How do we save PMP?

[Drano]

Snazzy, I appreciate your fervor to save PMP, but businesses don't operate on charity. PMP is a business and the riders are its customers. If a business can't keep its doors open because customers don't want to shop there, then the blame for its failure rests squarely on its own shoulders. It isn't the customer's responsibility to line the owners' pockets. The business has to be able to bring something to the table that the customers want/need. If they aren't capable of providing those things, whatever they may be, then the customers will choose to take their business elsewhere and, absent any government intervention (bailouts), economic evolution will take its place: the business will die.

There is a bright side, however, usually when a poorly run business fails, it gets absorbed. In the case of PMP, the land is owned by Pueblo City, so the track won't be going anywhere. It may sit dormant for a while until Pueblo can find another management group to take the lease, but hey, maybe the next group will do a better job running the place by providing better services to the customers, and that would be a good thing.

[aspenbum]

If track like PPIR was standing next to Thunder Valley on I-70 ,it could be much interesting to public not just club racing.So when public don't care for this area in this area then it will evolve in club only but not national venue.
You either adjust to those conditions or go to war against those who don't support racing at all .

First Thunder Valley is on C-470, second the general public does want to go to PMP, for drag racing not road racing. This is the goal of RMRS is to gain more interest in the road racing aspect of the motorsports fans that do come there.

We've brought our RV and boat to PMP and camped at the track. Get there Friday night, go to Pueblo reservoir Saturday and do a track day Sunday. We've camped there for every track day we've attended. Why are you not allowed to stay at the track anymore?

Wow!! That sounds pretty rude!! We're you acting a fool? If not, why the bitch session? Way to make people want to spend money at your track...

I was not acting a fool, I only rode my bike to tech and back. This was before Judy was running the show, she was only running the drag racing event at the time. I believe now you can stay there, but my point is there is no policy or rules on the website or at the track.

I like the thought you put into your post. I will say this, of the seven points you outlined, only one of them involves little to no expense from the track management, #7. For PMP to be saved, it will require serious investment from people that have the money and are willing to spend that money improving facilities, services, accommodations, and marketing.

Some suggestions I have to save PMP:
1) Petition the local government (who own the land) to subsidize the expenses necessary to improve the facility.
2) Begin a fundraising campaign like gofundme to procure the funds needed and donate them to PMP. This one would also require establishing an awareness campaign and hope that it generates enough interest from the public to be effective
3) Contact Judy and ask if you could create a volunteer force to provide a few of the services that are currently lacking.
4) Find a way to seek out investors who would be willing to partner with Judy and ease the financial burden needed to run/improve PMP.

In the case of PMP, the idiom "It takes money to make money" is wholly relevant. They are in the goods and services industry. While geographically they have no close competition, they are still going to be compared to the goods and services provided elsewhere, namely HPR. If PMP wants to compete with HPR, they have to offer similar amenities. They may actually have to go above and beyond to draw people in, because PMP is at a disadvantage in terms of customer base. HPR can pull from the Denver Metropolitan area (~2.7 Million people), but PMP basically has Pueblo (~110,000) and Colorado Springs (~440,000). There has to be an incentive for Denver customers to drive the greater distance to visit PMP. They're not going to to that if they already have something better in their own backyard.

In the other thread discussing PMP, it was argued that the track could be saved if people would go there and ride it, then Judy would have the money to provide those services. To me, it seems like those people are putting the cart before the horse. It's like saying that you love a restaurant that serves terrible food, and doesn't have many repeat customers other than a few regulars. In order to prevent the restaurant from going out of business, the solution being offered is that people should spend their money on terrible food until the owners can afford to hire a trained chef with proper cooking appliances. It just doesn't work that way, and it isn't the fault of the customers.

These are some good ideas, some of which I hope Judy is exploring. I would point out that if you are going to take over the lease of a race track, you should have your financial planning in alignment before you are allowed to sign that lease. So where is the alignment for the road racing? Have you ever been to a Friday night drag at PMP? There are cute girls in skirts greeting the people at the gate, multiple consessions, a track announcer, full drag crew, tech inspection, the whole nine. My point being, the funds have been mis-appropriated, mis-managed, mis-handled call it whatever you want.

