I had a pretty bad crash last summer... (video)

[blaircsf]

While I agree you can't account for everything, I do think some people overlook their own bad decisions and place the blame elsewhere.
https://www.revzilla.com/common-trea...ur-motorcycles
It's a small sample size so it does have some limitations, but interesting either way.

An uncontrolled intersection presents nearly 41 times the risk of no intersection.
...
Here’s the surprise, however. What’s the most common scenario? Riders hitting (or nearly hitting) another vehicle from behind. There were 35 of those incidents. Are we really almost twice as likely to plow into a stopped car in front of us as to have someone pull into our path?

Speeding was mentioned above. Someone pulls out in front, did they miss the motorcyclist or did they not look far enough given the speed (could they look far enough?)? I remember reading about an accident in the past year or two that was initially reported as "car turned in front of motorcycle" but then later excessive speed of the motorcycle was reported. I know this isn't always the case, but I think too often people are quick to place blame anywhere else.

I saw a video on facebook in the past couple of days of a motorcycle hitting a mattress ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBfpQGtq4do ), my first response is why is he riding so close? When they first come into view you can't even see the motorcyclist because he is so close to the trailer.

I'm not going to say I've never broken traffic laws or ridden aggressively etc, but I've seen other motorcyclists do stuff that just makes me cringe. Driving down 6th in my car and getting 'strafed' by bikes, frankly videos of people dragging knees in canyons, etc. Can you avoid every accident, probably not. Can you greatly reduce the chances, absolutely.

[bulldog]

While I agree you can't account for everything, I do think some people overlook their own bad decisions and place the blame elsewhere.
https://www.revzilla.com/common-trea...ur-motorcycles
It's a small sample size so it does have some limitations, but interesting either way.

Speeding was mentioned above. Someone pulls out in front, did they miss the motorcyclist or did they not look far enough given the speed (could they look far enough?)? I remember reading about an accident in the past year or two that was initially reported as "car turned in front of motorcycle" but then later excessive speed of the motorcycle was reported. I know this isn't always the case, but I think too often people are quick to place blame anywhere else.

I saw a video on facebook in the past couple of days of a motorcycle hitting a mattress ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBfpQGtq4do ), my first response is why is he riding so close? When they first come into view you can't even see the motorcyclist because he is so close to the trailer.

I'm not going to say I've never broken traffic laws or ridden aggressively etc, but I've seen other motorcyclists do stuff that just makes me cringe. Driving down 6th in my car and getting 'strafed' by bikes, frankly videos of people dragging knees in canyons, etc. Can you avoid every accident, probably not. Can you greatly reduce the chances, absolutely.

Thanks, that was a good article you posted
Some things I took from it:
“An uncontrolled intersection presents nearly 41 times the risk of no intersection”
“A downhill grade increased the risk by a factor of four while an uphill grade doubled it”
“Riders were nine times as likely to crash or have a near-crash incident on gravel or dirt roads than on paved roads.
“Riders were twice as likely to have an incident in a righthand turn than on a straight section of road (crossing the center line is considered a near-crash scenario, even if nothing else bad happens).
“What’s the most common scenario? Riders hitting (or nearly hitting) another vehicle from behind. There were 35 of those incidents”

So it basically shows what we have been discussing….bad driving is the main cause of accidents; mainly tailgating…no surprise there. Then it also supports that intersections are also bad…hence other distracted drivers (mainly). Then also shows road conditions like gravel (although leaves I found are just as bad), increase wrecks….rider experience and a bit of bad luck too.

I always thought it was so dumb a motorcycle tailgates….what is the point….the motorcycle is going to lose either way, so why even do it. Now that is a classic case of inexperience or just irresponsible.

The bottom line is as a sportbike rider we are going to break the law at some point maybe un-intentional, so it’s hard to say any of us have not pushed the limit a bit to be at blame. Hell for years I thought it was fine to accelerate to the speed limit as fast as I could….hey I never went over. Then I got pulled over and given the old “Exhibition of speed” and got the lecture from cop on how dangerous it could be….after thinking I had to agree…but for years never thought of it that way.

