Monday, October 13 HPR Motorcycles Only Lapping

[ticktock4792]

well half day passes for tomorrow afternoon are only 90 bucks if you haven't signed up yet

[ticktock4792]

ill be there at 12!

[Neutron]

I was going to comment on Aaron's post. I decided it was not worth it. He is a true legend in his own mind. This "pussy" will stick to the street, where it is "safer"

[The Black Knight]

I know, but we're going to lose the tracks if people don't come out to them. I get that it's hard to get out there, I played the excuses game for years. But now that I popped my cherry, I hate riding on the streets. It's boring, expensive, and more risky than barebacking a midnight Colfax Avenue girl. And this forum has so many threads about how much cops suck because they write riders tickets for breaking the law, well I've never seen a single trooper hanging out with a radar gun at turn 4.

Now that I do ride track, I ride the canyons just to actually see things, and hardly even break the speed limit. Funny, cops don't hassle me for doing 65 in a 65 either.

I'll be at the end of month 2 for 1 at PMP I just need a man to share the experience with.

You had me at Midnight Colfax Girl, but that last part just sounds extra gay.

Man, you really need to learn some tact, or maybe how to talk like an adult. The most I've spent on a day out carving canyons (barring any fun tax), is probably $60, to include fuel & lunch. That's a big difference from the costs of bike prep, time spent traveling, money spent on fuel for a vehicle to get there, the day pass, and the one-time track orientation fee for many of us. There are plenty of guys that would love to hit the track, but not everyone, including yourself at one time, has the money to spend, or even a track suit to do so. Try putting yourself in other people's shoes before making unnecessary accusations from unreasonable expectations.

I think you may be coming down a little hard on Aaron there Drano. I know you and him have some pent up frustrations between each other that need to get aired out(LOL j/king!)

Honestly, though I can see where Aaron is coming from. He does have a point in that you will never get hassled at the track for going to fast, dragging your knee or having a extra loud exhaust. His point does have some credence because of the unusually high amount of threads on here that people have posted with their trips going bad or ending up with contact with law enforcement. It does seem that it has happened more frequently than usual and that could be nothing more than coincidence. It could be law enforcement stepping up their presence in those areas because of complaints from local residents about the high amounts of motorcycle traffic. Regardless of whatever the reason, you have to admit that it does seem a lot of you have made contact with local law enforcement this year.

I don't know what axe you have to grind with Aaron is but I will say that in speaking with him at the track. He's a nice enough guy and doesn't come across the way his posts seem to portray him.

I can totally understand your point of view but only to a degree. You mention not everyone has the money for a full suit. I would recommend maybe skipping a month or two of canyon rides and investing in a full suit, boots, gloves and helmet. With the amount of canyon rides you guys do(usually every weekend), if you spent roughly $60 each day(Saturday and Sunday, assuming you ride both days). That's $120 in one weekend and in five weeks time that's $600. There's your money for gloves and boots right there. In another five or six weeks save up for a suit. I'd recommend getting this stuff in the Winter that way you really don't see the money being saved because the riding season is over. Also, that's assuming you buy brand new gear. There is plenty of used gear to be found not only on this site's For Sale section. Craigslist and Ebay offer excellent venues for snagging some decent gear. Also, site's like Revzilla and MotoSport offer discounts on much of their gear.

I agree with you that riding the canyons is much cheaper. But really is it?? When you factor in the risks involved in canyon rides(especially if you ride them the way I used to). I can't tell you how many close calls I had in the mountains. For me, I knew I had to get to the track because I was always pushing it in the mountains.

The $100 I spend on a track fee, pales in comparison to coming around a corner in the mountains with my knee on the ground and seeing gravel in the corner, or worse at cow or a oncoming vehicle in your lane. Believe me, those two scenarios have happened to me. Barely missed the damn cow and the oncoming guy in a Subaru WRX swerved at the last moment to avoid a head on collision with me. In both instances I was going way to fast and had my knee on the ground. Why?? Because that's how I rode in the mountains(like a f**king idiot!!). Suffice to say, there isn't a highway law that I didn't break.

Dude I've had more pucker moments before the age of 26 riding in the mountains than most people ever will encounter. Why?? because again, I used to ride like a total D-bag with complete disregard for safety. I got better or safer I should say as time went on, mainly due the fact that I saw way to many guys going down on rides. Had one to many close calls than I wanted so I decided that I needed to change. I found out about going to the track through a local MRA racer. Did a little over a dozen or so track days in the span of two years before I had my big crash at the track. Took some time off to fix a few things in my life and get sorted and now I'm back on the track and for good this time. Already knocked out four track days and may do one more this year.

