Super street bike class next year in the MRA

[Spongebutt]

Just a thought about the machinery. Someone earlier posted that older/prepped bikes are far less money to "race" on. This forum had a very nice 500 twin just a few weeks ago, went for around eleven hundred, I believe. While not an hp king, it IS eligible for...Lightweight Endurance, Lightweight GP(easy to get novice waiver from New Rider Director), Super Twins U, Novice U, Amateur U, Colorado Class, and of course, Sportsman.
I went the pre made route three years ago. Actually, it was four. I raced Sportsman Motard on my dirt bike for a season. Cost one set of tires. Still got them. Decided to learn to drag my knees. Bought a GSXR600 for 2500. Fully prepped, rear sets, ect(and spare motor of questionable heritage). Rode it for a year, sold it, and bought an SV650 for 2980 (which included the 490 for shipping). I've been racing it for the last three years(I did put flat slide carbs on it last year). Tires last a long time and maintenance is next to nothing.
My point(finally) is this. If you can live without the lastes and most expensive machinery and learn the basics, it can be done relatively inexpensively.
Of course, inexpensive is relative. You can spend 600 on hiking boots, so???
I really hope the intro class idea gains traction. Like Beuller said, Heroin....Cheap!

[MRA 32]

My God! I started this late last night and my eyes are tired from 4 pages!!!!

I'll start with scoring. I needed feedback to see if people wanted a race or something more relaxed. The "simulated race" is a term we use in the race school. So I have talked to the scoring guy in the MRA and we can manually score a race, but it will require some more people and possibly expense. I don't want to force street bike riders to buy a $400.00 transponder! We can turn it into a championship with points but we have to have a class sponsor to pay for trophies. Plus I want to entice riders to move into a full prepped race bike and join the novice ranks.

Next the cash. As a rider you have to look at the big picture. AMA membership is $40, MRA license (I think streetriders would be associate members not racers with a dedicated race number) and this membership costs less (Mike Applesauce might know this cost off the top of his head), and the school which I guess runs about $300. This is an upfront cost. Then it all depends on how many race weekends and races you want to enter. If you want to chase a title you will run all the rounds. If you just want to go out and do a couple of races than great.

Racing is not for everyone, but everybody deserves the chance to taste it.

Bike prep: I need to clarify case guards, you can buy thickened covers for "X" or buy guards for less than "X". NOT all bikes have one or the other.Which means if covers are not available for your bike, you don't need them! (I hope this helps you Cathy) We require these basics for our insurance and years of experience racing in the MRA. Do you as a rider want to hit an oil slick at 100+?????

My intention is to get an idea what people think of this proposal. The 450 class will not happen (I am the only rider as of now racing one). The 250 cup won't work at this altitude either.

Bueller you may not like Conser for what ever reason, He has his good and bad points just like you and me. BUT he is one of the people who helped bring us HPR and for that I thank him.

As far as crashing your streetbike; if you aren't willing to light it on fire tomorrow than getting on the track isn't for you.

I'm sorry if I missed something in this post please let me know if I need to do some more explaining.

Thanks for all you opinions and thoughts they are helpful.

Jeff

[64BonnieLass]

MRA....

I think it might be helpful to understand what is on your hands right now.

You did post a great thread in hopes of a further understanding from CSC in pushing the MRA towards needed goals.

However, you must understand the seperation.

There are sooo many CSC people who ride. And ride with courtesy and knowledge and time towards others.

But I do, for one, feel that many MRA members like to slam the CSC for it's membership and for it's forums. That is all fine and well, and I get that reasoning more then you know.

But just like MRA, when push comes to shove, the members of this CSC forum, take care of each other. And that is priceless.

However, to slander CSC in times past, and then somehow "reach out" when time are tough is hard for me.

I DO believe that there are a great many, talented and stellar riders on the CSC. I know it to be true first hand.

Many aren't MRA material, but they are personal quality teachers, in terms of protecting those they ride with.

I am MRA as a noob. So take this for what it is.

I won't say this on the MRA forums...but I am tired of MRA treating CSC like shit, until they decide they want something from us.

I have said on MRA that I believe CSC is a breeding ground for future racers. Some heard me, some didn't. I believe that the Chicane Track Day's are a breeding ground for future racers. And I will always believe that to be true.

Some of us will get struck by the bug, some won't. But those Chicane days are the play ground for the future MRA, should it stay so.

It would also help, if "rider reps" that are paid on the MRA did their job. Because honestly, the only two chicks that have ever helped me pursue this endevor, and help me push on, were Sasha and Jen. I have never been helped by any other women in the MRA.

So you guys decide.......

