Aftermarket Exhausts - Got one? Want one? Consider this...

[Spiderman]

As much as you like the sound of an aftermarket exhaust, or as much as you like the extra power it gives you, it may not be worth it in the long run.

This is from the March edition of American Motorcyclist magazine - the magazine that comes free with your membership in the American Motorcyclist Association (AMA).

Click here if you find the following image too difficult to read



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[SS929]

But some times the only reason I think people around me know about me is because my bike makes some noise. I would hope is below 80db even at WOT but I have no way of really knowing for sure.

[R1chie]

The problem has been around for some time. The Springs already have laws in place that state if you have anything other than stock you can get a ticket. The db level makes no difference, the officers do not have to carry a db meter. If it sounds "too loud" for them, they can pull you over. If they see it is not stock, they can give you a ticket. The stock exhaust is too loud now but people have to tolerate it, but as people make their bikes and cars louder with aftermarket, you will see new laws to make stock even quieter. Making aftermarket even more offensive. Even the "off-road or closed course" sticker will not mean much because even racetracks and off-road are feeling the effects of people saying no to loud vehicles if the race track or off road area is within ear shot of them. This may not seem fair but loud exhaust system infringe on everyone’s rights and are annoying at least. The "loud pipes save lives" argument is quickly losing support. Be considerate of others, do not ride with loud pipes or more laws will be passed to rid people of the problem completely. Simple as that.

[King Nothing]

I'm gonna get a system so loud it will destroy the world!

[Mac020]

I think the carbon fiber Tremi's are actually quieter than the stock Termi's that came with my bike.

[R1chie]

I think the carbon fiber Tremi's are actually quieter than the stock Termi's that came with my bike.

Doesn't matter, you can still get a ticket if it is not stock. Because of the people who ride with loud pipes without thinking how it affects other people, this city has a law that now give cops free reign to write tickets to anyone with a non stock pipe no matter what the DB rating is. People can joke about it but it is becoming a much bigger issue that now affect everyone in CS but it will continue as long as people continue to buy pipes that are not meant for street riding because of noise level.

[Mac020]

I know, but how's yer average popo gonna know the differance between stock Termi's and the carbon fiber ones, or even if the stock ones are even stock? I doesn't say anything about it on the cans. Guess it would be my responsibility to defend a ticket if I get one. Thing is, is that I try not to create an excessive amount of noise by racing my engine or doing squidly stuff in or around neighborhoods anyway. Hell I've heard steros that are louder and more annoying than my bike. And I'll bet my bike is quieter than most Harley's (Faster too! ) Oh, I forgot about how much noise my clutch makes.

[Zanos]

A Hardley is louder than any sportbike i feel. And those are mostly stock off the show room floor....

To Richie...
What do we do about the Hardley's that are louder than our streetbikes stock? Should we get mad at them? Should we tell them to add aftermarket to make it SILENT? Should we change the stock of th Hardley to not cause it to be loud?

And like they say..
Loud pipes save lives.

I think it is true, because there are times where someone has not been able to see a bike, but know its there. Where as if i am behind them, they can not hear me at all. And with all the stupid drivers on the road nowadays. Anything that saves a riders life or prevents a hospital visit should be legal.

Now if you are up and down the street with you loud pipes pissing off your neighborhood, thats a little different. But driving by? Come on now.

[bikernoj]

And like they say..
Loud pipes save lives.

I think it is true, because there are times where someone has not been able to see a bike, but know its there. Where as if i am behind them, they can not hear me at all. And with all the stupid drivers on the road nowadays. Anything that saves a riders life or prevents a hospital visit should be legal.

You mean like banning cell phone use while driving?

Come on, we all know that you can be riding a screaming yellow Ducati with race pipes, active sirens, anc Christmas lights right next to some SUV with their windows down and the driver will STILL change lanes into you!

Riding my bicycle outside of Morrison, there are always big groups of the LPSL club heading up the road. With no other traffic, no headphones, and only the sound of my breathing, guess how long it takes from the time I hear them to when they pass me?

No more than two seconds; not long enough at 50mph for a cruiser to stop, especially considering the average 0.75 sec reaction time. No matter how loud your pipes are, they WILL NOT prevent some jackass from pulling out into your way at the last second.

The only rule that works is that you are invisible to all people at all times, no matter what. Ride accordingly.