I would gladly pay the same amount of money that Glenn charges to ride at PMP if it was ran the same way as HPR or PPIR when they host track days. Maybe we need to start a track day buisness and rent the track out and run it the right way to show people how fun it can be. Then with the business generated it can once again flourish on its own.

I think they made the wrong move with their race series. They're not going to compete with MRA and racing is too intimidating for people to pick it up as a first-time-to-the-track experience.

I think they'd be a lot better off if they invested their efforts in standing up a real track day program that has some time on the weekends. MRA has one weekend track day and there are a lot of people out there (like me) that A. don't want to take off work for track days and B. don't want to be completely liable for crashing an expensive street bike (track days are covered by my insurance, competition\racing\timed events are not).

Safety is obviously the first issue that needs to be addressed, but after that, I think they'd do well to set up an east-coast style scheme where they give free track time to coaches who in turn spend a few sessions in the morning teaching a beginner class and then just lap around giving advice when asked and maintaining safety on the track for the rest of the day. It requires no capital outlay and getting new people to the track is the only way to build volume and revenue. I think most people are intimidated by the concept of going to the track but if you stand up a couple hour class to go over the basics so they are more comfortable, don't do something dumb, and provide a little hand holding through that first day, they're going to get hooked. Another thing that seems to work well back east is giving a free "session" at lunch to track noobs with relaxed equipment requirements. It's basically a few parade laps, but it gets people out there and eases them into it. People just need more structure than what they have down there. I mean, can you imagine, never having been to a track day before, showing up to Pueblo and them saying, "have at it." People need more structure than that to get into something new.

I think ultimately we all feel bad for them, but it's just kind of poorly managed and I don't think they have a clear\reasonable business plan to move forward.

I think this is a perfect plan actually

The negative comments here (one coming from someone who does like 2 track days a year lol) are really sad and annoying.... let me explain:

It doesn't matter WHO is running the track, don't have enough money then you don't have enough money. Barely anyone even comes out for the MRA events, yet there is an ambulance there, so what's the excuse?
There was a full track day for $60 and maybe 10 people showed up, with an ambulance there. So what's the excuse?
You can't help the track because people don't want to "drive so far" The problem is us, the riders, not the person running it.

More riders = improvements
Until then, you can talk all you want but that doesn't make money fall from trees.

I love PMP. It's an awesome track and well worth riding. If it were to go away because of all these fair weather riders, I'd be fairly upset.
/rant

I was at that track day, and the bus was only there from 11-2. I went and was willing to ride without one just because it was the first day my bike was actually running. However, it wasn't advertised very well and it isn't all going to fall into place on the very first track day that she has. IT DID start to spread the word that she is going to have the bus there for the RMRS series as long as we commit to going.

Just some stupid questions here....
How long does it take for the ambulance to get from HPR to the nearest basic hospital?
Given a 10 minute response time for PMP then to the nearest basic hospital?

Probably 1 hour for HPR and 30 min for PMP. But let me ask you this, if you crash on your bike, cut your leg open and your femoral artery is cut, do you really want to wait 10 min for the bus to show up or would you rather have that bus on site ready to apply immediate response? Truth is you'd be dead if they weren't there in 10 min and the bleeding was under control.

Snazzy, I appreciate your fervor to save PMP, but businesses don't operate on charity. PMP is a business and the riders are its customers. If a business can't keep its doors open because customers don't want to shop there, then the blame for its failure rests squarely on its own shoulders. It isn't the customer's responsibility to line the owners' pockets. The business has to be able to bring something to the table that the customers want/need. If they aren't capable of providing those things, whatever they may be, then the customers will choose to take their business elsewhere and, absent any government intervention (bailouts), economic evolution will take its place: the business will die.

There is a bright side, however, usually when a poorly run business fails, it gets absorbed. In the case of PMP, the land is owned by Pueblo City, so the track won't be going anywhere. It may sit dormant for a while until Pueblo can find another management group to take the lease, but hey, maybe the next group will do a better job running the place by providing better services to the customers, and that would be a good thing.