PS. My name on MRA is TerriRomaneschi. And if you want to use my words...you may if you so choose.

[LambeauXLIV]

Which means if covers are not available for your bike, you don't need them!

Ummmm... if some people don't need covers, then why do others? That seems a little unfair if you ask me.

Make it one or the other, not both, regardless if covers are available for the bike or not.

[Bueller]

Ok I really don't get the altitude restriction on the 250's.
Everyone is affected the same, so why would altitude matter?

Case covers are only needed on bikes w/vulnerable cases, twins for example are exempt because the engines are so much narrower.
What will they do about the r6's vulnerable tanks, would these owners be required to buy the protection required for the MRA tech?

[LambeauXLIV]

^
Okay

[Sean]

I just read the MRA forum, and it seems like there are two main threads; one about why people aren't racing and one about putting up flyers. Granted, I may have missed some stuff, but I think that's the jist of it.

The ideas that they are hashing out don't seem like great or long term solutions. Trying to get people to attend the races is great, but is that going to save it? Or is filling the grids going to save it? Handing out/putting up flyers is good to help spread the word, something that's long been missing, but it's not going to get new racers. $10 for 2 people isn't a long term fix. And really, how much of a draw is there to hang out at HPR or Pueblo? There's nothing there, it's not a great situation for a spectator. I'm happy to go because I have friends there, but I don't think that applies to everyone. Maybe it will help get to the end of this season, but what about next year?

I have said on MRA that I believe CSC is a breeding ground for future racers. Some heard me, some didn't. I believe that the Chicane Track Day's are a breading ground for future racers. And I will always believe that to be true.

I agree 100%. How else would someone get hooked on the track? And it doesn't seem like any CSC person who posts on there is received well. It's to bad because this is a large pool of potential racers. Maybe I'm off to left field with my thinking, but I feel like they really need to focus on getting some new blood in there. Maybe that could bring down some costs and the seasoned racers could afford to be back on the grid? (that'll never happen) Realistically, if I were the MRA, I would be working with the track day companies in order to recruit new riders to race.

[silkboxr]

How is the MOM series in Utah doing?

I know they "MOM" have called several MRA members that have raced their series in the past to see why they have not been racing there lately. They were told even 3 or 4 more racers would be a big help because of the small grids there recently.

What I was mentioning is how they (Miller Motorsports) were able to attract new racers to the track i.e. street riders! Not who's got more racers now the MRA or MOM. That's not the point. The point is they bent over backwards to help the average guy take his street bike to the track and have some fun. That's what it's going to take to get new blood into the MRA which it needs badly in order to survive. I imagine every racing org. whether it be WERA or MRA are down on riders this year thanks to our economy..

A club no matter what it is car's or bikes or what ever is only as strong as it's member base!

[Bueller]

Bueller you may not like Conser for what ever reason, He has his good and bad points just like you and me. BUT he is one of the people who helped bring us HPR and for that I thank him.

Terrific, now you have a track but the MRA has been in a tailspin for years now under his admin. Maybe he should have paid more attention to business of the MRA and not alienating current members and not setting up his own employment future. the MRA has been in financial trouble since way before this economic downturn. The failure of the MRA can only rest on the leadership. I like most of the Board members but they have failed.

However, to slander CSC in times past, and then somehow "reach out" when time are tough is hard for me.

Now it's time again isn't it?
They need more bikes/riders to plug into their "Matrix"

[TheStig]

Is there such a thing as leasing a race bike? It used to be that you could lease spec cars for racing in series like spec miata etc. This limits the upfront costs for a racer. Might be a cheaper way for people to get into it.

[rybo]

Ummmm... if some people don't need covers, then why do others? That seems a little unfair if you ask me.

Make it one or the other, not both, regardless if covers are available for the bike or not.

The purpose of the covers is to prevent the pavement from grinding though the stock covers and leaving a bunch of oil on the track.

In the case of my bike, ducati 748, the clutch is dry (no oil and in fact I run a cover with a bunch of holes in it) and the stator side is well inside the frame. There would be no point to putting reinforced case covers on my machine. On my last racebike, yamaha R6, the cases extended well beyond the frame and would have been one of the first things to touch down in the event of a crash. Both sides had oil behind them, so case covers were required on that bike.

Not trying to be a jerk, just trying to clarify why the rule is written the way it is.

s

[TFOGGuys]

In reality aftermarket case covers will not make one damn bit of difference when you consider everyone's Great Big Fear here is some asshole oiling down a full turn, etc. ...

Hence the AMA dropping the requirement for the pros to have them years ago, as it was really a non-issue.