Anyways, I may be preaching, but believe me I am no saint and did a lot of crazy things on bikes. Like the older guys used to tell me, live to ride another day, so that is all I am trying to help others see before it is too late J

I feel safer on my Duke in the canyon because there's no one up there at 1PM on a weekday. I literally rode Golden Gate end to end and did not see one other vehicle going west, and just a few going back east. I have the luxury of riding on weekdays and I consider that a "good riding decision."

I-25 is four lanes of fast moving traffic at that time of day, with drivers more interested in their phones than driving, and I consider that "dangerous" no matter what type of vehicle you're in. I stand by both my statements, Nate. They are both true IMO.

I used to date an mortician, so I heard about motorcycle deaths daily during the season. Your ICU nurse wife and my ex only see the bad outcomes, and none of thousands of motorcyclists that had an uneventful ride on any particular day. There are roughly 8.5 million registered street bikes in the USA, and whatever the fatality rate equals is small (maybe you can look that up). No doubt the injury rate is higher. I'll take my chances with my brain on board making "good decisions."

I'm from Tulsa so I heard about Dane's death. Real shame and I have no idea what happened.

Been meaning to check out the Pint Room Nate, so we should make that happen. Pretty sure I still have your number. Will PM to check.

You are very fortunate to be able to ride weekdays, because as I am sure you know, weekdays have become horrible for riding as just so crowded and full of inexperienced riders….especially Harleys (the guy who got his first bike at age 50 because he always wanted one). This is one reason I started to no enjoy riding; ten years ago it was like your nice weekday rides anytime. Hoopty and I would hit up Dear Creek, to Bear Creek, down Morrison road to C470 nearly every day around 5pm , but now that is nearly impossible with all the traffic….and of course cops that are very aware that is a popular sportbike run (can you blame them from all the crashes/deaths on those roads though)…….pulled a guy out of Deer Creek river when he missed a turn and hit a tree….broke his jaw and we sat as EMT’s rescued him…how does this stuff not get to you man???

Jon, the main issue there is that there may be 8.35 million riders and the “fatality” rate is low in comparison, but you can have 1000 safe rides, but the 1 wreck could change your life for good….this is not a game where you get to start over. I have a uncle who got in a car wreck at age 28 (he was drunk and to blame) and became a paraplegic; he is 52 now and I’ve seen how that one wreck destroyed his life….and sad to say has burdened my family for years; currently he is bed bound from MRSA caused by his pressure sores from being in a wheelchair). So yeah, you could have years of safe rides, but that one time the teenager in a car in texting and runs a light that you can’t avoid is going to have a way greater impact to your life than those 1000+ safe rides. Again, I get it can happen in a car too, but my point is the rate for survival between the two is a no-brainer: leather/plastic vs steel/crumple points/multiple airbags.

Dane’s death they state was caused because he swerved to miss something in the road, hit the curb, which made his bike lose control hitting a light pole. So if a pro could not be 100% control in a situation like this, I don’t get how you would think you could….accidents happen, and like with Dane, he had thousands of safe rides (on track and off), but that one was his last. Honestly, if you are this good, you should be racing in the pros.

I have to ask, because it is something that I thought about as I got older that affected my decision………you don’t worry that it has been proven as we get older our reaction times go down…so in reality our experience is better, but we start to lack the reaction time a guy in his 20’s has (it peaks at age 28, then goes down). If experience was everything, then we would always see the old guys in sports be the best till they retire; doesn’t happen like that and younger people tend to replace them that have less experience. Anyways, that started to get into my head too, because I’ve obsessed with the bodies fitness level, but aging cannot be stopped and the older we get, unfortunately the slower we will process and be able to react like we did when younger…..that is never fun to learn.