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Thread: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

  1. #25
    Gold Member madvlad's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Crazy part is that the coils looked good, cleaned them out, fresh plugs and the bike purred and then what, not even a day and back to it. Gotta be a tuning issue then
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  2. #26
    Gold Member Kim-n-Dean's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    Damir and I pulled the coils and I physically checked them all. They looked good to go. I didnt think of it like that Dean.

    Im just wondering if a Power Commander or ECU flash will fix the problem. Im sure someone would have spoken up by now but has anyone had this problem with their R6R and fixed it with tuning?

    Nuts told me from the get-go that I needed a tune to fix this. Im guessing you are right
    Kim's bike would run perfectly for quite a while, then it would run like shit and sometimes she had problems getting it out of a parking space. It would roll two feet and die. Her coils were obviously arcing. Black marks everywhere. You couldn't miss it. If yours look good, they probably are. However, I guess a tiny crack is all it takes to ground out and maybe you can't see the signs of it if it's small enough. I hate shit like this!! My R1 is acting up, too. Every time I hit a bump, the headlights blink. Now, they don't come on at all. Everything checks out fine, but I have to admit that I haven't looked real close at it. Probably pull the wire harness this weekend. Fortunately, I have a complete spare electrical system for it. Harness, coils, ECU, relays, etc...

    Maybe we should just chuck 'em and get new R1Ms!!
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  3. #27
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Totally in Deano.... We could trade both of our bikes in and still owe $12k on one We could share it

    I ordered the exhaust insert, not thrilled about it but if it helps until I figure out what tuner im going to go with I guess I will roll with it.

    Lame. Who makes their exhaust quieter
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  4. #28
    Gold Member Kim-n-Dean's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    Totally in Deano.... We could trade both of our bikes in and still owe $12k on one
    That ain't no lie!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    I ordered the exhaust insert, not thrilled about it but if it helps until I figure out what tuner im going to go with I guess I will roll with it.

    Lame. Who makes their exhaust quieter
    Is that exhaust insert made specifically for removing the cat on an R6? Kim's bike appears to run fine, but I wonder if she'd get a power boost by getting the back pressure back to stock specs. Who makes it?
    Kim & Dean
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  5. #29
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kim-n-Dean View Post
    Is that exhaust insert made specifically for removing the cat on an R6? Kim's bike appears to run fine, but I wonder if she'd get a power boost by getting the back pressure back to stock specs. Who makes it?
    Its made specifically for the exhaust that I have but I bet other companies have them. Really its a DB controller so all exhaust companies "should" have them to make their "non street legal" cans legal.

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  6. #30
    Gold Member Kim-n-Dean's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezzzzy1 View Post
    Its made specifically for the exhaust that I have but I bet other companies have them. Really its a DB controller so all exhaust companies "should" have them to make their "non street legal" cans legal.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/391139419321...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
    Well shit! I can't find a reliable answer, but it looks like Kim's bike did not come with a catalytic converter. So, why was I comparing how her 2003 bike runs with a 2010 without a cat? Well, because a very well known bike mechanic (that may or may not be on this site) told me Kim's bike came with a cat, and I'm safe to run race gas in it because the cat was removed when I put her Yosh on. Kind of like how a dealer told me that my truck... ah, nevermind.

    So, does anyone know if a 2003 R6 came with a factory catalytic converter?
    Kim & Dean
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  7. #31
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kim-n-Dean View Post
    Well shit! I can't find a reliable answer, but it looks like Kim's bike did not come with a catalytic converter. So, why was I comparing how her 2003 bike runs with a 2010 without a cat? Well, because a very well known bike mechanic (that may or may not be on this site) told me Kim's bike came with a cat, and I'm safe to run race gas in it because the cat was removed when I put her Yosh on. Kind of like how a dealer told me that my truck... ah, nevermind.

    So, does anyone know if a 2003 R6 came with a factory catalytic converter?

    My answer wound be no. No cat and no O2 sensors.

    There is however a baffle towards the end of the headers that looks like a catalytic converter. Different year bike but I left mine in (I didnt want to loose too much back pressure ).

    Last edited by Ezzzzy1; Fri Jul 17th, 2015 at 01:22 PM.
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  8. #32
    Senior Member WolFeYeZ's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    When I had problems with coils, I swapped out the plugs thinking it was them. Bike ran great for a little then back to shit. Also, my coils did not show any abnormal blacening or anything too. Still ended up being the problem.
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  9. #33
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by WolFeYeZ View Post
    When I had problems with coils, I swapped out the plugs thinking it was them. Bike ran great for a little then back to shit. Also, my coils did not show any abnormal blacening or anything too. Still ended up being the problem.
    Was this on your 05?
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  10. #34
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Ezzy,

    Some things to check / test.

    1: battery voltage / charging system. On these bikes low volts can lead to misses. It might be that it's making adequate volts above 6500 revs and that helps it clear up.

    2: ground connection loose battery terminals

    3: move the coil from the low temp cylinder to another cylinder. If the temp on the new cylinder drops, then it's that coil.

    4: bad fuel theory- if it gummed up your throttle bodies / injectors it might be causing the problem. Run a tank of fuel with a cleaner in it. I've had good luck with seafoam or amsoil quickshot
    Last edited by rybo; Sat Jul 18th, 2015 at 09:25 AM.

  11. #35
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kim-n-Dean View Post

    So, does anyone know if a 2003 R6 came with a factory catalytic converter?
    The 03 R6 for sure came without a catalytic converter.