I think that the streetbike class could easily be likened to Chicane's "Never Ever" program as a tool to let people test the waters (read: get hooked on adrenaline), without having to make a huge financial commitment. If the MRA chooses to move forward with this, I think they should work closely with the USBA to ensure that they avoid the making the same mistakes and experiencing the attrition asociated with those mistakes. As racing goes, motorcycle roadracing is towards the semi-cheap ens of the scale, but when the cost to go out and SEE if you like it is $5K+, you're gonna scare off a LOT of potential racers. When I first started going to the MRA races in the mid 90's, the cost of a class, membership, and license totalled about $160. How is it that it's almost 4 times that much now? Throw in a transponder, a steering damper, and case covers, and pretty soon you're way on the wrong side of $1K...

Here's my take on how to control the costs:

1) Grant a "provisional license" good for 3 race weekends to anyone who can prove track experience(Chicane, Keith Code, Pridmore, etc.) for $50, upgradable to a full novice license any time during that season by paying the difference in license fee. A provisional license would only be valid for streetbike class , and maybe Sportsman.

2) drop the requirement for a steering damper in the streetbike class, but strongly recommend it.

3) drop the requirement for case covers for the streetbike class

4) offer transponder rentals for a single weekend with a security deposit. Nobody wants to race without knowing lap times.

5) Offer incentives to move up in racing, like free enrty in their next streetbike, Sportsman, or Novice race for the streetbike race winner.

My humble opinion, and probably worth less than what you paid for it.

[Sully]

Is there such a thing as leasing a race bike? It used to be that you could lease spec cars for racing in series like spec miata etc. This limits the upfront costs for a racer. Might be a cheaper way for people to get into it.

I believe that 303Cycles has a fully prepped race bike available for rent. Contact Konichd to find out for sure.

[LambeauXLIV]

just trying to clarify why the rule is written the way it is.

Got it, thanks.

[mra828]

the MRA has been in a tailspin for years now under his admin.

You must've never met Andrew Drattlo...

[hcr25]

MRA....

I think it might be helpful to understand what is on your hands right now.

You did post a great thread in hopes of a further understanding from CSC in pushing the MRA towards needed goals.

However, you must understand the seperation.

There are sooo many CSC people who ride. And ride with courtesy and knowledge and time towards others.

But I do, for one, feel that many MRA members like to slam the CSC for it's membership and for it's forums. That is all fine and well, and I get that reasoning more then you know.

But just like MRA, when push comes to shove, the members of this CSC forum, take care of each other. And that is priceless.

However, to slander CSC in times past, and then somehow "reach out" when time are tough is hard for me.

I DO believe that there are a great many, talented and stellar riders on the CSC. I know it to be true first hand.

Many aren't MRA material, but they are personal quality teachers, in terms of protecting those they ride with.

I am MRA as a noob. So take this for what it is.

I won't say this on the MRA forums...but I am tired of MRA treating CSC like shit, until they decide they want something from us.

I have said on MRA that I believe CSC is a breeding ground for future racers. Some heard me, some didn't. I believe that the Chicane Track Day's are a breeding ground for future racers. And I will always believe that to be true.

Some of us will get struck by the bug, some won't. But those Chicane days are the play ground for the future MRA, should it stay so.

It would also help, if "rider reps" that are paid on the MRA did their job. Because honestly, the only two chicks that have ever helped me pursue this endevor, and help me push on, were Sasha and Jen. I have never been helped by any other women in the MRA.

So you guys decide.......

PS. My name on MRA is TerriRomaneschi. And if you want to use my words...you may if you so choose.

I think you are lumping everyone in the MRA as CSC bashers. That is not the case. I have been a member of the CSC since 2002. While I do think some CSC members are just asshats. There are just as many if not more in the MRA. I see alot of MRA bashing on the CSC forums as well. In my opinion look at who is doing the bashing and decide what you want to believe.
I’m sorry you don’t think the rider reps are doing our jobs. I am happy to help you any time I can all you have to do is ask. I will gladly help even though I am not a woman.

I think the main goal for the MRA right now is to make it through this year.

Getting new racers will help, getting more spectators will help.
The big problem has been that we have around 270 racers that have purchased MRA race licenses this year but we are averaging about 90 racers per weekend.

If you have ideas, questions or complaints please PM here or e mail me at hcr25@aol.com.

We are having an emergency board meeting to go over all these ideas this weekend.

mike MRA #25

[64BonnieLass]

I just wish there wasn't so much of a disconnect between the two. I think both are good for each other in a variety of ways. It's really all about people helping each other.

I appreciate your post. I generalized, and should not have. Thank you for that Mike.

