law will play in your favor when everything in the system is made so those In power win regardless of facts.

[Cornfed]

I love it how you say let the courts sort it out... Ummm that cop that made up a charge to arrest that rider for doing nothing works for those courts... What makes you think that "justice" will prevail when they just want to seize a chance to make $$$... Please dude, makes me laugh how everyone in this country thinks that the law will play in your favor when everything in the system is made so those In power win regardless of facts.

I agree. Thats why I put a little money into a legal defense fund for myself every month. Its not much but I have/know, a great lawyer and a little money set aside just in case. AND the system does so much bluffing that if you have decent representation you will usually come out ahead, or at least you can choose to pay your attorney instead of the court system.

[madvlad]

I agree. Thats why I put a little money into a legal defense fund for myself every month. Its not much but I have/know, a great lawyer and a little money set aside just in case. AND the system does so much bluffing that if you have decent representation you will usually come out ahead, or at least you can choose to pay your attorney instead of the court system.

yea having a good, trustable lawyer on your side is always a plus given the D.A's work for the courts though they get appointed to you, they still set you up for failure, like that dipshit at Morrison that technically told me I'm fucked and hey guess what the judge ruled in my favor cause that lying piece of shit cop was trying to get away with two birds from ine stone and ended up losing his job for being a dishonest piece of shit. Wish I would've had money for a lawyer to sue their bitch asses at the time for charging me with speeding for with doing nothing but having the common courtesy to pull over for my friend who was.

[CYCLE_MONKEY]

I love it how you say let the courts sort it out... Ummm that cop that made up a charge to arrest that rider for doing nothing works for those courts... What makes you think that "justice" will prevail when they just want to seize a chance to make $$$... Please dude, makes me laugh how everyone in this country thinks that the law will play in your favor when everything in the system is made so those In power win regardless of facts.

Made up a charge? He said he pulled him over for a non-visible license plate. That is valid, but arresting him for it? Not so much.

I say do what you need to and let the court sort it out, because if you're an asshole to the cops, it can only lead to bad things, no matter what. What good does it do you if you're an asshole and resist arest, they think you have a gun, and you get your ass shot dead?

Best to cooperate, let them be a dick if that's the way they want, and go to court. If you're an asshole too, the jury is gonna be a LOT less likely to have any sympathy for you.

Funny how I'm NOT a dick to the cops, am 100% legit with tags and plate, and license etc., and i've never been fucked with in over 30 years of riding....... Maybe the guys that have issues are doing something wrong?

[madvlad]

Yea true there, no point of arguing for sure but still fucked up... Either or courts still don't solve shit lol

[CYCLE_MONKEY]

Yea true there, no point of arguing for sure but still fucked up... Either or courts still don't solve shit lol

Well, when I was younger (right after the Big Bang....) I had gotten 2 tickets within 5 min from the same cop....but he made a couple huge mistakes, and I was able to prove it, so I got out of 2 legitimate tickets for speeding, because I showed the evidence I had to the judge. The judge also chewed out the officers right in front of the courtroom after he dismissed the tickets. So, the system CAN work, if you do things right and CYA. And being an asshole to a guy with a gun and a badge ISN'T doing it right.

[Ghosty]

Can LEO seize, or even just view your camera without your permission? Is it lawful to video a traffic stop/arrest?

This is what pisses me off. Unless the camera is somehow impeding the duty of the officer, or "investigation", it should NEVER be illegal, that's total Nazi gestapo commie bullshit. This is America, I get more sickened everyday by shit like this. We give the cops too much power, imo. Unless there is an actual criminal activity going. Being stopped for speeding isn't a fucking major felony and you shouldn't be treated as one during this pullover. But every cop seems to act like you just raped their wife.

[Stuart Little]

Anyone remember how to block a member?

[Aaron]

This is what pisses me off. Unless the camera is somehow impeding the duty of the officer, or "investigation", it should NEVER be illegal, that's total Nazi gestapo commie bullshit. This is America, I get more sickened everyday by shit like this. We give the cops too much power, imo. Unless there is an actual criminal activity going. Being stopped for speeding isn't a fucking major felony and you shouldn't be treated as one during this pullover. But every cop seems to act like you just raped their wife.

Did you bother reading the posts?

I said, quite clearly, several times, that it is not illegal. So this isn't some "Nazi gestapo commie bullshit." This is America, and it's legal to videotape anybody at anytime so long as you're in a place you're legally allowed to be, and they have no reasonable expectation of privacy.

As for the last part, ya, that's exactly how I always act

[Ghosty]

If 'you' don't act like that then there obviously isn't a problem. Sorry for the poor choice of wording if it offended people, and if my post was semi-offtopic. Frustration will do that.

I've just seen it way too many times now. I feel like I can't use my GoPro I paid for because cops immediately assume your guilty if you have one. It's happened on my bike and car and a few friends with fast cars. This includes just meeting in a parking lot, and they're not respectful nor polite about it. When these cops see a camera they assume streetracing, even if none is going on. I leave it home nowadays. Save it for the track.

I guess maybe we're just unlucky to not get officers like you instead. I also partially blame it on ricers and the Fast&Furious franchise. Thanks for clarifying the legality, I'll remember that next time a power-tripper grills me with the angry gestapo tactics.

[madvlad]

Fast and the furious franchise