  12. #36
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Quote Originally Posted by rybo View Post
    Ezzy,

    Some things to check / test.

    1: battery voltage / charging system. On these bikes low volts can lead to misses. It might be that it's making adequate volts above 6500 revs and that helps it clear up.

    2: ground connection loose battery terminals

    3: move the coil from the low temp cylinder to another cylinder. If the temp on the new cylinder drops, then it's that coil.

    4: bad fuel theory- if it gummed up your throttle bodies / injectors it might be causing the problem. Run a tank of fuel with a cleaner in it. I've had good luck with seafoam or amsoil quickshot

    All good things to check. I will cross them off my list.

    Thanks man
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  13. #37
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Tested the battery and it checked out good.

    Put the exhaust insert in and it didnt help.

    I will be sending the ECU off on Monday to have it flashed with a list of mods to the bike. Fingers crossed that this is the fix.
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  14. #38
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Alright. I could use a little insight....

    The bike is at a factory shop right now. They are saying that cylinder 1 is not firing. Ok, makes sense but hes saying that the cylinder is washed from the fuel and he wants to pull the head off to inspect it. $400 is what that would cost.

    My question is, from anyones experience, can a washed cylinder cause ring and block damage? They did a leakdown on it and its reading 160ish and the other three are 180ish.

    All that said, pulling the head doesnt solve the problem.
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  15. #39
    Senior Member FZRguy's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Is the shop saying that compression loss is due to rings or valves? Simple test will tell. I've never heard the term "washed cylinder." Is he trying to say fuel leaked passed the rings?
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  16. #40
    Gold Member Bueller's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    The cyl. gets washed with unburnt fuel and dissolves all the oil off cyl walls so there is no lubrication. Cyl walls and rings will score from direct metal to metal. Should be able to see that with a borescope. Don't know why they would need to pull head for inspection. Is it intermittently not firing or completely dead?

    If seriously scored it would need extensive work, if not too bad you could squirt some oil in plug hole and crank it over a few revolutions to get some lube on cyl walls.
    Last edited by Bueller; Sat Sep 26th, 2015 at 09:30 AM.


  17. #41
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    It seems intermittent. As in its runs like a top after about 4k RPMs and you can litterally feel it go from running on 3 to 4 cylinders. So, im guessing when thats happening its working as it should.

    I brought up the borescope and he was more like "we should pull the head". If there is damage the motor is going away, I dont see any point to spending $400 to physically inspect the internals. That and what does that do towards solving the problem?

    Could a bad coil be the culprate? The warmer the coil gets the more it fouls? Anyone seen that before?

    Mechanic did say that he added a bit of oil and it ran better but that still doesnt fix the spark issue.
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  18. #42
    Senior Member Wrider's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Wish I had seen this yesterday, I would have lent you my borescope on my way through Rastle...

    Before you get too turned on by motor damage, it's actually pretty easy to re-hone a cylinder. That might be all it needs.

    Sounds to me like it could be a bad fuel injector honestly. If it's not running well at lower RPMs it could just be that it's held open and running way too rich for that cylinder. Once you get going, your higher RPMs are keeping it going by burning the extra fuel (again running too rich, so keeping the cylinder cooler than normal).
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  19. #43
    Senior Member longrider's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    First, I completely agree that if you are not going to fix the engine if the cylinder is wasted there in no sense in pulling the head. A borescope will tell you all you need to know. A coil is unlikely to fail the way you are describing but it is very easy to check. All 4 coils are identical so just swap the bad cylinder with a good one and see if the problem moves (obviously switch the wires so the wires stay with the same cylinder) From everything you have described it does point to a ring sealing issue. Lower compression in that cylinder, squirting oil in helps, and even the running at higher RPM all point to cylinder leakage issue.

  20. #44
    Senior Member Ezzzzy1's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    So lets say that the injector is the culprate (as in its staying open). I suppose that could fowl out the plug right? But then what would make is start running better at 4k RPM? Maybe just the fact that the injector is firing normally means the plug can catch up and fire it instead of getting flooded out?

    On a car I know how to listen to and injector to see what its doing. Hows this done on a motorcycle? If there were an injector issue wouldnt it throw a code?
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  21. #45
    Senior Member Wrider's Avatar
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    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    Yeah it could foul out the plug pretty easily.

    At 4-6K on a N/A engine more fuel must be added so that it can run properly at about 10-12K you actually shut down fuel a little. Weird but it works. So basically if the injector is stuck open (or partially open), it'll start running better and better up to a certain point.

    Does it run fine at 14-16K RPM?

    You can listen to a bike injector the same way as you do the car injector, but it's gonna be a PITA to get to because usually it's mounted to the throttle body under the tank. As for the code, not necessarily. If it's stuck open then the current is flowing through it no problem when the bike sends the current and it sends back the proper current. The spring won't return it to its previous state though. So the bike will never know that it's not back in the place it should be. If you have a closed loop FI system (I don't think you do) then it might throw a code for running too rich, but that'd be about it.

    EDIT: Apparently you do have a closed loop system, so it might be picking up that it's running extra rich, but compensating by running the rest of the cylinders leaner.
    Last edited by Wrider; Sun Sep 27th, 2015 at 07:44 PM.
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  22. #46

    Re: 2010 R6 ignition/fuel issue?

    I bought a borescope off Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JERRES6) for something else I was doing. It's not the nicest one but for $20 it works just fine. You would be welcome to borrow it, although we are sort of on opposite ends of the front range. If you have Amazon prime you could get one this week.
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