I truely don't want to see this track go dormate. I really do love riding there but it is up to us to help the customers stay interested if we want to keep riding there. Ultimately it's the business responsiblity to attract customers but most business gain more from word of mouth through their customer base then through local advertising- which there isn't much of. Why not try do keep what we have while we have it available?

[WolFeYeZ]

Probably 1 hour for HPR and 30 min for PMP. But let me ask you this, if you crash on your bike, cut your leg open and your femoral artery is cut, do you really want to wait 10 min for the bus to show up or would you rather have that bus on site ready to apply immediate response? Truth is you'd be dead if they weren't there in 10 min and the bleeding was under control.

The nearest good hospital is 6 miles or 13 minute drive from PMP, including the access road. In an ambulance, probably under 10 minutes. In some circumstances, I could see that saving your life compared to HPR.

As for solving the ambulance issue, it could be a good idea for PMP to hire an EMT, a driver and buy an ambulance. Hell, the driver could even flag a corner where the ambulance is.

[BadR6Man]

Save the track by going there on june 7th. 2 for 1 day. I will be there for sure with ninja2.

I am always more than welcome with teaching and helping others at the track. I assume nick lesatch will be there also for the sunset class also.

For the ones concerned about an ambulance,
I can say the riders meeting right here right now.

Dont break rule number one. Problem solved.

[GNGSXR]

Why did the MRA cut PMP to only 1 round each season? I never understood this. If there is an old MRA thread discussing this on their forum please direct me to it.




I do about 3-12 track days a year at PMP and have been for the past 6 years. I accept the lack of EMS issue as a big risk but I still go to the track. They use to allow cars/bikes on it at the same time. That was "fun" and I am very lucky to still be here today.

If an EMS was on site I would probably cut 2-3 seconds off my average track day lap time on the first lap out. I ride PMP with a bit of a safety margin since there is usually no medical service on site but I still feel the track time is worth it for me.
We take a risk everyday just getting out of bed. I am more afraid of riding my bike in the city or in the mountains than I am at the track. I am not trying to defend the lack of EMS at the track because I definitely would like to have them available every time I go. I'd be willing to pay more for it as well but I will still go to the track without them being present. What else in your life would you not do because you are too scared of not having a safety net? That sounds like a boring way to live but it is your money.

Corner workers at every corner would be nice for the extra safety but I don't feel it is necessary. I'd rather use that money for an EMS since I do not think all of PMP's issues can be fixed immediately. PMP is laid out in a way that as long turn 8, the tower/turn 10, and maybe someone at turn 4 or turn 1 all have a competent worker with their head on a quick swivel then the entire field of view is covered.

I have only been to HPR a few times and I don't go regularly because I live in Colorado Springs. I can get to PMP within 40 minutes on a good day, no traffic incidents on I-25, and the moon and stars perfectly aligned. I understand why the Denver people don't visit PMP as often as HPR. I know driving distance is a lame excuse but that is my main reason for choosing PMP over HPR.

I have heard from several riders recently who go to both tracks that PMP is a lot smoother than HPR. Turn 8 at PMP is starting to get bumpier. Turn 10 always clenches my butthole but aim for the middle and you are fine. If the drag strip rubber gets heat into it then taking a wide line on turn 10 is do able but I will leave that to braver riders.

Half the time I go to PMP I feel like I have the track to myself. I can do 15 laps without any traffic which is great for me but bad for PMP.
Is the lack of turn out for PMP due to Judy, lack of advertising, lack of interests from riders due to safety concerns? I don't really know.

PMP also has a 2 for 1 day every month during the summer and they even did a $60 lapping day a month or so ago. $60 for a full day of lapping!?!?! They had an EMS present during the $60 day but was only available from 11am-2pm or 3 pm. It was a decent turn out but I expected the track to be packed for $60.


Judy really does care about keeping that track open and doing everything she possibly can for the people that attend the track. She is always open to opinions or any kind of help with the track so please voice your concerns or ideas directly to her.
I'd hate to see another race track close down.



I'll be at the track on June 7th as well.