Believe me Drano, you can try and justify not going to the track as much as the next guy. But if you're riding like I did, and from the stories I've heard about some rides that have happened on here. Seems like it's the same old same old, with just new and different riders. People will always push it in the mountains and sooner or later the inevitable happens.

Reason I gave up riding on the street is for a couple of reasons. Mainly now that I have a CDL, I can't risk tickets at all. I'm also not a huge fan of the way people are starting to drive these days. Yeah back 10 years ago people drove terrible. However, just on my commutes to work I saw some serious bad drivers and people who you can tell spend their entire time behind the wheel of their vehicle with their head up their ass.

My bike is track only now. I let my plates expire at the end of last month and won't be getting new ones. Am I going to race?? No and highly unlikely that I ever will. I'm getting to old for that part of track riding. I still enjoy riding the track and pushing my limits on track days. I'm still plenty young enough to continue that sort of riding.

I also have to agree with Aaron on more people going to the tracks. The more people that do go out for track days the more these tracks will be around for us in the future and our future generations. Who knows, if more and more people would do track days, maybe the tracks would lower their track day fees. Still though, $100 for a Half Day at Pueblo is a smoking deal. I still knock out close to 40-50 laps every time I go out. To me, that's more important than anything. Getting in quality laps now and learning about my riding. Learning why I'm getting faster and where I need to improve(at this point it's in many areas).

So I know you two enjoy bagging on each other and yeah Aaron could have approached the comment a little more diplomatic but that's how he's wired I suppose. I've noticed you seem to have it out for him, the way I have it out for Fast and Furious HAHA!!! Relentless smack talk

[Neutron]

I'm with Drano on this one. At the end of the day, do what you enjoy and don't dis other people for doing what they enjoy. If you want to be safe, stay at home on your couch and try not to choke on your self-loathing.

[The Black Knight]

I'm with Drano on this one. At the end of the day, do what you enjoy and don't dis other people for doing what they enjoy. If you want to be safe, stay at home on your couch and try not to choke on your self-loathing.

Was this directed at me?? Because I haven't dissed anyone for what they do and agree with you that people should do what they love. But don't for a moment think I'm worried about being safe or I'm afraid of everything. I'm at the track pushing my limits way more than I ever did on the street so it's not an issue of safety. I will say though the track is a much safer environment due to the fact that it is a controlled environment.

[Drano]

As loquacious as ever TBK. I think you mistake the intent of my earlier post. For starters, and as Aaron loves to point out, I don't even own a motorcycle right now. Secondly, I have all the gear and willingness to get to the track the moment I have the bike, time, and money to do so. It's not about my excuses. Ever since I got my first bike I have wanted, and have been urged by all of the great riders I know, to get there. The fact is that there can exist any number of obstacles preventing guys who regularly ride the canyons from doing so. Especially if money is tight!

Aaron's language in his complaint is highly inappropriate, and does more to push people away from hitting the track, especially if, in some people's minds (as Neutron pointed out), he's going to be there. It does nothing to help foster a positive attitude for track riding if he's the type of rider they can expect to find out there. Granted, there are a lot of high-caliber guys trying to get guys on the track, and I actually count Aaron as one of them. But his post doesn't come off that way. In fact, it sounds more like a childish tantrum that he's going to lose his track privileges if more people don't start showing. He's not helping the cause, he's hurting it.

I know you have met Aaron, and I agree with you, he is a really nice guy who'd do anything to help somebody else. But sometimes he says things that he shouldn't. In this instance, and to some people, talking that way is a first-class ticket to an ass-kicking. As much as I may think he sometimes deserves it, I'd still rather see him show a little maturity and avoid such mistakes and possible conflicts in the future. It's fine and good to talk to me that way, I'm his friend and can handle it. But talking that way to everyone is bound to set somebody off eventually, and they'll know where he is to find him.

[Neutron]

Was this directed at me?? Because I haven't dissed anyone for what they do and agree with you that people should do what they love. But don't for a moment think I'm worried about being safe or I'm afraid of everything. I'm at the track pushing my limits way more than I ever did on the street so it's not an issue of safety. I will say though the track is a much safer environment due to the fact that it is a controlled environment.

It was not directed toward you at all. More toward Aaron really. You bring up valid points, as does Drano. I agree with you on many of your points, including that the track can be safer. What we do has its dangers at the track or otherwise.
To be so arrogant as to call canyon carvers pussy's when your at the track running the same corners over and over again, in a controlled environment, is a bit much for me to handle. I would like to go to the track some day. When I get the money to set up my bike, buy the approved gear and make the drive out there, I will. Until and after then I will enjoy the street.

[Drano]

This one is just to prod Aaron a little bit.