[asp_125]

..The big problem has been that we have around 270 racers that have purchased MRA race licenses this year but we are averaging about 90 racers per weekend...

The problem then, as I see it, is not how to attract new members from CSC, but how to retain existing members or why they are staying away from the grid.

[rforsythe]

The purpose of the covers is to prevent the pavement from grinding though the stock covers and leaving a bunch of oil on the track.

That's the purpose, but I still maintain it's false hope in 99% of the crashes that happen, and probably all of the crashes that a slower newbie will be involved in since their bike just isn't going to slide on the line that far.

I like them personally because covers like the Woodcrafts have replaceable sliders, small expendable items that leave the rest of the cover still usable. That IMO is a much better reason to have them.

[hcr25]

Some good ideas Jim! The AMA did change the rule about case covers 2 years ago i think. They have been required since then. They had a couple of weekends where lowside crashes cuased leaks then mulitple bike crashes
Mike

From the AMA rule book, see leter G

1.6 Engines

a. Engine Displacement Measurement
i. Engine displacement shall be recorded in cubic centimeters.
ii. Displacement = B² (0.7854) HX; B= Cylinder bore; H= Stroke;
X= Number of cylinders (bore x bore x 0.7854 x stroke x
number of cylinders)
iii. If bore and stroke are in millimeters, divide end product by
1,000 to convert to cubic centimeters (cc).
b. Engine displacements are listed under various class requirements.
Displacement limits are absolute. There are no overbore
allowances.
c. Supercharging and turbocharging are not permitted.
d. Safety wire used to secure required items must be a minimum
diameter of .024 inches.
e. Coolant must not contain ethylene glycol.
f. All motorcycles must be driven by rear wheel transmitted power
only.
g. Original equipment engine side covers on certain models must be
replaced with covers or a case guard designed specifically to
improve resistance to breaking and grind-through in the event of a
crash. Replacement covers must be made of cast or machined
aluminum. Guards must be made of cast, stamped or machined
aluminum, or approved carbon fiber items listed on the eligible
equipment list. If a case guard is used it must mount over the

original case cover using a minimum of two of the original case.

[hcr25]

The problem then, as I see it, is not how to attract new members from CSC, but how to retain existing members or why they are staying away from the grid.

That is exactly what we are trying to figure out. There are couple of threads on the MRA forum asking racers the reasons they are not racing.

Side note the SMRI in New Mexico is in the same situation and the grids for the Masters of the Mountain series in Utah is down 25% this year.
Mike

[rforsythe]

The problem then, as I see it, is not how to attract new members from CSC, but how to retain existing members or why they are staying away from the grid.

I imagine it went something like this...
(before the class) "This looks fun... I think I'll take a class!"
(after the class) "That was awesome! It costs me HOW much just to play? Fuuuuuck..."

Bueller's personal resentments aside, he's right about hooking them with a sample of the Heroin. Drug dealers have figured out how to get broke people to pay for expensive shit for decades -- you let them try it and get hooked real cheap at first.

The requirements for slow n00b's to try it out need to be relaxed if the MRA ever hopes to hook them at this point, because the cost of going full out is way too high for someone if they just want to give it a shot and see if they like it. Not all n00b's will convert to full racers, but some will, and they will bring friends.

Yeah, it means some bikes we ourselves wouldn't race will actually turn laps on our sacred ground (gasp). It might just also mean that we still have sacred ground to race on in the first place.

[rforsythe]

That is exactly what we are trying to figure out. There are couple of threads on the MRA forum asking racers the reasons they are not racing.

While that's good, I think that may be the wrong audience. Try asking new racers or wannabes why they aren't coming out to play.

The MRA has always been primarily focused on bringing back the existing members, which is good, but IMO not focused enough on recruiting new blood. That mentality is finally reaching critical mass (or lack thereof).

[hcr25]

While that's good, I think that may be the wrong audience. Try asking new racers or wannabes why they aren't coming out to play.

The MRA has always been primarily focused on bringing back the existing members, which is good, but IMO not focused enough on recruiting new blood. That mentality is finally reaching critical mass (or lack thereof).

Not exactly true, we had over 70 people take the race school. A few were licenesed racers but most were not and they bought licenses but have not come out to race.

Its is up to all of the MRA members to help promote and build the club, get new members and try to bring back the old ones.

We are trying to do both, asking old and new. Many of the newly licensed racers this year have not done one race yet. We are looking at ways to get new racers on the track with minimum tech requirments and keeping the inital costs down. It is really much more then just that though. Right now im sure there are a few that would race this year if we can get this streetbike class going. Will be enough to save the season? Not on its own but i could help for sure.