[mcduck]

I've got an Erion Racing pipe, it's not obnoxiously loud at all, but it is louder than the stock. I think about loud pipes in this way. When a motorcyclist is riding on the highway, are the in more danger from being cut off from a 4 wheeler in front or from behind? Where would loud pipes actually get people to take notice? Can people with their windows rolled up and stereo cranked still hear you? Would there be a better way to practice riding safely than to rely on loud pipes? I think the below picture describes my thoughts well...enjoy

[sugarrey]

I got a great idea.....Mind your own fuc*ing business! I have a devil race on my R1 and its pretty loud. Not d&d loud, but a nice crisp controlled noise. If you dont like that my pipe, get the fuc* away from me. Tell me its too loud and leave me alone, move on with your life....

All the guys I ride with and no one has ever been pulled over for loud pipes, some pipes are cut and gutted...never been pulled over. Whats the problem?

Im here all week, if anyone wants to talk about it

[FZRguy]

Loud pipes have nothing to do with safety. It’s your brain and your level of skill that determines your personal safety while on two wheels.

[macktastic brake grabber]

Loud pipes have nothing to do with safety. It’s your brain and your level of skill that determines your personal safety while on two wheels.

you know john i like you but that staement is BULLSHIT

i have stock pipes on my harley and i constantly have people right next to me shange into my lane because they dont look and they dont hear me. this summer i had a woman in a bmw directly next to me with her sun roof all the way open just run me right out of my lane. i didnt have anywhere to go so i had to split the lanes and lock up my rear and damn near locked up mt front to avoid getting hit. this is just one example of several in the last year .
if i am just cruising my bike is very quiet. more so than my old cbr 600 with a stock pipe.
i have had many times that i was driving my truck and about to change lanes to the left and i heard a loud ass harley or sport bike coming from behind me and it saved me from hitting them. i would say this has happened at least 30 times in the last ten years.
in all the cases that i was almost hit i was riding very safe , very alert and doing the speed limit or going with the flow of traffic.



there has to be a middle ground and it is a fact that loud pipes save many lives so do helmets and gear and so on yada yada
nuff
mack

[Mel]

You know, I (personally) agree with the gist of that, i.e. that we don't need to do any more to piss off the general public. However, most all aftermarket exhausts on a sport bike are still quieter (db lever) than a Harley or similarly displaced V-twin...while I concur that SOME people with SOME exhausts will piss people off, I don't think it is the guy who commutes to work and does the occasional canyon ride with his aftermarket exhaust that pisses people off. It is the squids in traffic who pull wheelies or sit an rev their bikes at lights (no matter what exhaust) that kill the "sportbike cause".

[R1chie]

\To Richie...
What do we do about the Hardley's that are louder than our streetbikes stock? Should we get mad at them? Should we tell them to add aftermarket to make it SILENT? Should we change the stock of th Hardley to not cause it to be loud?

.

A new saying is emerging "loud pipes risk rights" and I would have to agree. Some people believe the perception is often more important than reality.

Human hearing is most sensitive at 2k-5khz http://www.silcom.com/~aludwig/EARS.htm

As shown in the subjective loudness chart fig.3
http://arts.ucsc.edu/EMS/Music/tech_.../teces_03.html

In this article it is noted "Note that a motorcycle with a deep "clean" note will have the energy level discounted in the test, but a motorcycle with higher frequencies in the exhaust note may not only fail the test, be also be "annoying'. Here we have the reason why "trail bike noise" is marked for attention by authorities, yet ordinary street registered machines mostly pass unnoticed by the general population - unless surprised by it, or in a very quiet location where any noise would be a disturbance"
http://www.mccofnsw.org.au/a/117.html

It would seem that the general population are more offended by the higher frequency sounding bikes, (two stroke dirt bikes are more annoying than 4 strokes of similar db levels and high revving 4 stroke sportbike engines are more annoying than that slower revving Harley 4 strokes.

So IMHO it does not matter if we are "mad at them". It matters if the public is mad at them or mad at us. B

Stock Harleys have to meet the same EPA standards that sportbikes do. (Link below) "The federal Environmental Protection Agency limits decibel levels to 80 decibels for on-highway bikes, 82 decibels for off-road bikes and 78 decibels for automobiles, according to an article published by the Motorcycle Riders Foundation"

In the article below it states ""If it sounds loud, it's probably illegal," Gibbs said. "I don't know if we (police officers) have more of a trained ear, but loud is loud.
"If it's drawing attention to officers, I expect they'll pull 'em over to determine if they have a loud exhaust system. "If they determine it is, they'll issue a ticket," Gibbs said"

Also, even with a stock exhaust, if you run in a neighborhood with either a Harley or a sportbike at 45mph in first gear and at full throttle acceleration the bike is producing the max amount of noise and is probably heard even inside houses. When doing this, the exhaust and intake noise are much higher than what is probably tested as a norm. (Testing is not standard, how many feet away from the bike, at idle/5th gear cruising or full throttle acceleration change the loudness substantially.
http://www.gazetteextra.com/pipes052106.asp

I am not expert but if you are going to get mad at people, get mad at people who get a loud exhaust system, start it, rev it at 5am in the morning, ride the bike "on the pipe" all the time especially in neighborhoods at full throttle accelerate to get peoples attention. They get the attention as people turn their heads pissed off because some idiot is disturbing the peace and quiet. It is bad attention and it has affected our laws to the point that if the police even think it is too loud.. It is and you get a ticket.