[The Black Knight]

As loquacious as ever TBK. I think you mistake the intent of my earlier post. For starters, and as Aaron loves to point out, I don't even own a motorcycle right now. Secondly, I have all the gear and willingness to get to the track the moment I have the bike, time, and money to do so. It's not about my excuses. Ever since I got my first bike I have wanted, and have been urged by all of the great riders I know, to get there. The fact is that there can exist any number of obstacles preventing guys who regularly ride the canyons from doing so. Especially if money is tight!

Aaron's language in his complaint is highly inappropriate, and does more to push people away from hitting the track, especially if, in some people's minds (as Neutron pointed out), he's going to be there. It does nothing to help foster a positive attitude for track riding if he's the type of rider they can expect to find out there. Granted, there are a lot of high-caliber guys trying to get guys on the track, and I actually count Aaron as one of them. But his post doesn't come off that way. In fact, it sounds more like a childish tantrum that he's going to lose his track privileges if more people don't start showing. He's not helping the cause, he's hurting it.

I know you have met Aaron, and I agree with you, he is a really nice guy who'd do anything to help somebody else. But sometimes he says things that he shouldn't. In this instance, and to some people, talking that way is a first-class ticket to an ass-kicking. As much as I may think he sometimes deserves it, I'd still rather see him show a little maturity and avoid such mistakes and possible conflicts in the future. It's fine and good to talk to me that way, I'm his friend and can handle it. But talking that way to everyone is bound to set somebody off eventually, and they'll know where he is to find him.

Well I understand where you are coming from Drano. Can't say as Aaron's comment warrants an ass beating. I think if you've got to hunt someone down because of a comment they said on a internet message board made you ass hurt. Then I think the person in question has a much larger problem than just a random comment made by someone being insensitive on the message boards.

I get that you think he acts before he thinks. However, who doesn't or hasn't done that? I think we've all been guilty of that.

My post wasn't entirely towards you either. I had a good idea that you have most if not all the gear for riding. My post was more for those that don't have all the gear and I merely provided some good ideas for someone maybe looking to get to the track. I've always had the mindset from an early age that if I bring someone a problem then I must also bring them a solution. Call it old school but that's just how I'm wired.

[07D675CO]

It really annoys me how much everyone on this forum raves about "tearing up the canyons" but are too big of pussies to take it to the track.

Anyway... Got the bike ready today. Mirrors off, oil checked, rear brake adjusted, and air filter cleaned. As soon as the rain stops it goes in the pickup!

You are clearly better than the rest of us because you have a BMW S1000 and you track it.

[blaircsf]

I would love to hit all the track days, but having done most of the track days the Friday before MRA rounds it also becomes a days off question. I know why (especially at HPR) it is mostly days during the week, and I don't fault anyone for it, but it is still a consideration.

[Aaron]

Wow, so much drama. Must be the off season, when people bitch instead of ride.

Had great day, there were 5 bikes in the morning, and probably 12 or so in the afternoon. Open track all day, no sessions. No one crashed, and there was a great mix of skill levels. I ran a personal best of 2:10.75, but most of my laps were 2:12s. I really feel like I'm running out of places to cut time, just corner speed. I'm utilizing traction control on probably half the track, and 3/4 of corner exits, I'vE got great lines, and my braking points are spot on. Just need to work on trail braking and corner speed. I'm a bit scared to push the corner speed higher without better tires and tire warmers though, as there were a couple times the rear end slipped out and the bike got squirmy mid-corner at full lean trying to keep up with a GSX-R600. And I'm not good at leaning and braking at the same time.

Overall good day. A lot of imprpvement, brakes worked amazingly well, and I cut 7 seconds off my previous best lap.

[madvlad]

What tires you running Aaron?

[FZRguy]

I live just off Colfax. Exaxtly where are these Midnight Avenue girls?

[Ph03niX]

College student. Just above broke. Spend about $10 bucks in gas when I go on rides once a week or two. No way in hell can I afford the track. Life isn't perfect for some of us.

[The Black Knight]

I live just off Colfax. Exaxtly where are these Midnight Avenue girls?

Way I look at it is $100 buys a lot of laps at a track day but then again $100 buys a lot of Midnight Colfax Girls too. Either way it's money well spent

[Aaron]

What tires you running Aaron?

I'm running PR2's, and I think you hit the nail on the head right there. I truly feel I'm quickly approaching the fastest lap times these tires can cut. Better tires would mean more power out down out of a corner, much better corner speeds, and better braking. But right now I'm looking at replacing the bike with a 2015, so I'll probably throw another set of PR2s on just because they do well when cold, and last a long time. On the new bike I'll get an extra set of forged alum or magnesium rims and put slicks on them. 200 series too.