[Butterfly]

Where's my popcorn, this is getting good

[R1chie]

Where's my popcorn, this is getting good

It is a very subjective post. I tried to support my position with some web info but really statements like, people find one motorcycle sound more offensive than the other is very subjective. Zanos has a point. Shouldn't Harley riders have to quiet down? I found that sound can be offensive too but IMHO the sound problem is only going to get worse for street/dirt competition and non competition alike. His point also shows that his ears find after market Harleys louder than sportbikes seems also to be true (straight through) because again it is subjective. My point is the problem is bad enough that in the Springs, gov has given police the ability to decide what is too loud without any type of testing. A guilty until you prove yourself innocent approach in regards to if an officer thinks you are too loud and once they discover your pipes have been modified, you are ticketed. The other debate is this actually an attempt to quiet vehicles or to generate revenue. The pursuit of happiness seems always threatened and squelched by anyone who is offended easily or by government trying to generate revenue. So who best to keep them off our backs, the manufacturers to make quieter bikes? To some extent, but clearly it seems to me the most effective method is to show them courtesy by not installing loud pipes and then running up and down the neighborhood and in the city at 12k rpm in first gear.

[Bueller]

Harley is discontinuing the "Screaming Eagle" and the Buell "Pro Race" line of factory exhausts and will no longer install these (and other aftermarket) exhausts at the dealerships. This is a direct result of the excessive noise problems that they are associated with. The company is looking to limit it's liability in this respect. Any aftermarket loud pipes will be the sole responsibility of the individual owners.
I know I have used my pipe to get the attention of idiot cagers, but more often than not it has been after they pulled a bone head move, and I am letting them know that I was there. Rarely does it prevent an incident.

[Zanos]

Very interesting and enlightening post. Richie. Thanks. I understand what you mean. And im not arguing with you. I just wanted you to say just that. A lot of that stuff i did not know.

My point again was: "Why are they picking on our aftermarket exhausts and not Harleys stock." Which you explained.

Thanks richie.

[macktastic brake grabber]

Very interesting and enlightening post. Richie. Thanks. I understand what you mean. And im not arguing with you. I just wanted you to say just that. A lot of that stuff i did not know.

My point again was: "Why are they picking on our aftermarket exhausts and not Harleys stock." Which you explained.

Thanks richie.

they are picking on sport bike in general because of all the jackass publicity that the media have been able to collect from the sqids agreeing to be filmed doing wheelies on I-70 and stupid shit like that. i got pulled over all the time on my sport bike and since i bought my screaming eagle fat boy the cops wave at me as i speed by them. btw. i have factory pipes that are very quiet.
mack

[pg_rider]

How can anyone NOT love the sound of a screaming inline-4? I mean really! Now, the sound of a tract-- er, I mean V-twin -- makes me want to put a bullet in my head, but I could listen to an inline-4 at redline all day and not get sick of it....

[Ezzzzy1]

How can anyone NOT love the sound of a screaming inline-4? I mean really! Now, the sound of a tract-- er, I mean V-twin -- makes me want to put a bullet in my head, but I could listen to an inline-4 at redline all day and not get sick of it....

Been a stalker of this site for a while, just signed up.

With a post like this one I would vote for you as president!

Oh and I dont use my horn, ever. I always rev my bike and get a better response.

[UHATEIT]

How can anyone NOT love the sound of a screaming inline-4? I mean really! Now, the sound of a tract-- er, I mean V-twin -- makes me want to put a bullet in my head, but I could listen to an inline-4 at redline all day and not get sick of it....

I like the sound of my V-Twin. And I dont have to rev up past 9K to get it to sound good like an Inline-4. Thats not to say an Inline-4 doesn't sound badass at 9K and above I love the sound of them hauling ass down the freeway by my apt at 2am it makes me want to go out and ride! But my V-twin doesnt require me to be above legal speed limits to enjoy the sound of it, it sounds good just rolling around on city streets.

[rforsythe]

I'm gonna get a system so loud it will destroy the world!

So you're gonna strap Bertha's ass to your bike?