[Aaron]

College student. Just above broke. Spend about $10 bucks in gas when I go on rides once a week or two. No way in hell can I afford the track. Life isn't perfect for some of us.

I've spent my fair share of time in that position, and I get it. If you don't need your bike for the street, then first you can sell all the street items off of it, make $500-$1000 there. Next count no longer carrying registration or insurance, or needed the M endorsement on your license.

And you won't get tickets anymore. In the 6 years I've been riding sportbike I've paid about $1100 thanks to the State Patrol. Thanks at least 11 full track days right there.

Now if you need the bike for dual purpose, then really the only savings you have are the traffic fines. But personally I'd be out ahead.

[Ph03niX]

Jesus that's a lot of ticket fines haha. So you don't ever ride the street anymore. Do you ever miss riding on the street? Now that I think about it, the big difference between the track and the street is a) being able to go where you please and b) looking cool/showing off to others. So saying you got over the look cool deal, don't you miss riding around and seeing the views on a bike instead of a car?

[madvlad]

Hit up Jon Glaefke on the MRA forums. He's selling Dunlop D212 GP Pros (UK, not US spec so theyre way better) take offs for $100 a set and they're in near new shape man. I have a set on my R6 on those tires are awesome, even during round 6 that we were standing at pre-grid during some oil clean up and my tires lost all heat, they still gripped incredibly well. I wasn't a fan of Dunlop at all till these tires or also hit up Oscar at Sol Performance and see what Pirelli takes offs he has. A good set of tires will increase your riding confidence and braking hardcore

[The Black Knight]

Jesus that's a lot of ticket fines haha. So you don't ever ride the street anymore. Do you ever miss riding on the street? Now that I think about it, the big difference between the track and the street is a) being able to go where you please and b) looking cool/showing off to others. So saying you got over the look cool deal, don't you miss riding around and seeing the views on a bike instead of a car?

You can't be serious with the b) part of your post. I mean really? Worrying about showing off and looking cool to others. This is the exact kind of mentality that gets you more tickets. Trying to be awesome and show off is what squids do plain and simple.

Hands down this is one of the main pros for me to stop riding the street are all the squidies running around trying to loom impressive. Yeah most people grow out of that mentality at age 12. Least I did for that matter.

[Aaron]

Jesus that's a lot of ticket fines haha. So you don't ever ride the street anymore. Do you ever miss riding on the street? Now that I think about it, the big difference between the track and the street is a) being able to go where you please and b) looking cool/showing off to others. So saying you got over the look cool deal, don't you miss riding around and seeing the views on a bike instead of a car?

That was one ticket too. A 40 over from CSP. But believe it or not most people here have paid about the same over their years of riding. Between the fines, lawyer fees, point deductions, and insurance premiums going up the cost of "tearing up the canyons" is high.

I still street ride, thankfully I'm in a position where I can afford to. But if I could only afford one or the other, give me a cheap shit 10 year old 600 and a track day and I'll be a happy man. But I ride slow and safe. I follow the speed limit, and keep a sharp eye out for dangers. On the track I go into corners sideways, leave black stripes on corner exits, and hang the front wheel on the straights.

I like riding the sreeet, for the reasons you mentioned and more. But I've learned more in 6 lapping days on the track than I have in 16 years of riding on the street/dirt. And learning at the track makes me a better street rider, because I have a better understanding of how far I can push my machine.

[rybo]

The track is a great place. Period. We get to expire the limits of our abilities in an environment that doesn't contain gravel, oncoming traffic etc.

I think a big part is the ability to repeat something multiple times. You won't get many chances to run the same corner 10 times in short order in golden gate canyon, and this is why learning at the track can be really valuable.

Modern street tires are truly amazing. I would have done bad things to have tires as good as the PR2 or the Q3 as my race tires 5-7 years ago. The race tires are even more impressive WHEN they are in their operating range. Outside of that range they can be really really scary. That means they probably need to be over 150F to work and as we move into the fall days, especially if you don't have tire warmers, they aren't the tire of choice.

I strongly (VERY strongly) recommend getting out for one of these clinics in the near future. There are a bunch coming up and I'll be instructing at some of them. That isn't the reason to go, however. Here are some reasons to go.

1) The curriculum is designed by one of the best motorcycle instructors in the US (if not the world)
2) It's cheap
3) The quality of the time and the program is VERY high

If you haven't checked one of these out yet, you should. Riders of all abilities and inclinations (street, track, commuting, dual sport, cruisers, scooters) can benefit from the skills that are taught and practiced in these clinics.

Here is a link to the next one. I hope to see some of you there.

https://www.facebook.com/events/668720896529514/